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Old Sep 18, 2014, 07:30 AM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Australia, WA, Perth
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More build, made the rotor blades (and a spare) these all came out of one sheet of balsa and have 1.5 mm piano wire at the front ... need the 0.8 fiberglass sheet to be able to finish them now

I decided to go with a rudder too

Lockey
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Last edited by Lockey; Sep 18, 2014 at 08:58 AM.
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Old Sep 18, 2014, 01:49 PM
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Very good choise to go with the rudder
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Old Sep 18, 2014, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Lockey View Post
I see that in the instructions for the CFL, Tom states that the model is for hand launch only ... is there any reason for this ? and will it actually take off from the ground as I am not a big fan of hand launching

Thanks

Lockey
Lockley

Great progress , its clear that you are indeed a proficient pilot and balsa basher but when it comes to first unassisted encounters with Auto gyros there can be a steep new learning curve when it comes to first flights. The advice from Chris and Paul is spot on ......thanks guys. As for the blade L/E wire or spruce can be used to suit your preference ,the blade design on this type of model is not super critical in terms of maximizing every ounce of lift but easy spin up in minimum wind makes can be a great aid during early attempts. Suspending or holding the fully equipped model at the rotor bolt should result in a nose down attitude of 10 -15 degrees ,this can be measured with a digital inclinometer like the "Wixey" which is readily available on line or mark one eye ball can often be quite sufficient for first flights. Lightly loaded models are often sweeter to fly at the lower end of the scale as I find nose drop in turns is reduced. The model should fly perfectly well by coordinating power roll and elevator ,this can reduce the work load in the early days but as the machine is mastered the rudder can enable a more sophisticated style of flying.
If you are really relaxed about using the rudder to balance turns and want to try ROG after some successful flights the do fit a rudder. Small amounts of lead can be used to bring the blade COG forward and to achieve lateral balance this is best located directly behind the L/E, the main thing is to get the weight and balance of each blade the same as a blades that vibrate will impede spin up time and create undue stresses.

Tom.
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Old Sep 18, 2014, 07:33 PM
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Lockley

While typing my last post you posted the latest build photos ......and I thought I was a fast builder ...... your progress is impressive .

If you have the fg delta plate the blades can be finished using suitable thicknesses of ply.

One tip before completing the airframe ......the 2mm roll servo mount former could do with beefing up to prevent blade strike loads causing fractures.

Picking up again on ROG ...the rotor must present at around 18 degrees to the airflow ,so its a matter of bending the U/C to achieve a fus angle of 10-12 degrees to level ground ( the rotor is already set back at around 8 degrees as determined by the mast angle).

Keep up the good work.

Tom.
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Old Sep 18, 2014, 07:43 PM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Thank for the replies, and help Tom

I decided to use the 1.5 mm wire for the front of the blades on this one, I will wait for the FG to arrive as I don't have the bearing or the delta plate either ... I ordered them all together and will make my own delta plate once it arrives

I have used ply for all my joints etc and am expecting it to be a little on the heavy side ... what would be the norm for weight on one of these ?

I also think I will take off the servos and move them back, I didn't much like the length of the push-rods as I was doing it ... weight wise and length and flex

I will double up the servo former to make it stronger and cap the top

Lockey
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Old Sep 18, 2014, 08:58 PM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Tom, reading your notes on both the SFH it says ... With the TX and RX switched ON (all trims at mid-point) the tri plate should be set 3 degrees to the left. (looking
from the back)
but I don't see this mentioned on the CFL notes ... should I set this 3 degrees ?

Also, should I use the same initial setup as used on the CFL ?

Lockey
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Old Sep 19, 2014, 07:00 AM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Did a little more today, didn't have any ball joints, but as it was only operating on a single axis I thought I would use a metal clevis one end and a Z bend the other

All electrics are in, just waiting for the bearing assembly and the FG sheet to finish her off

I see there was much discussion about the bearing assembly earlier in the thread, did anyone come up with a better idea or can someone please show me how to put the unit together as I can see maybe the bearings will bind ... I tried a damaged motor, removed the coil part (with great difficulty) and finished up with a similar thing to the bearing holder but I couldn't get it to run smooth once I tightened up the nut holding the head

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Old Sep 19, 2014, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Lockey View Post
Thank for the replies, and help Tom

I have used ply for all my joints etc and am expecting it to be a little on the heavy side ... what would be the norm for weight on one of these ?

