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Old Oct 06, 2013, 02:48 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Build Log
Monocoupe 90/110 - By a new to electric guy.

Hello guys.

I have been onboard RCgroups for a long time watching, listening, learning, and helping when I could... and modeling for a long time. But never the twain have met (metaphorically) with a build log.

There is a good reason. I have not built much of anything in years. So, I figured since I was getting back into things, now might be a good time to post something.

One problem though. I have never done an electric nor have I used the new 2.4 radio gear. But I am hoping with a bit of help from the community here I can muddle through somehow. The gear I used most was the little Cannon minis and a ACE kit I built along with some Kraft gear (last two were both single sticks) . Sadly outdated now. Almost everything I built RC wise could be powered by a glow or diesel .15 or less.

My interests are in scale and small fliers, be it the Schoolyard Scale variety (RIP Ken Willard) like this Monocoupe or seeing some of the museum grade examples shown here from time to time. But my stuff will be in the "smallish" category. I call'em my "1000mm Air Force".

This little plane is a 40 incher. Fits right in.

I am starting out with an old favorite that is not modeled as often as I would think. The Monocoupe 90/110 series. You see a zllion Cubs or Taylors to every Monocoupe. Wonder why?

Anyway, I bought a kit from Easy Built Models http://www.easybuiltmodels.com/ and thought I would ramble along through it. That is, if folks here think it is interesting enough to bother with.

I am a slow builder because my pleasure is in the building more than the flying. I literally give away almost all my planes after they are built and flown. So if you love the guys here that can magically produce a beautiful scale model in a weekend (and there are a LOT of them here ) then this will not be the thread for you.

Here are a couple of starter photos to get going. Meanwhile I have to go out back and plant a balsa tree. (I told you I was slow).

First impressions will follow. There is already an "uh oh" moment.

Tom
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Old Oct 06, 2013, 06:07 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
More unboxing stuff

Here are a few shots of some of the included parts/wood and other stuff.

Not all was well though, as you will see later.

The printwood as a whole, however, was surprisingly good. Much better than the old Guillows stuff. We didn't even call that stuff "balsa", just "Guillowswood".

Speaking of printwood. I enjoy the building part of modeling and do not mind printwood. As a matter of fact, I MUCH prefer it to the old die crushing that was common in kits my youth.

Not everyone likes it as much as I do though. My son, for example, would much rather have a dentist drilling his teeth sans novocain than deal with printwood. I find it quite relaxing. Most people are probably between those extremes.

At the end of the day, the parts count for this kit is not very high. So even if you do not care for cutting out printwood kits, it still is not too bad.

Tom
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Old Oct 06, 2013, 07:22 PM
Neophyte hacker
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Albuquerque, NM USA
Joined Sep 2003
15,759 Posts
Nice project. I like the monocouple.

I think you'll like the new radio gear. Don't hardly have to worry about interference, wire touching each other and big ant hanging out the back. And with electric you can build much lighter cause you don't have to worry about the stresses of flipping an IC motor or the vibrations on the airframe.

Have fun
charlie
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Old Oct 06, 2013, 09:17 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Thanks Charlie.

I will have lots of questions as this trundles along. Gonna need some of you electric experts to give me a hand.

Tom
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Old Oct 06, 2013, 09:37 PM
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United States, TX
Joined Jun 2011
2,855 Posts
I have always enjoyed building more than flying too. But I do love to fly... As long as it flies well.
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Old Oct 06, 2013, 10:51 PM
Registered User
United States, IN, Hammond
Joined Jan 2013
652 Posts
I like the Monocoupe, too. You picked a nice size. Plenty of room to fit your gear in there.
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 03:25 AM
Registered User
Norfolk, England
Joined Sep 2001
7,732 Posts
I'll enjoy following along with this one, it will be interesting to see what you come up with. The only Easy Built kits I've seen were the big ones they did for electric power - although they were mostly really big rubber models.

