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Old Oct 05, 2012, 11:34 AM
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Again, what EV do you currently own? Is it your exclusive automobile?
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 11:49 AM
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Again, what EV do you currently own? Is it your exclusive automobile?
I don't, but not the point. My main point is that it's all doable right now if we want to, not that it's actually being done and readily available at the car dealerships. I'm not blind. Tesla is a unique case in that essentially full gas-type performance is available today, for $$. Mainstream prices come in about 2 years. Their one downside is no ability for quick swap. As of today for most people the Volt is probably the best choice, or Leaf/Focus for whomever the lower range will work.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 12:30 PM
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http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/31/i...s-charging-st/

Keep in mind this is old news. There are no barriers of any sort to a superior, cleaner and more efficient and sustainable auto paradigm today, other than stupidity. In many cases the use of cars is pretty stupid as well, and more efficient alternate forms of transportation and urban planning need to be implemented, but that's a different issue.
Thanks for that. Very interesting but again, infrastructure. Man those batteries are huge.

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Old Oct 05, 2012, 02:38 PM
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Infrastructure is needed for sure.

But just the sear size difference between our country and theirs make the infrastructure upgrade seem almost impossible.

A few dozen of those stations in Isreal would just about cover the whole country.
It would take several thousand just to cover our countries largest metropolitain areas.

Now you are talking a decade or 2 of infrastructure building.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 02:46 PM
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Very true Roger.

Likely not to happen for several decades unless there is a dramatic, disruptive breakthrough in electron storage technology. For now, viable and cost-effective electric vehicle replacement of IC vehicles is pure fantasy. And, based upon current and foreseeable electrochemical battery technology, you and I will be driving internal combustion automobiles for a long time to come, unless we're on a golf course or puttering about on a scooter....

Mark
Hmm, so why are all those golf carts not using IC engines?
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 03:01 PM
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Hmm, so why are all those golf carts not using IC engines?
Because they don't leave the golf course. In my opinion, electric or oil is not the answer. Hydrogen fuel cells or better yet, natural gas. They say there is 1000 years of it to harvest and think something better will come about. Beam me up Scotty.

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Old Oct 05, 2012, 03:23 PM
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Because they don't leave the golf course. In my opinion, electric or oil is not the answer. Hydrogen fuel cells or better yet, natural gas. They say there is 1000 years of it to harvest and think something better will come about. Beam me up Scotty.

Harry
Well, not true since they're used at many non-golf facilities and events including IRCHA and the last time I checked the AMA Headquarters was most certainly not a golf course.

However, the point I was trying to make is that the reason they're used is because they work well for their specific application, local transportation.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 03:45 PM
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Yes, they work very well for local transport. Are you considering a golf cart for your day to day travels?

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Old Oct 05, 2012, 04:17 PM
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Hmm, so why are all those golf carts not using IC engines?
Many (if not most) do use IC engines. Additionally, the ones that are electric use Pb batteries and are only driven a few miles each day before going back on a charger overnight. If they get stranded with a dead battery, it's a minor issue and a short tow.

Scale it up to a full size passenger vehicle and it becomes a toy of the wealthy.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 04:57 PM
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Many (if not most) do use IC engines. Additionally, the ones that are electric use Pb batteries and are only driven a few miles each day before going back on a charger overnight. If they get stranded with a dead battery, it's a minor issue and a short tow.

Scale it up to a full size passenger vehicle and it becomes a toy of the wealthy.
I can't say I've ever seen an IC golf cart, but has seen thousands of electric ones.

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a toy of the wealthy
So is that the root of what your rants are really all about?
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 05:02 PM
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I can't say I've ever seen an IC golf cart, but has seen thousands of electric ones.
The golf carts that are used to travel longer distances are normally IC.

In fact I have a 6 passenger IC golf cart for sale.


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Old Oct 05, 2012, 05:13 PM
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So is that the root of what your rants are really all about?
Like many others who have posted to this thread, I am simply providing an oasis of reality in the ocean of fantasy that large scale adoption of EV is anywhere even remotely viable either economically or logistically.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 05:21 PM
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I can't say I've ever seen an IC golf cart, but has seen thousands of electric ones.

So is that the root of what your rants are really all about?
Wow, you must play a lot of golf! Congrats. Now that I think of it, most of the carts I have rented were IC. Just got back from Catalina Island and the one I rented was IC. I also had a good discussion with one of my sons that is studying neuroscience in college and will most likely be a neurosurgeon and can't seem to understand the concept of mass transit or mileage. He is tainted by his professors but now understands. He will be inheriting a vehicle with an IC engine that only gets 5mpg (on avgas) and is happy with that

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Old Oct 05, 2012, 06:26 PM
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Like many others who have posted to this thread, I am simply providing an oasis of reality in the ocean of fantasy that large scale adoption of EV is anywhere even remotely viable either economically or logistically.
What post(s) have specifically stated the contrary?
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 06:36 PM
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You are perfectly capable of determining such.

Many have stated that wide adoption of full sized EVs based upon electrochemical batteries is decades away, if ever. This has been countered that 'it's here now', and cost-competitive with IC. To me, this claim is preposterous, despite my desire for it to be true.
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