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Old Jun 14, 2009, 11:39 AM
Use the 4S Luke
feathermerchant's Avatar
USA, TX, Euless
Joined Aug 2003
9,341 Posts
That picture is looking twords the rear, correct?
I have my 6S 4,000 pack is much further forward to get CG.
To evaluate CG, trim for level flight at about 1/2 throttle and roll inverted. If it climbs you're tail heavy.
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Old Jun 14, 2009, 05:00 PM
Where did Steve go ?
Alexandra
Joined Jul 2007
3,309 Posts
Yeap looking from the front. She flies fine with the pack here but I want to play around and see what I can make her do when I go to 6s. Now I have a factory number for COG I will remeasure tonight and see where my cog is compared to the factory specs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by feathermerchant
That picture is looking twords the rear, correct?
I have my 6S 4,000 pack is much further forward to get CG.
To evaluate CG, trim for level flight at about 1/2 throttle and roll inverted. If it climbs you're tail heavy.
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Old Jun 14, 2009, 05:11 PM
Use the 4S Luke
feathermerchant's Avatar
USA, TX, Euless
Joined Aug 2003
9,341 Posts
I put narrow strips of masking tape on the bottom of the upper wing to mark CG. Then I can find them by feel and check CG at the field.
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Old Jun 17, 2009, 07:42 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Cedar
Joined Apr 2007
37 Posts
ready to go.

here it is, ready for test flight soon, scorpion 4025-16, ztw 85 esc, hyperion g3 6 cell 4200mah, cc ubec , servos get 6 volts, hitec digital servos, xoar 18x12 wood prop, watt meter read 1155 watts at 55amps,8.40 lbs
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Old Jun 20, 2009, 12:39 AM
ramovan's Avatar
United States, NV, Pahrump
Joined Aug 2004
853 Posts
Here's my Samson II 70e with Scorpion 4025-12, 6S 25C 3300mah lipo, Xoar 17x8 electric beechwood prop. Measured 1200 watts / 58A exactly on Emeter2. I had a successful maiden flight today, but I really took it easy. Mine came in at 7lb 14oz (below spec for a change!) but I will likely upgrade the lipo to a G3 6S 4200mah. Wing loading felt very light and it cruised level at 25% throttle. Never did make it past 75% throttle during the flight. Seems to have a very broad performance envelope. It flies slows but gets up and moves when you want it to. I'm looking forward to getting a bit more agressive with it after I get over how pretty she is and get more used to the plane.
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 08:22 AM
Xtreme Nut
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Joined Oct 2005
2,046 Posts
You guys are throwing big props for this plane. I wonder if my AXI 4130/16 can do it on 5S. Should be okay right?
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 09:50 AM
All electric, all the time!
QuietRCFly's Avatar
USA, WA, Bellevue
Joined Aug 2005
1,430 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by tIANcI
You guys are throwing big props for this plane. I wonder if my AXI 4130/16 can do it on 5S. Should be okay right?
I think it will fly it OK, but you won't get awesome 3d perfromance. In AXI, the 5320/18 on 6S would be the rough equivalent to the Hyperion in performance.

Chris

Quiet RC Flying
www.quietrcflying.com
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 05:58 PM
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Joined Sep 2008
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That's one very nice looking plane. I know it's scale, but it's advertised as a 3D monster. Can anyone comment on its 3D capability OK/Good/Brilliant with regards to hovering, harriers etc? Review said it knife edges, tumbles, and flat spins good.

Yergs
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 06:03 PM
ramovan's Avatar
United States, NV, Pahrump
Joined Aug 2004
853 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by tIANcI
You guys are throwing big props for this plane. I wonder if my AXI 4130/16 can do it on 5S. Should be okay right?
Actually according to the Scorpion brand comparison chart the AXI 4130/16 just happens to be the most eqivalent to the Scorpion 4025-16 (or Hyperion 4025-16). You should get great performance if you can use a 6S lipo. You might be able to do OK on a 5S lipo but you'd likely need to use an even larger prop. It would be better if you could add a 2-cell lipo in series to get up to 7S with a 17" prop or something. I'd look at some AXI prop recommendations to see what what might work well on 5S - 7S.

