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Old Aug 18, 2014, 09:09 PM
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I want to know the Mixer Editor in KK2.1 board control is the need to switch control?Or the airplane is at this condition continuously?
what is the function of Mixer Editor ?
Sorry for my English is poor.
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Old Aug 18, 2014, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Ran D. St. Clair View Post
It is difficult for me to understand your question. I think you might be asking about the role of the TX switch that selects between hover mode and fast forward flight mode. This switch drives the AUX input to the KK2 which is used in the KK2 to turn Self Level on or off. The self level mode is on for hover mode and Slow Forward Flight mode, and off for Fast Forward Flight Mode.

If this doesn't answer your question, you are going to need to get some local help from someone who speaks your language.
I want to know the Mixer Editor in KK2.1 board control is the need to switch control?Or the airplane is at this condition continuously?
what is the function of Mixer Editor ?
Sorry for my English is poor.
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Old Aug 19, 2014, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by lexi Y View Post
I want to know the Mixer Editor in KK2.1 board control is the need to switch control?Or the airplane is at this condition continuously?
what is the function of Mixer Editor ?
Sorry for my English is poor.
The Mixer editor is used to define a given output as the SUM of a number of inputs. For example, the left front motor, also known as motor #1, is driven by a number of inputs. The primary input is 100% throttle. The control inputs are -70% aileron, 70% elevator, and 100% rudder. Each of the 4 motors has these same inputs but the signs are reversed on some of the control inputs as necessary to get the correct control response.

If the above concept does not make sense to you then you need to get some help with understanding how a basic quad-copter works.

I am not assuming you are a beginner. Due to the language issues I can't tell what your experience level is. If you are a beginner then I suggest you gain some experience by building a basic quad-copter. Hopefully there are some pilots locally who can help you. There is only so much I can do via this forum, especially considering the language difficulties.
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Last edited by Ran D. St. Clair; Aug 19, 2014 at 09:41 AM.
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Old Aug 20, 2014, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Ran D. St. Clair View Post
When in hover mode, there is no airflow over the surfaces so the fact that they are moving has no impact on anything. There are times when you will be in hover mode where there will be airflow over the surfaces, in which case you want them to move. The bottom line is that it never hurts to move the control surfaces, and it sometimes helps, so just let them move.

The other side of the issue relating to the control of the motors in fast forward flight mode is more of a real issue. Fortunately, it turns out not to be a problem.

If for example, you apply left aileron, and the two right motors speed up, then it produces a left yaw, which is converted by the dihedral into left roll, which is what you wanted in the first place.

If for example, you apply left rudder then it speeds up two motors on the diagonal, and slows the other two down. Given the direction of propeller rotation specified in the build instructions, the net result is a slight left yaw, which is what you wanted in the first place.

If, for example, you apply up elevator, the two front motors speed up and the two rear motors slow down. The net result is virtually no impact in the forward flight mode.

In all three of these cases the net result is acceptable. It is not ideal, and there is a slight loss of efficiency, but it all works out just fine. If you wan't a more ideal solution then you need to use the OpenAero2-VTOL firmware, in which case you can program the motors so they are purely controlled by throttle when in fast forward flight. The difference between the two methods as seen by the pilot in actual flight is minimal.

I have flown the plane both ways and many other ways as well. You can either take my word for it, or you can figure out how to do what you want and then enjoy the process of learning how well your method works while flying the plane. I am giving you a working recipee. There are many viable options, some better than others. If you choose to do somethng different, come back here and let us all know how it worked out.
that means in the video to see the control surface did not move because you set the Dual rates?
Ran D. St. Clair's VTOL-Trainer (3 min 24 sec)
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Old Aug 20, 2014, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by lexi Y View Post
that means in the video to see the control surface did not move because you set the Dual rates?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyVF0...ature=youtu.be
The control surfaces are moving. You just can't see them move due to the quality of the video. There is no "dual rates" set up in the TX for this aircraft.