I also think I will take off the servos and move them back, I didn't much like the length of the push-rods as I was doing it ... weight wise and length and flex

I will double up the servo former to make it stronger and cap the top

Lockey
Lockley

The ideal solution to the rudder / elevator servo positions is use the the 2mm extended floor as the mounting .Invert the servos so the arms are underneath then use 1.5 / 2mm piano wire passed through short tubes bonded to the underside of the boom , this also eliminates damaging the push rods if a blade boom strike occurs, you may then have to fabricate a rudder tiller arm if this method is used. My model is as per the original build guide and no problems or repairs to this area have been required, but I did use a 3mm carbon tube for the elevator push rod, no guides were necessary.
Just put my model on the scales without battery and it is showing 20 ozs.
The initial left trim setting will likely be different for each model , so I usually eye ball a couple of degrees to start with , and maiden over long grass from a hand launch , although these days after many hours of Auto gyro flying and now having the luxury of a decent smooth grass runway ROG is more the norm but! I would still suggest a hand launch for first timers as per the video kindly posted by Chris.

Tom.
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Old Sep 19, 2014, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lockey View Post
Did a little more today, didn't have any ball joints, but as it was only operating on a single axis I thought I would use a metal clevis one end and a Z bend the other

All electrics are in, just waiting for the bearing assembly and the FG sheet to finish her off

I see there was much discussion about the bearing assembly earlier in the thread, did anyone come up with a better idea or can someone please show me how to put the unit together as I can see maybe the bearings will bind ... I tried a damaged motor, removed the coil part (with great difficulty) and finished up with a similar thing to the bearing holder but I couldn't get it to run smooth once I tightened up the nut holding the head

Lockey
Lockley

If you have ordered two flanged bearings with the blue wonder mount its job done, don't worry about a little play as this will not effect the chances of initial success . A little vertical end float will also be required between the the bearing centers and rotor bolt. Precision locksmith engineering should not be needed at this stage lol but! the rotor must run up to speed without running into a howling gale

Tom.
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Old Sep 19, 2014, 07:39 PM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Again, thanks for your help and advice Tom

Long grass might be a problem and we are a long way from any hay or corn fields here in Perth ... long grass here on the parks would be about 3"

Oh well, you pays yea money and takes yea chances eh ... one north country lad to another

I will leave the push-rods for now and if need be, will change them later in the event of an accident (or crash )

Yes I did order the 2 flanged bearings with the mount

Lockey
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Old Yesterday, 03:11 AM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Almost finished, I decided not to wait for the FG for the rotor blades and used thin birch ply

had to add 2 grams of lead to 2 of the blades, can't imagine why as they were all from the same piece of balsa .. oh well

Blades weigh 20 grams each and with covering 23 grams, total 69 grams

All up weight with a 1500 / 3s battery is 644 grams (22.7 ounces), just got the bearing head to add on so I guess it will come in at a tad over 700 grams (24.7 ounces)

From memory, I seem to remember reading a post ... way back ... where Tom said that one of his came in at about 700 grams

Lockey
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Old Yesterday, 03:48 AM
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G'day Locky....great looking build.........one thing that you may wish to think about in future projects is being able to tell the top of the "wing " from the bottom as per fixed wing trainers. That nice looking checker is going to look pretty much the same from the top and the bottom.
With autogyros ,there is not a great wing to use as a reference point ..so I have found that the different colours on the disc are very important I usually go for a "bulls "eye on the top and a complete contrast on the underside . You will understand that a disc like this is very easy to pick up if the model is turning towards you or if you see a solid dark /light colour that it is turning away.
Nice build.
Chris...
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Old Yesterday, 04:59 AM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Quote:
Originally Posted by britinoz View Post
G'day Locky....great looking build.........one thing that you may wish to think about in future projects is being able to tell the top of the "wing " from the bottom as per fixed wing trainers. That nice looking checker is going to look pretty much the same from the top and the bottom.
With autogyros ,there is not a great wing to use as a reference point ..so I have found that the different colours on the disc are very important I usually go for a "bulls "eye on the top and a complete contrast on the underside . You will understand that a disc like this is very easy to pick up if the model is turning towards you or if you see a solid dark /light colour that it is turning away.
Nice build.
Chris...
Thanks Chris, I never gave it much thought as its my very first AG, yes I can see what you mean about the bulls eye ... should I recover the underside plain? ... maybe plain red

Lockey
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Old Yesterday, 07:04 PM
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I'm only making suggestions from the mistakes that I, and others have made. Unfortunately the loss of orientation can happen as soon as the model gets into the air and the first time pilot just won't have a clue what the model is doing. I can understand you would have thought that you had chosen a pretty eye catching colour scheme...and it is for the fuz and tail feathers....cos they ain't moving. If you look at the top of the blades ..you will see that one is a different alignment of the colours, so this will just look as if it is most likely an "orange' colour.
So I am not suggesting that you should change any thing....if you look at what I first wrote...I said" future projects." so its up to you ....just be very aware.
I think that when you see the model in flight ....you will then understand what I have been trying to draw to you attention. It happens very fast................
Chris...
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Old Today, 02:57 AM
Tony Audsley Retired Locksmith
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Australia, WA, Perth
Joined Sep 2011
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Decided to add a bit of black to the tips

Also made a sanding jig

Lockey
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