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Old Jun 26, 2012, 02:01 PM
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Why attack free speech and ask for limits on money?

This is why...

Dem fundraising goal: 36.6 million
Dem actual receipts: 10 million

Dems cancel and move campaign kickoff
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 02:55 PM
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If you can't win the game, change the rules till you have a chance.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 03:21 PM
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You can have as much free speech as you can afford to buy.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Jim Thomerson View Post
You can have as much free speech as you can afford to buy.
Yep, and if you don't have money, you have no access. I guess it is in line with what the founding fathers wanted - only property owners could vote. Nowadays, it's only folks with money who can buy influence, the rest, the majority, have no money so effectively no voice.

By the people for the people my

Money ≠ Free Speech. Money = political clout, and if you don't have the first, you certainly don't have the latter.

I love the OP - it suggests that this money/free speech issue has only been around for the last month or so, brought up by those scurrilous lefties. Wasn't the original SC ruling is the mid seventies? This issue has been around at least that long.

Both parties are as bad as one another here, and neither have any interest in changing the status quo, there's too much money at stake.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 03:38 PM
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I dunno those occupy folks made alot of noise with little money. The TEA party did so as well.

Its just that those wtih the moneys can package and sell their product better.

Thing is right now the DNC is flailing both campaign and financially and are scared of the 'big stick'.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 03:49 PM
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If money is free speech then lack of money is lack of free speech. Only an idiot would equate free speech with money and buying elections.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 04:01 PM
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If money is free speech then lack of money is lack of free speech. Only an idiot would equate free speech with money and buying elections.
Prezactly! As I watch the TV ads, I keep thinking "Four more months of this?" The corporate disinformation campaign is succeeding, thanks mostly to Citizen's United, and our democracy is being pissed down the drain.

While I usually dislike what I hear from the Republicans, I'm getting just as tired of the Democrats, who at least ought to buy more ads and stop running the same ones over and over and over again. I see that bar chart (about Romney as governor) and I want to puke! Enough!
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 04:05 PM
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If money is free speech then lack of money is lack of free speech. Only an idiot would equate free speech with money and buying elections.
"Free speech" is the new canard, it has nothing to do with that and everything to do with massive amounts of money flowing into particular political campaigns from secret donors and corporations who no doubt want something in return for their sizable donations, and that is called political corruption.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by redhotpearl View Post
If money is free speech then lack of money is lack of free speech. Only an idiot would equate free speech with money and buying elections.
As I noted elsewhere if voters are incompetent to make choices they certainly are not qualified to vote at all.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 04:22 PM
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As I noted elsewhere if voters are incompetent to make choices they certainly are not qualified to vote at all.
And I guess you make the distinction as to who is competent and who isn't? Quite full of ourselves aren't we? All hail the almight Goat!
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 04:56 PM
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As I noted elsewhere if voters are incompetent to make choices they certainly are not qualified to vote at all.
That's not a decision you are empowered nor even competent to make.

There are likely many who feel the same about your qualifications to vote.

Who gets to decide who is and isn't "qualified"?

Your contention is not only beyond absurd but violates the basics of our constitution. Imagine that.....
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 05:03 PM
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And I guess you make the distinction as to who is competent and who isn't? Quite full of ourselves aren't we? All hail the almight Goat!
It is clear given history how we get to oligarchies and plutocracies. That should alarm most any reasonable American.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 05:10 PM
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That's not a decision you are empowered nor even competent to make.

There are likely many who feel the same about your qualifications to vote.

Who gets to decide who is and isn't "qualified"?

Your contention is not only beyond absurd but violates the basics of our constitution. Imagine that.....
If I'm not mistaken based on one of his posts, he also thinks he or anyone else can demand identification at a polling place.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 05:10 PM
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If I were to run for office, I would try to make a deal with my opponent. You can have all the competent votes, and I will take all the incompetent votes. The incompetent votes, if left alone, should be just random white noise and have no effect on outcomes. I think a lot of political advertising is directed at derandomizing the incompetent voters.
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Old Jun 26, 2012, 05:11 PM
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And I guess you make the distinction as to who is competent and who isn't? Quite full of ourselves aren't we? All hail the almight Goat!
I'm not the one claiming this. Those who claim elections are bought, are.
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