It is not advisable to use dual rates in aircraft that use a flight controller because it can cause problems with arming the flight controller. The flight controller needs full low throttle and full right rudder to arm. If you are on low rates for rudder the rudder input will not be seen as full right rudder and the board will not arm.

If by "dual rates" you mean the flap switch that controls hover mode, slow forward flight mode, and fast forward flight mode, it does not turn off or reduce the control surface movement either.
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Old Aug 26, 2014, 09:16 AM
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I used the kk board to fly the aircraft ,and found the moving of control surface has big influences to quad-copter when it in hover mode.
I try to flash OpenAero firmware,but I don't know which edition is I really want.
And I don't know how to realize the following two points:①in hover mode,the aircraft only a matter of quad-copter, the control surfaces don't moving with TX;②in SFF model,the four motor straight throttle control.
I'm using this kind of aircraft.
Flite Test - X-19 Humming Bird - REVIEW (2 min 14 sec)
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Old Aug 26, 2014, 10:06 AM
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You should probably continue this discussion in the OpenAero2-VTOL thread located here:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1972686

The firmware can be found at the end of the first post in that thread. I suggest you use Beta 45 as it has been out for some time now and seems stable enough.

The most important thing you need to do is read the user manual located at the end of the first post in that thread.

OpenAero2-VTOL is certainly capable of turning off the aerodynamic control surfaces when in hover mode. I still think it is a bad idea, but you can do what you want. The X-19 is a different configuration from the VTOL Trainer and there will be some airflow over some of the control surfaces even when hovering, so turning them off will have some impact, be it good or bad.

Programming the control surfaces to not move in P1 (hover mode) is pretty simple. Just make sure the elevator, rudder, and aileron input volumes in P1 are set to zero for those specific outputs.

Be warned, in transitional modes, like Slow Forward Flight, where you are something like 30% from hover and 70% from fast forward flight, then you will have 70% of your hover (P1) control scheme and 30% of your Fast Forward Flight (P2) control scheme in force. If, for example, the ailerons are set to 0% in P1 and 100% in P2, and you are at 30% of transition, then the aileron movement will only be 30% of what it would be in P2. To put it simply, it is a linear translation between the P1 and P2 control scheme.
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Old Aug 26, 2014, 08:12 PM
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I'm sorry to write wrong, it's FFF not SFF .My friends told me the moving of control surface has big influences to X-19 when in hover mode,so why you think turning off the aerodynamic control surfaces is a bad idea?The motor is too near the control surface.
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Last edited by lexi Y; Aug 26, 2014 at 10:07 PM.
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Old Aug 27, 2014, 09:05 AM
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Originally Posted by lexi Y View Post
I'm sorry to write wrong, it's FFF not SFF .My friends told me the moving of control surface has big influences to X-19 when in hover mode,so why you think turning off the aerodynamic control surfaces is a bad idea?The motor is too near the control surface.
I believe I have answered that question several times now. I suggest you do what you want and let us know how it works for you.
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Old Aug 28, 2014, 09:28 AM
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I have already flash OpenAeroVTOL_2_1_B45 firmware in kk2.1. I have some confusion about it.
I want to ask how to realize quad-copter in openAero,in other words,how to set up in the board?
I didn't see channel in the menu.Is it set in the Out Mixer?
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Old Aug 28, 2014, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by lexi Y View Post
I have already flash OpenAeroVTOL_2_1_B45 firmware in kk2.1. I have some confusion about it.
I want to ask how to realize quad-copter in openAero,in other words,how to set up in the board?
I didn't see channel in the menu.Is it set in the Out Mixer?
If by "channel" you mean the various inputs from the TX like rudder, elevator, aileron, throttle, etc. then yes, they are selected in the Output Mixer menu.

I suggest you read the extensive user manual available at the end of the first post in this thread:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1972686

I also suggest you ask any further questions related to the OpenAero2-VTOL firmware in that thread since that is what it is for, and also since you are not building a Simple-VTOL (VTOL-Bixler) your questions really have nothing to do with this thread.
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