HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Nov 16, 2012, 08:01 AM
Registered User
United States, MI, Romulus
Joined Nov 2012
13 Posts
Yes, all I did was disable the ailerons on the sim causing me to have to steer the plane with both thumbs while trying to control the speed at the same time. I'm actually impressed with how well I was able to do this, but glad to know that rudder can now go on the right. Thanks for all your help.
aphily8ed is offline Find More Posts by aphily8ed
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Nov 16, 2012, 10:27 AM
Redacted per NSA "suggestion"
dedStik's Avatar
United States, VA, Virginia Beach
Joined Feb 2012
5,442 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by aphily8ed View Post
I have been flying on a sim for some time now in anticipation of buying my first plane. I had the sim set up for 4 channel operation, and thought I was doing quite well with it. I am getting a lot of advice on here about starting with a 3 channel plane like the super cub, so I figured I should set up my sim for 3 channel. Boy was I in for a shock. I found it much harder to control the plane with a rudder as apposed to ailerons.

Now I wonder if I was piloting the plane "properly" while I was in 4 channel mode. I mostly never used the rudder except for taxiing. I found it extremely easy to make turns with just aileron and elevator control and pretty much not touch the rudder. With a little practice I am now able to perform a pretty decent turn with rudder and elevator, but it is still much more difficult than with 4 channel. I always thought 4 channel was something you aspired to only after learning 3 channel.

Do you guys turn your real planes with rudder and elevator, or do you turn them the way I did on the sim with ailerons and elevator?
I'm gonna take a guess that you left the rudder on the left stick? If that's the case and you've been flying right stick it will seem difficult to you. Most 3 channels I've flown had the rudder on the right stick instead of ailerons.
dedStik is online now Find More Posts by dedStik
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: More Confessions of a Smoker
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 11:05 AM
Registered User
United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
4,961 Posts
The BIG mistake here is thinking about rudder vs aileron in the first place. You should think about the right stick being the "direction" stick. The aircraft doesn't care what it uses to turn with, rudder on a 3 channel or aileron on a 4 channel. As long as the direction stick is on the right, you shouldn't either.
chucksolo69 is offline Find More Posts by chucksolo69
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 12:11 PM
Registered User
United States, UT, American Fork
Joined Oct 2012
37 Posts
Your unintended training may come in handy someday....

Quote:
Originally Posted by aphily8ed View Post
So on a real Tx is it common practice to put the rudder on the right stick with the elevator or is that not possible?
As already answered, yes. Put the rudder on the aileron channel and do your "driving" with the right stick. The big advantage with just 3 channels and a trainer's high wing is that the plane really want's to stay upright. Rolls are a lot of fun except for when they are un-intentional. Without the ailerons its pretty hard to get that plane to turn over.

Several years ago I was flying a gasser with ailerons and the aileron controls just quit working. The plane was flying farther and farther away from me and it was almost out of sight when my brain kicked in and I gave the left stick a nudge. I barely managed to get the plane back and on the ground. When I pulled the wing off I found that the aileron servo and pulled out of it's mount. Maybe that rudder practice will pay off....
bloviationator is offline Find More Posts by bloviationator
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 02:01 PM
Registered User
aurorae's Avatar
Joined Sep 2008
675 Posts
And someday you might want to do aerobatics (pattern or 3D), many of which require use of the rudder. So getting your left hand used to running a control isn't a bad thing.
aurorae is offline Find More Posts by aurorae
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 03:02 PM
Registered User
paxskipper's Avatar
Joined Sep 2011
26 Posts
Consider an Apprentice as a trainer. 4 channel and flies nice and slow. You can do loops, rools and with some practice even inverted. It's a foamy, so you can abuse it somewhat without too much of a repair problem. I started on one and had well over 100 flights before I got a second plane.
paxskipper is offline Find More Posts by paxskipper
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 03:20 PM
Chef Pilot: Planes vs Butter
ChinoDiablo's Avatar
United States, VA, Hamilton
Joined Jul 2012
3,176 Posts
-aphily8ed
What kind of Transmitter are you using?
are you looking for a Ready-for-Receiver or a Ready-To-Fly complete package?
ChinoDiablo is offline Find More Posts by ChinoDiablo
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: RCG Plus Membership
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 03:31 PM
Rocket Programmer
jasmine2501's Avatar
United States, AZ, Mesa
Joined Jul 2007
25,419 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by aphily8ed View Post
So on a real Tx is it common practice to put the rudder on the right stick with the elevator or is that not possible?
IMO it's required. When it's your plane you can set it up any way you want - I've even seen people do things backwards (Lukas Riva for example, when he wants the helicopter to go up, he pushes down on the throttle stick - opposite from the way everyone else in the world does it, but the guy is a Pro)

The general consensus is that you "put the primary steering control on the right" and in a 3-channel plane, that is the rudder. If your 3-channel plane is well-behaved, it doesn't feel a whole lot different from flying with ailerons. However it is generally slower to react and less precise and that causes a training problem for some people. It made things harder for me, and I didn't really get the feel for what I was doing until I got a Stryker, which is a pusher jet, very fast and very precise. The Stryker is still one of my favorite planes.