Pete
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 07:12 AM
UMs & parkflyers... for now.
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United States, VA, Herndon
Joined Apr 2012
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Thanks for introducing me to "Easy Build" I shall have to look closer.

If you are a reading sort, here is where I learned my ABC with regard to electric power.
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31071

I helped me a great deal.
David
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 12:13 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Thanks for the encouragement guys. I will definitely be needing assistance as we go along here.

Tom

PS: David, Easy Built has been around for a LONG time. Changed hands a couple of times but still chugging along. There are a lot of things about this kit that are not really up to date with what is expected nowadays in high quality kits, but they appear to still be good value for the money for builders that are capable of solving the (many) little problems with the kits.

The kits are really inexpensive though so the investment is minimal and the enjoyment level high if problem solving and sticking little pieces of wood together are your interests.

The plans are, um, "basic" and you have to watch out for things like the cord being very slightly different between the right wing panel and the left as drawn.

But no worries there as I always scan the plans and make those corrections anyway.

I am afraid some of my posts are going to come across as being really negative toward the Easy Built folks and their kits but that is not my intent.
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 12:25 PM
Neophyte hacker
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Albuquerque, NM USA
Joined Sep 2003
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Had to go back and look. 40" size is in my favorite range of wingspans. Not too small and not too big

Weight usually isn't much of an issue either. The biggest problem will be balancing due to the short nose. Work to keep the tail light.

Plan on putting the battery in the cowl or, if there is room, vertical on the back of the firewall. 2s1600 or similar would work great. Pair it with a 2212 motor of around 1000kV and it should fly great. Or, if it comes out REALLY light then a smaller motor and battery.

And covering can be anything you like. Tissue, silkspan or even silk if you like. Or one of the more "modern" coverings. Solite (Coverite Microlite), Solarfilm, Parklite, etc.

charlie
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 01:15 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Building Board

Maybe a few housekeeping thoughts will be in order.

I use a magnetic building board. I dislike pins, although they are necessary for some parts of the construction process.

My board is very simple. And cheap.

It is a hollow core 24"x80" door from Lowe's and two sheets of 2ft.x3ft. 28 gauge sheet metal plates, also from Lowe's.

I did not want to get a larger door and cut it down because these mass produced doors are built like torsion boxes and I never know the internal spacing of the grid. Cutting into them usually means you have some unsupported voids causing problems. And because they are built as torsion boxes, they are usually VERY flat and true if you leave them as built.

When I picked up this door Lowe's had 6 on the rack. I looked at every one and they were all flat. Here is the door: http://www.lowes.com/pd_10690-77999-...3D1&facetInfo=

If that link gets garbled, search Lowe's for "ReliaBilt 24-in x 80-in Flush Lauan Hollow Core Non-Bored Interior Slab Door"

These little doors are only 26 bucks. They are non-bored (for door latch) which makes them perfect for us... no big hole to worry about.

A board this size is perfect for me because I build smaller models, although I think you could easily turn out some really large aircraft on it anyway.

The galvanized sheet metal is also from Lowe's http://www.lowes.com/pd_50186-85334-...7C1&facetInfo=

Once again, if the link is hosed search Lowe's for "IMPERIAL 24-in x 36-in GV Flat Sheet"

The metal sheets are attached to the door with spray adhesive. It gives me a nice dead flat metal 2ft.x6ft. surface when done, with a few inches of bare wood door protruding from the end not covered by metal. And the whole thing is light enough to pick up and move easily. I have seen some magnetic boards it would take a fork-lift to move and that is way too cumbersome for me. As far as magnetics go, this light sheet metal has more than enough mass and magnetic attraction to really make magnets stick. It is VERY hard to pull some of my rare-earth magnets off this board actually.

So for less than 50 bucks you have a nice building surface that is light and true. Works for me.

You can get some magnets cheap here : http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a...-MAGNET/1.html

But I have a variety of the things too numerous to list and gotten from a bunch of sources, including dead hard drives. The web is full of sources.

More to follow.

