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Old Dec 14, 2014, 06:38 PM
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Build Log
'Brisfish' - Peter Rake 1/7 Bristol F2b

About five or six years ago Peter Rake designed a 1/7 Bristol Fighter F2b. I built and flew the prototype which was described in a rather lengthy thread:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...116684&page=33

Just before moving house around two years ago, the Still-flying Brisfit was decommissioned and probably finished up hanging from someone's ceiling. I had removed anything that wouldn't be needed in its new life including wheels, exhausts, a few detail bits and anything that looked vaguely useful. Why? I purchased another kit from Manzano with the aim of producing a less detailed and maybe more rugged version of the aircraft. A small start was made a couple of years ago involving about a days work assembling some bits of the forward fuselage but it has lain in that state since. Gathering dust and spider droppings

As a break from the rather ambitious Avro Anson project, I've been working my way through the unfinished models I have in storage (don't ask about the unstarted ones) and with the big SPAD and the slightly smaller Lysander basically finished and awaiting the courage to fly, I dragged down the dusty Brisfit #2 kit to see if I was inspired. I had left comment on it at the finish of the first thread mostly discussing a suitable scheme. I have since decided that I rather like the painting part of modelling and have made my decision to do the infamous 'Brisfish' - a rather in-your-face post war scheme that I've not seen a large model of. Sperry did a small one many years ago. Sperry's build is here:
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...perry+brisfish
So here I am again, building the same kit as I did many years ago so I wont do an intense build guide - just a few highlights where I may have missed things before and maybe encourage someone else to build this great model!
Craig (Trumps) had a 1/7 Rake F2b well underway but seems to have slowed somewhat. I know how it feels!
Pat
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Old Dec 14, 2014, 07:05 PM
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Great Pat. I have one of these on the shelf and never felt I had the skill to start it. I look forward to watching your progress
Taylor
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Old Dec 14, 2014, 07:34 PM
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Pat
What is the wingspan of your 1/7 model?

I had no idea that old thread was still around. BTW my Brisfish didn't survive the maiden departure from and abrupt return to earth. Couldn't call it a flight.

sp
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Old Dec 14, 2014, 07:56 PM
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Taylor - if there are any 'stumbling block' that are inhibiting you from starting, let's know if I can help! It IS an easy build with only the centre sections and their alignment being a bit intimidating. I'll show a few more pictures in conjunction with what I did in the last thread - that may help.
Hi Sperry - 67" span I think the original weighed about 7lb or so. This time I'm not getting too fussed about internal detail but will try a few ideas about the essential look of the exterior such as lacing and panel work. I haven't sorted it all out my head yet but I'm treating it as a fun-build (not quite eligible for a build-off though!).
Solartex covering (never done that before) I'll try some better rib tapes than last time, plastic panel work instead of Litho etc etc.......

As a build 'starter', the rear and forward fuselage parts are laminated (Titebond) and along with the 1/4 sq. hard balsa longerons, form the basic fuselage sides. The uprights are of light 1/4 sq balsa. (I used Medium CA). About the only snag is the slots formed in the sides for the formers may need easing out to fit the '1/8' balsa formers - BEFORE laminating. Mine did. All the structure up to as shown in the photo is built over the plans with squares to get it right. CA mostly used but epoxy on the firewall and engine mount box. Btw - make sure the engine mount is assembled correctly for right/down thrust Most of this is shown in the first thread.
A square of FLAT 1/8 ply was marked out from the plans showing where the upper CS struts go - this was cut to be exactly the size of the whole CS underside wing mount area. The struts were bent from 3/32 wire EXACTLY to the plan, and fixed to the ply plate with 'P' clips bent up from thin brass. Two balsa panels were cut using the plan side-view as a guide and spot glued to the fuselage to get the ply plate at the correct angle and position - the ply plate was glued to these guides with the wire struts laying against the appropriate formers. They should now be in their required position. After binding with thin copper wire and with a dob of epoxy at each bind, the fuselage was inverted and the brass P-clips soldered to the cleaned wire struts. With the ply plate and the side-guides removed, the strut ends should be ready to support the CS at its correct angle and position. Keep the ply plate as a drilling guide for the CS later.
Long-winded but working toward what you know is required should make it good
Pat
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Old Dec 14, 2014, 09:07 PM
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A Blast from the past.....

When I swapped from YouTube to Vimeo, I didn't change the link in the old Brisfit thread. So here it is. The 67" machine was good to fly - although it was a 'fighter' I had to take a little care trying throw it around the sky. I was not quite as responsive as an Se5a but was reasonably stable. The video was taken by a fixed camera on its second flight iirc. Not great, but proof of flight if not proof of landing skills
Pat
F2b Movie (1 min 14 sec)
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Old Dec 14, 2014, 10:29 PM
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Leaping ahead

After the CS struts were fixed in place, the forward fuselage was sheeted with 2.5mm balsa notched to clear the wire struts. The TWO centre sections were built over the plan and presented no problems. Mine was a very early kit of parts and the ply wing fixing plates under the top CS were too short so I made more from 1/8 ply (not lite). The holes from the ply template used to jig up the CS struts, were transferred to the top CS and the struts p-clips screwed in place.
I'm using socket head screws wherever possible in this model - they look far more 'professional' and in some areas, are much easier to work using a ball-end hex driver. The ones I'm using are mainly #2 servo mount screws from Great Planes.
The lower CS has two hardwood blocks with recesses to locate the bottom struts. The bottom struts are just made exactly as per the plan from 3/32 (12swg) wire.
The rear end of the fuselage is dead easy construction. The fuelage was fixed to the board using 1/4" ply UC mounting plate as a datum. The curved lower longerons were propped up while the upper and lower X-pieces were added. Main requirement is that the tailplane slot is parallel with the board and the sides are square and centred over the plan.
I'm going through this rather quickly so if anyone wants more on a specific point - just holler !
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 06:50 AM
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G'day Pat, great to see you building another one of these beauties, there is a good chance you will have this one finished before i get around to completing mine the last 2 years have been taken over by one of my old habits (building bikes) my Bristol is still sitting there half covered waiting patiently along with a couple of other builds for me to get my modeling mojo back!
will be interested to see what changes you make to this build, yhe original was an absolute masterpiece!

