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Old Mar 03, 2009, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cybernaught
Hey Bob,

It's 5am and i'm on Coffee #2. Waiting for it to get light so I can try Tuffy's mods out. There is a short bamboo skid but I think it's more for show than function. We are going to the provincial capital today for shopping and some banking business. If I get in a decent flight beforehand and a reasonable video I'll put it on my memory stick and upload from the Cybercafe in Tagbilaran. I wan't to put some bamboo skewers on the nose to reinforce it and a bit of fiberglass reinforced tape too. I'll do a test flight first though just in case I need mods.

Are you familiar with the FC 2822 motor? I have two of them and they may be more powerful that the 2408-21 i'm using now. I wan't to try one on the Tuffy and I'll put the LG back on after testing when I use it for a AP platform, if that works out.

Do you have any pictures of your Tuffy? I seem to be the only one posting on this thread?

Thanks for the comments and enouragement. Once I get her stable and have a few flights under my belt I'll take her up in the wind a bit too. KFm2 wings seem to penetrate pretty well.
Steve
Steve ... I'm not familiar with the FC2822 but the Tuffy will handle the extra weight and power with no problem. All the pictures at the beginning of the thread and the other pictures are either the prototype Tuffy, the third one, or yours. No others have posted yet, although I know there are a couple of others under construction.

Here is a little mod I made this morning antcipating a snow storm that is supposed to come through here this afternoon. Keep the video coming. Bob
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 03:47 PM
Geaux Saints
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Grafton, Il
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Cybernaught

Great video.
Looks like a hand full but you managed to stay with her.

Mike
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 07:02 PM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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Steve,

That FC 28-22 Brushless Outrunner 1200kv looks like a good motor:

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...idProduct=5354

1200 Kv, 39 grams and 14.5 Amps max sounds about right. With a 3S at 10 Volts it will give you about 140 Watts at full throttle and that should be plenty.

That sort of swooping may be from your over controlling it a little. You might look at the incidence angle between the horizonal stab and the bottom of the wing. It should be zero or only very slightly higher at the leading edge. If there is too much or there is negative incidence, put a shim under the leading or trailing end to make the bottom of the wing and the hstab level with each other.

I need a Tuffy. I've got two planes I haven't maidened yet, I might as well start on another...

Foamenator,

It is just me or does the Tuffy look like it could use a longer tail boom? Has that been experimented with any?

Jack
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 08:05 PM
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Quote: " It is just me or does the Tuffy look like it could use a longer tail boom? Has that been experimented with any? " Jack

Hey Jack.... As far as I know, Tony wasn't able to complete the plans for Tuffy before he had to take time off from his designing. I had the drawing posted here, so I used my IsiPlot to extrapolate the various dimensions based on the stated 42" wingspan. The way I've built it, it has a 42" wing span, overall length nose to tail is 33.5 ". The tailboom is 21" long and extends 14" aft of the rear of the fuse.

I haven't really thought about changing the boom. It is 1/2" in. sq. balsa and has survived three fuselages with no breaks so far. I just cut it out of the old fuses and glued it into the new one. Bob
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 08:38 PM
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Oshawa, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foamenator
Quote: " It is just me or does the Tuffy look like it could use a longer tail boom? Has that been experimented with any? " Jack

Hey Jack.... As far as I know, Tony wasn't able to complete the plans for Tuffy before he had to take time off from his designing. I had the drawing posted here, so I used my IsiPlot to extrapolate the various dimensions based on the stated 42" wingspan. The way I've built it, it has a 42" wing span, overall length nose to tail is 33.5 ". The tailboom is 21" long and extends 14" aft of the rear of the fuse.

Bob
Yes I did, I thought you had them. Want 'em?

Tony

PS: 21" is the correct dimension. Good guess!
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 08:39 PM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
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I was just curious.

I thought the boom looked a little short in the photos of Steve's build and looked at the plans again. It looks OK on the plans, it's probably just the photos there.

So this is still a work in progress to some extent I guess?

Jack
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 08:40 PM
Onward through the fog.
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Bohol Philippines
Joined Aug 2008
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Flight #3...

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackerbes
Steve,

That FC 28-22 Brushless Outrunner 1200kv looks like a good motor:

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/s...idProduct=5354

1200 Kv, 39 grams and 14.5 Amps max sounds about right. With a 3S at 10 Volts it will give you about 140 Watts at full throttle and that should be plenty.

That sort of swooping may be from your over controlling it a little. You might look at the incidence angle between the horizonal stab and the bottom of the wing. It should be zero or only very slightly higher at the leading edge. If there is too much or there is negative incidence, put a shim under the leading or trailing end to make the bottom of the wing and the hstab level with each other.

I need a Tuffy. I've got two planes I haven't maidened yet, I might as well start on another...

Foamenator,

It is just me or does the Tuffy look like it could use a longer tail boom? Has that been experimented with any?

Jack
Hey Jack,

I have had the motors for 3 days now and not tried a static test yet. The reviews on that motor seem pretty good and I seem to remember DaveReap commenting on it, but I may be mistaken about that, not sure. I think it's just a tad hotter than the 2408-21's.