Tom
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 01:30 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by portablevcb View Post
Had to go back and look. 40" size is in my favorite range of wingspans. Not too small and not too big
Yep. That is why I call them my "1000mm Air Force". The size is just right for me.


Quote:
Weight usually isn't much of an issue either. The biggest problem will be balancing due to the short nose. Work to keep the tail light.
Yep. The Monocoupe has a bit shorter nose moment than its contemporaries. As a fan of smaller models, I have always been weight-conscious. I never used a gram scale in the past, but kept the construction techniques down to what was considered "very light" back in the day. Will do the same with this build but can now monitor the weight exactly.


Quote:
Plan on putting the battery in the cowl or, if there is room, vertical on the back of the firewall. 2s1600 or similar would work great. Pair it with a 2212 motor of around 1000kV and it should fly great. Or, if it comes out REALLY light then a smaller motor and battery.
This is exactly what I need... a bit of hand-holding on power options. I have not a clue as to how to correlate electrics to model power requirements now. This little bird would be probably be powered by a .09 or .15 diesel conversion by me back in the day. I don't know what that equates to in electrics, so your motor suggestion is most welcome. I do not know what the finished weight will be at this point, so I am just muddling along.

Quote:
And covering can be anything you like. Tissue, silkspan or even silk if you like. Or one of the more "modern" coverings. Solite (Coverite Microlite), Solarfilm, Parklite, etc.
It will probably be painted laminating film, popularly known as "Doculam" here. But then dress lining (polyspan) might be a good covering too. I will just have to see as I go along.

Whichever covering used, I will be painting the model. My favorite is airbrushed latex.

Tom
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 08:20 PM
Neophyte hacker
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Albuquerque, NM USA
Joined Sep 2003
15,759 Posts
Used doculam quite a bit, also with latex house paints. Good stuff, but, when I want to save weight I will use Coverite Microlite (Solite), Parklite or Coverite Coverlite (Litespan). Especially if I can find stuff in the color I want.

The 2212-13 is a good size for a 40", 20oz plane. If you build it lighter you could probably go with a 2208. But, the extra weight of the 2212 will probably help. You can always use a lower pitch prop if it is too much motor. There is also the TowerPro 2409-18 motor as well. It is usually called a "bell" motor and is in the same range as the 2212. EFlite 350 or 400 would do as well as many others.

Yep it is confusing. The nomenclature is not standard between mfg's. Basically the same "size" motor can be 'wound' for high speed and current or lower speed and current. The kV rating and max current tell you how the motor will perform. Higher kV means that the motor will perform best with a smaller dia or lower pitch prop.

It is difficult to compare electric and IC. Electric basically makes full thrust at startup rather than needing some take off run to get rpm and power up. So, a .5hp electric motor will seem to have way more thrust than a similar .5hp IC. It also means that the electric motors perform well at half or even 1/4 their rated power. I will still use the "standard" power to weight ratios to help pick a motor. I like 70-90W/lb for most of my planes.

Typically I use a bit more motor than I need and then adjust the prop and battery to give the performance I want. I have several planes with motors that are rated for double the power that I am flying them at.

charlie
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 10:14 PM
The Junk Man
Jacksonville, Florida
Joined Jul 2006
1,507 Posts
Thanks for the motor info Charlie. It appears that Hobby King are not carrying the TowerPro motors any longer though. The only place listing the 2212-13 is eBay. Cheap enough there... can get four of'em for 47 bucks delivered. They must be popular with the quad copter folks.

The 2409-18 is listed as "discontinued" at the few places I found it.

I'm with you on motor selection. A bit heavier motor is more useful than lead in the nose, and there is always the throttle. I would rather over-motor than under-motor.

I'll keep looking.

Tom

PS: Just bought the eBay ones.
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Old Oct 07, 2013, 10:24 PM
Registered User
United States, IN, Hammond
Joined Jan 2013
652 Posts
http://www.strongrcmotors.com/Motors.htm
Cheap, quick ship, nice guy.
3 watts per gram of motor weight has kept me in the ballpark.
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