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Old May 08, 2012, 07:43 PM
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Bombay's Avatar
Richmond, TX
Joined Apr 2008
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Joe:

What is the difference or pros/cons of terminating in Delta or WYE?

Rob
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Old May 08, 2012, 07:48 PM
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elCapitan's Avatar
United States, UT, Provo
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Maybe I have just been lucky 4 times in a row.

Seems to me, if you picked the"wrong" adjacent pair, once you got all the way around, it would be as if you just started with either the second our third "correct" pair. The pattern will be the same in the end. Isn't that why, if your motor is turning the wrong way, you can just swap any two of your bullet connectors in the ESC, and it will switch direction?
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Old May 08, 2012, 08:30 PM
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Joined Jun 2009
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Me too

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ferndale Flyer View Post
The color on the bottom of my Assassin WAS monocoat on top of laminate. Today on my second outing as it flew over my head it was making an awful racket so I brought it down and the monocoat was coming off. It's off now.

I experienced a little too much wind for my experience level today and when it went down I started right off walking toward it without lining up a landmark and a line to follow to get to it. I almost lost it and when I found it it was in plain sight. Next time I will take Lee's advice and make sure I know the line it went down on before I move to go look for it.
I lost mine last week for 3 hours by the time I found it the battery failed.
I'm thinking of ribbon on the wing tips. I followed my line just like you and was way off and I still don't know why.
Stupid weeds! The wing is a couple inches tall and the weeds are two feet tall and I had to be on top of it before I finally saw it.
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Old May 08, 2012, 08:53 PM
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Tom Eutsler's Avatar
Asheville,NC
Joined Jun 2002
832 Posts
Good and the Bad

elCapitan

The bad news is , hooked up rewind SPARKS etc flew every where , dogs
took off out the back door wheww smoke

the Good news is , house did not burn- thru em out the front door on the
grass to smolder ....te
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Old May 08, 2012, 08:57 PM
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Asheville,NC
Joined Jun 2002
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elCapitan Just kiddin

I was not happy with first wind, so repeated it and then took apart another
new 2812 - took for ever to get the org windings off

then wound it , slowly sometimes havin to back track a bit as either on wrong tooth or going the wrong way with the wind but finally done

don't know if they work - but think they are in the right order this time

...........te
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Old May 08, 2012, 09:13 PM
TeachSeventh
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Houston
Joined Dec 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombay View Post
Joe:

What is the difference or pros/cons of terminating in Delta or WYE?

Rob
Hi Rob,

The termination is different with everything else remaining the same. Using the
DLRK wind in this discussion. After correctly identifying the three ends, E1, E2 and E3 you twist those together and the S1, S2, S3 become the leads going to each of the three wires to the ESC.

My understanding is that WYE also called STAR termination for the same number of turns and wire gauge pulls less amps but provides a lower KV, usually best for a project where you want to turn a larger prop with a higher pitch for more torque where the Delta termination provides a higher KV best for turning a smaller prop at a higher RPM as preferred for the Assassin.

I am not a motor rewind expert but have wound many DLRK and others this past year and learned a lot from the motor winding threads. The diagram on page 24 of the PDF attachment shows you how to label, and allows you to follow as you begin to wind one tooth/pole and then reverse the direction for the next one to it and then jump 180 degrees over to the other side and do the same thing. I don't like guessing after all that hard work and a simple matter to label as you go and terminate the wire pairs according to the instruction in the legend always provides a winner for me.

Star (Wye) Termination
Solder E1, E2, E3 together
Note: S1, S2 and S3 are connected to ESC.

Best regards,

Joe
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Old May 08, 2012, 09:18 PM
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jetpackninja's Avatar
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Nice explanation.

the FC2822 is the same motor as the FC2812 with the windings terminated differently to give the lower Kv rating.

Happy winding
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Old May 08, 2012, 09:25 PM
TeachSeventh
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Houston
Joined Dec 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Eutsler View Post
I was not happy with first wind, so repeated it and then took apart another
new 2812 - took for ever to get the org windings off

then wound it , slowly sometimes havin to back track a bit as either on wrong tooth or going the wrong way with the wind but finally done

don't know if they work - but think they are in the right order this time

...........te
They look great Tom, what wire gauge and how many turns per pole did you use?

Thanks, Joe
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Old May 08, 2012, 09:57 PM
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United States, UT, Provo
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I'm not going to claim to be a winding expert either, but at 5:30 into this video (the one I used to learn the first time), he clearly says it doesn't matter which two adjacent wires you twist together to form the leads that go to the ESC. He even spins the motor on the table and picks randomly. I took that to heart, and have never worried about which to to pick either, and like I said, have never had any sort of a problem.

And W5BSA, when you say to solder E1, E2, and E3 together, I have no idea what you mean by that. The only soldering I do is soldering each twisted pair into the bullet connector.

Am I really this lucky that I'm misunderstanding that badly and have still successfully re-wound 4 motors? Or are we talking about a different termination? Or is the issue of figuring out a "correct" adjacent pair an urban myth? I can't say I plan to change what I'm doing, when it's working so well.
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:21 PM
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You'd have to read the power point he provided to understand what he's talking about.
E1 E2 and E3 soldered together is the Wye termination (or star- same thing)

The windings are the same for both termination methods.
The end result is different.
Wye (star) ends up with a lower Kv
Delta ends up with a higher Kv
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:22 PM
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Yah Will- don't change anything- you are doing it right.
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:22 PM
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United States, OH, Urbana
Joined May 2010
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My vote is for: It doesn't matter on the wire pairings. As long as you alternate phase starts and ends, twisting any two adjacent wires will always mean twisting a starting wire with an ending wire. I find it highly unlikely that everyone in this thread who has rewound one of these motors has gotten lucky.

It appears that Mr. Rademacher's tutorial provided by W5BSA pulled information from building intructions for a motor from Komodo Hobby. I believe the wiring terminations are labeled as such for instructional purposes to make describing the different connections easy. I doubt it is meant to be the one and only way. Full document from Komodo Hobby below:
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdmowrey View Post
My vote is for: It doesn't matter on the wire pairings. As long as you alternate phase starts and ends, twisting any two adjacent wires will always mean twisting a starting wire with an ending wire.
I don't even alternate the winding phases, and I still just pick any two adjacent pairs to twist together at the end.
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:31 PM
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United States, UT, Herriman
Joined Jan 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elCapitan View Post
I don't even alternate the winding phases, and I still just pick any two adjacent pairs to twist together at the end.
If you wound it properly, 2 adjacent wires will be alternate phases, so you're doing it right.

The other termination setup requires you to track start/end for each phase. That's the S and E numbers. So you connect all the ends together, and the starts go to the esc. It's a different way to do things, and changes the performance of the motor apparently. It might be useful on other planes, but the comments suggested that the Assassin would probably prefer the style we've been using.
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Old May 08, 2012, 10:39 PM
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Will- if you wind according to the video and pick any adjacent two wires one will be the Start of a phase, one will be the End of a phase. Every time, as long as it is wound correctly. You are doing it right. Don't sweat the semantics.
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