Disabling the ailerons or not using them is not how you turn a plane 3-channel, and I suspect that's the other issue you might have had. A 3-channel plane needs to be specifically designed to turn with the rudder, and most 4-channel planes can not be turned very well with rudder only. Try a proper 3-channel plane like a Champ, Slow Stick, or Easy Star, and you should see the difference - these planes will bank-n-yank with rudder only, but something like a Nexstar/Alpha or Apprentice won't fly well that way.
jasmine2501 is offline Find More Posts by jasmine2501
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 04:01 PM
Registered User
United States, MI, Romulus
Joined Nov 2012
13 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChinoDiablo View Post
-aphily8ed
What kind of Transmitter are you using?
are you looking for a Ready-for-Receiver or a Ready-To-Fly complete package?
I don't have a transmitter so I would need a RTF. I am using a Dynam simmulator and FMS software.
aphily8ed is offline Find More Posts by aphily8ed
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 04:31 PM
Chef Pilot: Planes vs Butter
ChinoDiablo's Avatar
United States, VA, Hamilton
Joined Jul 2012
3,176 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
IMO it's required. When it's your plane you can set it up any way you want - I've even seen people do things backwards (Lukas Riva for example, when he wants the helicopter to go up, he pushes down on the throttle stick - opposite from the way everyone else in the world does it, but the guy is a Pro)
And one of the best of examples of not following convention is Jimi Hendrix.
Right handed Fender Stratacastor strung left handed and upside down. But then again, Jimi was a guitar genius unlike the rest of us hackers.
Bluesman Albert King also played right handed guitars upside down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
Disabling the ailerons or not using them is not how you turn a plane 3-channel, and I suspect that's the other issue you might have had. A 3-channel plane needs to be specifically designed to turn with the rudder, and most 4-channel planes can not be turned very well with rudder only. Try a proper 3-channel plane like a Champ, Slow Stick, or Easy Star, and you should see the difference - these planes will bank-n-yank with rudder only, but something like a Nexstar/Alpha or Apprentice won't fly well that way.
Well, I did just that with my Ares Gamma 370. I learned to fly with the stock plane which came with a non-aileron wing and subsequently upgraded to an aileron wing with less dihedral and narrower profile. I didn't activate the aileron servo right away as I felt I wasn't quite ready and so flew it 3 channel anyway just to get a feel for the new setup. 10 flights later and an hour on the Phoenix sim doing 4 channel flying, I hooked up the aileron servo.
No problems. I'm glad I did it that way. 75 flights later, its one of my favorite planes.

BTW, as I mentioned in my previous post, The Ares Gamma 370 is great plane and true bargain when compared to the pricing of the the Apprentice.
ChinoDiablo is offline Find More Posts by ChinoDiablo
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by ChinoDiablo; Nov 16, 2012 at 11:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 04:34 PM
Chef Pilot: Planes vs Butter
ChinoDiablo's Avatar
United States, VA, Hamilton
Joined Jul 2012
3,176 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by aphily8ed View Post
I don't have a transmitter so I would need a RTF. I am using a Dynam simmulator and FMS software.
DX6i or similar. You'll want/need expo and throw adjustments, model memory etc.
Don't waste your money on a DX5e. You'll quickly outgrow it.
Most RTF's have Transmitters that will not suit you as you grow in this hobby.
ChinoDiablo is offline Find More Posts by ChinoDiablo
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: RCG Plus Membership
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 04:50 PM
Rocket Programmer
jasmine2501's Avatar
United States, AZ, Mesa
Joined Jul 2007
25,419 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChinoDiablo View Post
Well, I did just that with my Ares Gamma 370. I learn to fly with the stock plane which came with a non-aileron wing and subsequently upgraded to an aileron wing with less dihedral and narrower profile.
It works on that plane because it's specifically designed so that works. A regular 4-channel trainer like the Nexstar or Apprentice won't work as well. It works, but it sucks.
jasmine2501 is offline Find More Posts by jasmine2501
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 04:58 PM
Chef Pilot: Planes vs Butter
ChinoDiablo's Avatar
United States, VA, Hamilton
Joined Jul 2012
3,176 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
It works on that plane because it's specifically designed so that works. A regular 4-channel trainer like the Nexstar or Apprentice won't work as well. It works, but it sucks.
The Gamma aileron wing was also not intended to be disabled/3 channel but it flew fine.
That was such a long time ago I barely remember it.
I just remember that it didn't suck.

can I say "suck" repeatedly on RCG or will I get banned?
ChinoDiablo is offline Find More Posts by ChinoDiablo
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: RCG Plus Membership
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 05:05 PM
Registered User
Canada, BC, Port Coquitlam
Joined Apr 2012
1,202 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChinoDiablo View Post
can I say "suck" repeatedly on RCG or will I get banned?
I think, and I hope, it will not get you banned, as long as you are only referring to radio controlled model airplanes. But to be safe, choose a better word next time.
easyrider604 is offline Find More Posts by easyrider604
Last edited by easyrider604; Nov 16, 2012 at 05:10 PM.
Reply With Quote
Old Nov 16, 2012, 05:21 PM
Chef Pilot: Planes vs Butter
ChinoDiablo's Avatar
United States, VA, Hamilton
Joined Jul 2012
3,176 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by easyrider604 View Post
I think, and I hope, it will not get you banned, as long as you are only referring to radio controlled model airplanes. But to be safe, choose a better word next time.
How about "Blows?"
Shades of Mel Brooks are twirling in my head...
ChinoDiablo is offline Find More Posts by ChinoDiablo
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: RCG Plus Membership
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Discussion What am I missing here? AtGame7 Batteries and Chargers 3 Jul 22, 2012 07:09 PM
Help! What am I missing here?? c/f Multirotor Talk 2 Jun 03, 2012 11:46 PM
Question What am I missing? CastleLink with disabled BEC on ICE 100... Mike_Then Castle Creations 3 May 26, 2012 08:16 PM
Question $500 For an OS 10 FP ??? Am I missing something here ??? shooboy Engines 18 Mar 12, 2012 01:38 PM
Whoops! Help me, I'm stupid -- what am I missing here? Cziltang Brone Micro Helis 7 Apr 13, 2005 09:50 PM