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Old Jan 27, 2002, 10:11 PM
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Paul Penney's Avatar
Ancaster, Ontario, Canada
Joined Nov 2000
2,526 Posts
DID the GWS motors work out to MR. lins standards in testing?

hello,

I ahve seen a LOT of people here spend a LOT of money on GWS motors for 1 flight and then they burn, even with stock recomended setup! the question is.... DID mr lin have frequent burnings in lab testing and go ahead with the product anyways? knowing what and what not they were capable of? this I ask you Mr. Lin, because If people are using these motors to spec, exacly why are they burning? I havent seen you actually answer this question directly, so would like to get it off my chest.

B6

P.S I have already burnt 3 motors in a row, and gave up on them there......
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Old Jan 27, 2002, 10:21 PM
Registered User
Alberta, Canada
Joined Sep 2001
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I wonder if elevation and ambient air temperature play a role in this as perhaps they were tested in one environment, but used in another? Something that has a 5% failure rate in lab tests might easly jump up into a much higher failure rate if the air density and temperature vary a bit from tested. (Especially if the motors were close to "the edge" as tested, a small change in environment could result in a BIG change in motor longevity)
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 12:22 AM
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1987tc's Avatar
United States, OK, Weleetka
Joined Dec 2000
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Knock on wood........

I have several of these and have not had a failure yet. Never broke any of them in or oiled them either.

I do not fly around at full throttle all the time and only have used 6 and 7 cell packs. Used them on litesticks and TigerMoths.
No problems yet.
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 12:40 AM
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New York, NY
Joined Dec 2000
1,297 Posts
I don't know where you folks get your motors from, but I use the S1, DXA, and DXD mostly at full bore using 8-cell 300mah and 720mah NiMh cells. I have broken gear boxes and bent shafts but have not burned any motors yet. And at times that's with flying 4 to 5 packs straight. I haven't used any of the heat sinks either.

The only motors I have broken are a pair of the direct drives and only because I had them both hit the floor shaft first which popped the end bell.


Jun Nolasco
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Last edited by nolasco; Jan 28, 2002 at 12:43 AM.
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 01:08 AM
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Colonial Heights, Virginia, USA
Joined Mar 2001
1,710 Posts
I have no connections to GWS, but considering the IPS motor size, small internal clearances, the quantity made by an out-sourced supplier, advertised voltage range of 6.0 to 7.2 v (with the 7.2 v absolute max.) , relative to the total required equipment ( about $ 200 USA ) very inexpensive replacement $6 to $ 10 , I just keep 1/2 dozen spare motors on hand...in view that nothing else at that cost offers as much options of attached pinion ratios in a very adaptable , light weight and good-looking gear-box...Other than an expensive brushless ( with very limmited gear box ratios) when the IPS is working right it's awesom...If you look in-side the IPS at those micro-size brushes and com I'm thankful it works good as it does...After all , other than disposeable, brushes and com stuff is just old < 2000 year technology at this small size...I'm not sure (going to make some Scope tests)but I think there's a very big com and brush arcing and burning difference between a direct , constant battery supply ( 6.0 , 7.2 , 8.3 volts ) comparred to the usual higher ( 8 nimh cells throttled back with an ESC to a Measured lower voltage...a scope would probably show a variably short Full battery Burst voltage ( 8.3 ) in my case, at any on throttle setting...the brushes never really " seeing " a lower voltage...burning the brushes more than you would think at the cruising throttle settings... If I go to a BL motor ' I'm going to retain the gear-box and props to keep the luxury of the widest ratios and prop diam- pitch offered by GWS over any other company........just my 2 cts ....kw
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 01:31 AM
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Homer Glen, Illinois, United States
Joined Sep 2001
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GWS Motors