Craig
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 01:59 PM
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Difficult stuff done!

G'day Craig! Good to hear from you. I've never been a bike enthusiast - that's one more distraction I can avoid My current club in Goulburn - most of the older aero-modellers are/were also bike enthusiasts. I sometimes feel a bit left out of the conversations Now if I can tear myself away from the TV and the horrible events in Sydney, I'll get back to the Brisfish

The two centre-sections were supported in position the same way as last time - with two lite-ply jigs glued/screwed (lightly) to the outer ribs using the plan as a guide. The upper CS was screwed to its struts and the bent wire parts fitted in place under the fuselage. Their exact position was marked on the fuselage underside with brass P-clips for fixing and then everything was removed, holes drilled in the U/C plate and everything re-installed and checked for alignment. Drat - it was a tiny bit out tilted when lined up with the tailplane slot so a a couple of 1/32 ply spacers were fitted under one side of the top struts and sanded back until the error was fixed.

The lower struts were fixed into the wood mounting parts in the lower CS top and secured with metal uc mounting plates and servo screws. The servo screws have an integral washer and make a neat finish (although not entirely scale)

All this sounds very complicated and may scare people away but as before - study the plans, and at each step verify that what is being done will achieve the desired result, modify/correct/change methods and construction until it is exactly right. Enough sagely advice from an 'old fart'

A small change was made from my previous version - the openings in the lower CS were made about 1/4" (6mm) wider than the scale (and the plan). This allows the UC legs to be fabricated and soldered before being threaded through the lower CS.

The UC legs are just slightly awkward by being made up from 4 pieces each side. I bent up all the parts, installed the 3/16 brass tubes and P-clips across the fuselage underside and then soldered up the legs in situ. As always, clean and degrease all the bits, bind with copper wire (from stripped power cable) add flux (don't rely on flux-cored solder) then apply plenty of heat and a just enough solder to make a neat job. I used water-based flux, non-lead, silver bearing solder and an 80 watt Weller iron. No probs.

With the lower CS left loose, the UC legs were inserted through the CS into their tubes and when in place, the lower CS bolted to its struts.

Whew - lots of words - Pat
Pat
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 02:17 PM
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"Rest of the model is easy"? Yea right, until you get to that paint scheme!
How do you plan on doing it?
Glenn
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 02:34 PM
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I haven't really thought the method thru yet Glenn
I imagine it will be a mix of techniques - probably involving drawing lots of guidelines with water-soluble pencil, making up various simple card stencils to aid drawing the head and scales, and then with no tailplane or centre sections/uc fitted, sit down to some pleasant hand-painted 'artwork' - easy

From what I can see, the 'scales' are only fairly simple 'U' shaped marks in a cream, yellow, pale brown (not sure) - certainly simpler than a DVII's lozenges. The head area will need some care but it should be fun! Luckily, the rest of the aircraft seems 'normal'. But a long way to go before that can happen - all the front end panels, louvres etc has to fabricated first........
Pat
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 02:43 PM
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Pat
Thank you very much for the offer to help. I thing the wing attachment has me a little hesitant. I am going to get a few more bipes under my belt. I have several of Peters kits on the shelf waiting their turn. Thank you for posting this. I learn a lot from watching your builds
Taylor
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 03:33 PM
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Fair enough Taylor
As I see it, the main skills are building, bending and assembling exactly as the plan shows. In this model, I suspect that if all the wire parts are dead-right, and the parts assembled as shown then it will work! Add to that being able to solder a bunch of bits accurately also helps. Maybe one day we'll see a Cobra16 Brisfit
Pat
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 06:41 PM
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Well mate, I knew you liked to take the difficult route, but that colour scheme. On Solartex too? Maybe flashing lead would be a better idea for the nose panels, to counter the weight of the Solartex.

Pete
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 06:55 PM
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I love 'Biffs'! They are pretty awesome.
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Old Dec 15, 2014, 07:48 PM
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Pat
I have the 1/32 scale Wingnuts Wings F.2b. I ordered aftermarket Brisfish decals and got 2 sets. You are welcome to one of them for reference if you'd like. PM me your address and I will put them in the mail.

I got the markings for my smaller Brisfit from Callie. They went on great and quickly. I bet she could scale them up pretty easily.

I'm in the middle of 18 straight 12 hour shifts. Cuts into modeling time, but the overtime pay is obscene :-). I think a 1/7th F.2b kit is is gonna be high on the list of what to do with the extra money. Your description and photos of the center sections got me going. That was a major pain on the smaller one, but looks real dooable in the larger version. Enlarging the openings for the U/C struts was brilliant. I wished they were bigger when I built the smaller version.

sp
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