Hey Bob, here's yer vid!:
RC: Tuffy Flight #3 (2 min 32 sec)


It went better today. Still not perfect but she handles a bit differently than anything I've flown before. Not bad, just different, maybe it's the pusher config. I don't know. I'm getting it under control. Sorry about the atrocious landing. The flight itself went well. I got near the coco tree that has eaten 3 of my previous planes and I guess it made me nervous and I "dumb-thumbed" it down. Repairs are made to the wing and tape reinforcement added to the nose. I think this will be a very forgiving plane.

I took out some of the throw on both the elevator and rudder. I think the balance is pretty close to right. When we get back from Tagbilaran I'll fly it again if the weather cooperates.

I think the boom length is OK. it seems short and the tail looks small but there's plenty of control there. my wing is bigger than your designed 42 incher. it's a 48 x 10 and the tail seems to throw the plane around fine. I think with ailerons this thing may be pretty aerobatic.

Mike, I did have problems in the previous vid. Either I'm getting things dialed in a bit more or I'm getting used to the new plane. It's coming together OK. Take off was hand launch and I had too much down trim. I got to the stick just in time. Once I had her going she was fine but touchy. I think I'm going to like this one.

Jack, I put the bottom of the wing and the horizontal stab in parallel with each other and the mean chord line gives the wing about 2 degrees of positive incidence that way. The KFm wings work well like that for me.

After I get used to Tuffy I want to put an aileron wing on her and then maybe go to a KFm4 winged flying plank twin boom pusher... That's a ways down the road from where I am at the moment though.

Steve.
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 08:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony65x55
Yes I did, I thought you had them. Want 'em?

Tony

PS: 21" is the correct dimension. Good guess!

Nothing like reading the instructions, my wife always tells me.

If you can send them I'll add them to the beginning of the thread.
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 09:04 PM
I'm not flying backwards!
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Oshawa, Canada
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They're on your email Bob.

Tony
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 09:12 PM
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Steve.... Great video. Nice flying under a beautiful sky.

I think you may be adding a little up elevator in your turns as would be normal with a tractor set up. With a pusher it is the opposite. Try no elevator or a touch of down, and the zoom should go away. She seems pretty quick to me, at least in the video.

Tuffy is a great aileron trainer. With both the original scrounged wing and the wing built to specs it flies great with or without ailerons so it will be easy to transition over. I had mine rigged for flaperons and it was great fun with good control and walking speed landings. I had to take that radio out to get ready for the Typhoon, so now I just have a basic four channel in it. Thanks again for the update and I look forward to the next one. Bob
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Old Mar 03, 2009, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony65x55
They're on your email Bob.

Tony
Great... What else do you have laying around there?
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Old Mar 04, 2009, 06:12 AM
Onward through the fog.
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Bohol Philippines
Joined Aug 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Foamenator
Steve.... Great video. Nice flying under a beautiful sky.

I think you may be adding a little up elevator in your turns as would be normal with a tractor set up. With a pusher it is the opposite. Try no elevator or a touch of down, and the zoom should go away. She seems pretty quick to me, at least in the video.

Tuffy is a great aileron trainer. With both the original scrounged wing and the wing built to specs it flies great with or without ailerons so it will be easy to transition over. I had mine rigged for flaperons and it was great fun with good control and walking speed landings. I had to take that radio out to get ready for the Typhoon, so now I just have a basic four channel in it. Thanks again for the update and I look forward to the next one. Bob
Hi again,

I think a KFm3 with flaperons would be a good transition wing for me. I'll play with the idea, but a KFm4 would be more interesting. Wouldn't it?

Pics below show what I have been up to and they kinda tell the story by themself. The KFm3 polyhedral wing is the other left-over BB wing I'm hoping for better lift than the KFm2 and the camera position balances things with the foam and bolt replica-cam is exactly the same weight and size for test purposes this does two things. It shoots over the wheels if I choose to use them as opposed to putting the camera under the wing on the CG and the whole interchangability of the the two wings give me a RET sport KFm2 throw about general purpose 19oz flyer and the KFm3 gives me a 22oz AP video plane. Two in one. There is a 60" x 10" flaperon KFm4 on the building board too.

There is no down angle to the camera position at this time. Level flight should put the horizon in the center vertically. Also no provision planned for still photography. This is all experimental. Just for grins and giggles.
Steve.
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Old Mar 04, 2009, 06:23 AM
Geaux Saints
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Grafton, Il
Joined Nov 2007
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Cybernaught

Good morning. 6:12AM. First cup of java on this end.
Doctors say I only get one.

Great pics of the camera mounting.
Get her all balanced she should take some great pictures.
Mike
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Old Mar 04, 2009, 06:30 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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"..Jack, I put the bottom of the wing and the horizontal stab in parallel with each other and the mean chord line gives the wing about 2 degrees of positive incidence that way. The KFm wings work well like that for me..."

If you think it needs any further adjustment or can't seem to quite get it right, you might try adding a shim or two, like 1/8th" at a time, under the back of the wing and see what the effect is. I was having trouble getting my second BB build trimmed out and flying level and getting the wing dead level by adding a shim under the back made a remarkable difference.

I think the effect of positive incidence or changing incidence is that it moves the lift forward and aft a little and it also changes what is going on there on the vortex at the step.

Jack
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Old Mar 04, 2009, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony65x55
They're on your email Bob.

Tony
Thanks Tony..... Did I mention it's great to have you back?

P.S. The complete set of plans for Tuffy are posted in Post #1.
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