Comparison Chart
http://innov8tivedesigns.com/Scorpio...ison%20Web.htm
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 06:08 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Cedar
Joined Apr 2007
37 Posts
samson

I would go with a 6 cell for the most performace, 5 cell for sport flying, will let you no on 3d. taking to our airshow and will have several top pilots ring it out..... I always use a watt meter no mater what set up i use, you can fine tune it so easy buy the info you get from it,,,,,,
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 07:58 PM
Use the 4S Luke
feathermerchant's Avatar
USA, TX, Euless
Joined Aug 2003
9,341 Posts
Biplanes have certain characteristics that are pretty anti-3d so to speak. That being said this thing tumbles well and will parachute. Upright harriers must be flown to remove wing rock (for me anyway). KE is easily mixable and on my most recent flight I managed a KE loop.
But this is such a pretty scale ship, it's sacrilege to fly it any other way. I loke the 16 turn 4025 on a 17X10 on 6S the best so far.
FWIW the Eflite Power 60 isalso a good choice but keep it to a 16X8 on 6S and it's gonna be pretty fast for scale.
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 09:43 PM
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Joined Sep 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by feathermerchant
Biplanes have certain characteristics that are pretty anti-3d so to speak. That being said this thing tumbles well and will parachute. Upright harriers must be flown to remove wing rock (for me anyway). KE is easily mixable and on my most recent flight I managed a KE loop.
But this is such a pretty scale ship, it's sacrilege to fly it any other way. I loke the 16 turn 4025 on a 17X10 on 6S the best so far.
FWIW the Eflite Power 60 isalso a good choice but keep it to a 16X8 on 6S and it's gonna be pretty fast for scale.

Hi Feathermerchant,

Try moving CoG forward (not back as the general recommendation for 3D flying would suggest), made a big difference for me with regard to harriers and wing-rock (ie harriers became much more stable). Also greatly improved every other maneuver for that matter.

It may be sacrilege doing 3D flying with this classic looking ship, but I don't have enough time and $$$$ to have a different ship for every occasion. I like flying 3D, and if the ship looks the part (as this one definitely does), then all the better! This way you get best of both worlds. You can fly scale, and when no one is looking, throw in some quick 3D stuff - ha ha ha!!

Thanks,

Yergs
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 09:45 PM
All electric, all the time!
QuietRCFly's Avatar
USA, WA, Bellevue
Joined Aug 2005
1,430 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramovan
Actually according to the Scorpion brand comparison chart the AXI 4130/16 just happens to be the most eqivalent to the Scorpion 4025-16 (or Hyperion 4025-16). You should get great performance if you can use a 6S lipo. You might be able to do OK on a 5S lipo but you'd likely need to use an even larger prop. It would be better if you could add a 2-cell lipo in series to get up to 7S with a 17" prop or something. I'd look at some AXI prop recommendations to see what what might work well on 5S - 7S.

Comparison Chart
http://innov8tivedesigns.com/Scorpio...ison%20Web.htm
Well I was just going off of AXI's website. The new ZS4025-16 from Hyperion has alot more power than the old Z4025 motor. The high sustained range for the AXI is 40 amps and you are not going to produce 1200w on that motor with 40a. The 5320/10, according to their website will do 1210w on 6S pack with a 17x10e prop. The Hyperion is 79g lighter. I do believe the Scorpion would be fine and is actually lighter. I would pair it with a 18x12e for some awesome power in a lighter package.

The AXI 4130-16 will fly it, but likely more scale like than 3d, which may be just fine for him. I just don't think you will have that wwwhoooooo! power that many guys like to have.

Just to cover myself, I am not an AXI dealer and have very littly knowledge of AXI products. Just using info on their website. Maybe you can push that motor just fine. I just can't recommend it based on the stats provided.

I prefer either the Hyperion or Scorpion. The Scorpion is a little lighter and cheaper for guys who want to go that route.

Chris

Quiet RC Flying
www.quietrcflying.com
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Old Jun 23, 2009, 11:50 PM
Xtreme Nut
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Joined Oct 2005
2,046 Posts
I got a 4130/16 and I fly 5S, not keen to go with 6S as I will have too many packs. Thinking about it again, I suspect that the 4130/16 on 5S will need something like a 17x10 at the least and it will be sport flying only.

As it is I have like 12 5S packs, hehehehehehee ... For me this plane is lovely for scale and not for 3S. Aaarrggghhh ... I am itching to pick her up today.
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Old Jun 25, 2009, 08:04 PM
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Joined Sep 2008
33 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by NipponDave
We're considering a "30e" version of Samson2, but it would likely be 12 months or more before ready for sale, if we decide to do it.

Oracle Challenger is still on the table. We'll see how the Samson and Vipers sell and make a decision later on that.

Cheers,

David
How about one of these beauties designed around a 2,200mAh 3S lipo, AND designed primarily with 3D in mind? Nah, bad idea, everybody would want one, or even worse, everyone will have one!
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