I have to throw in my $.02 worth here. I have been using the DX-A motors for about 1 year now. I have five of them in various airplanes. Other than doing damage from crashes where I have bent a shaft or cracked a gear drive I have not had any failures. I fly with a group of guys where there are probably 30 DX-A's flying and have only seen one motor malfunction. We are all using the GWS 10-4.7 props and 7 cell 300ma NIMH batteries from Radical R/C with a very small failure rate. I can't pinpoint a cause for the problems others are having but I do feel that for the number of GWS products that are in use and the failure rate seems to be small that they are making a very good product. Maybe the cause of the failure is flying at full speed. We never do this. We throttle back as soon as we are airborn. I am also an advocate for using the heat sink from GWS. As I said earlier " They work for me".
Please excuse my being so long winded. I appologize for it.
T-6
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 02:19 AM
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At the Discount Clambake
Joined Feb 2001
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Ok More stuff to consider

My second oldest motor with about 30 flights on it, ~7 minutes
just perished. This motor was one that had been used for a birdworks BUD that was flown in my yard. It had also had its mounting bolts pulled on the chance that it would run cooler , (bleriots and others suggestions) Unfortunately it found it's way into a gopher mound and ingested some dirt. Now I disasembled it, cleaned it out with 70% isopropyl alcohol, got some dirt out of it, and retired it some days of use after I got the S-1. Never been used except for my occaisional spinning of the shaft to see if was still free. While bench testing it tonight with no prop it started to get crunchy sounding. I stopped running it and it was turning free but making crunchy noises. Hmmm. I dunked it in some alcohol and after drying it, the motor got worse and stopped after a couple of minutes. There is a thin grey paste of magnet bits all jammed in it. I think that running these with the bolts off is bad for all the junk that might find its way in. I am rectifying this with all my motors now Unfortunately the S-1's are sold with all the bolts uncovered on the front. Should we carefully cover these openings.?? I think so!

Looee
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 02:27 AM
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Joined Aug 1999
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I think for what we pay for these motors, and the abuse we subject them too (like overvolts and constant use) we get good use from them.

If you go to high end coreless or BL motors they are sealed too. So getting air into them is of little benifit. If they cooling that bad, they would be made that way.

These little motors get more cooling from the area of the can surface, which is why the heatsink works so good.

I still have not burned up 1 motor, but time may tell too!!!!
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 09:44 AM
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Mackay Queensland Australia
Joined Sep 2001
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The problem is these motors arn't cheap in Australia as they can't be purchased without a gearbox. A motor/gearbox is $35 dollars or so I believe. Having half a dozen spares would cost us $210! I could get a nice brushless or cobalt for that!

If they made 1 million motors and 10,000 were bad that would be a 1% failure rate right? 1% sounds good but 10,000 bad motors doesn't!
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 11:23 AM
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Joined Feb 2001
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I just wanted to add that the comm' was perfect, three small furrows. The positive wiper was physically damaged and the negitive appears to have most of its thickness left. I used 6 cells exclusively on this one. Dirt is the enemy folks, the clearances within these motors is way tight. It seems that the ends of the wiper blades and the bits of worn off wiper and comm' have a lot to do with rapid internal wear on these dear gems. Funny that all the other cheap ferrites run for months and years with every thing hanging open in the airstream. Has anybody lost a sp400 to armature/comm binding 'cause of ingested boulders???


LOee
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 04:42 PM
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Mackay Queensland Australia
Joined Sep 2001
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I've had damage done to a 540 motor in an off road buggy. But that was running around in the dirt. The motor still goes fine, it's just chipped a bit.
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 08:10 PM
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Colonial Heights, Virginia, USA
Joined Mar 2001
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Sorry Vonbaron, I now see your point !!!!! I had no idea you had to buy only complete motor systems at $ 35 a pop (just a figure of speech).......that would put me over to a brushless....to much of a gamble even at 1 %.....how about a B-20 s 31 turn Hacker shoved into a gws 100 c gear-box....should last much longer with all those gws ratios and prop combos available......following electro-plating theory...one brush should get shorter while the other gets longer ?????.........kw
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Old Jan 28, 2002, 10:43 PM
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Chicagoland
Joined Feb 2000
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Has anyone tried timing their motors? I know they are fixed but has anyone actually done it?

Greg
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