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Old Mar 27, 2015, 06:21 AM
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BrainFart RC-Pilot
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Build Log
Phoenix Genesis

After a stupid crash (pilot brain fart) I did order this plane at the local hobby shop:
Phoenix Genesis

Phoenix Model Genesis Airplane Review: Around Tuit RC (7 min 5 sec)


More pictures:

http://phoenixmodel.com/Product.aspx?ProductId=329

It has retracts with servos, which I will replace with these below, which are also mentioned in the manual:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...ount_2pc_.html

I will not use this plane for speed records. At our flying field it is always a bit more windy, so a bit bigger plane is than wise to have.

I will fly it with the Turnigy NTM 4248 650kv motor and 5s 4000.
Maybe I switch to 5s 5000.
Using 85 Turnigy AE controller and 12x8 prop (a bit below 50amps) or 13x8 prop ( a bit above 50amps)
I used also 13x10 prop at the NTM motor, but than it goes up to 70amps and for sure I need than a bigger pack (5000)

It hasn't arrived yet, this new plane. Hopefully half April.

Anybody else flying this beauty?

Cheers,
Rob
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Old Mar 27, 2015, 10:31 AM
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Hi Rob,
I have one as well ! Perfect flyer !

Anyhow - I do not believe that your set up for the Genesis will qualify for this forum..

I did quite some mods to the plane to suit it for my set up:

- leomotion motor ( L5031 with 850KV)
- MGM compro TMM 25035-3 ESC
- 5 or even 6s TP 65C 6600mah
- Aeronaut 13x12 , RFM 12x17 and big bruce 12x25 props
- 2200 up to 3500 Watts

The plane should be at least a bit of a racer, should`t it ?

I can take some pics if you like !
see you
Hans
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Old Mar 27, 2015, 11:10 AM
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Holy Cow....2200 up to 3500 watts!!!

LoL

Well for speed I have my FVK Sunracer-II Pylon racer which is very fast.

I had this setup in the Nemesis of HK (not available anymore) and was way happy with it.
Sure...speed is addictive, but for me the speed was good and fun to fly.
My guess is that this one will be faster, since the wing has a thinner foil.

Sure, upload some picture and videos if you have!

Rob
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Old Mar 27, 2015, 12:12 PM
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Hi Rob,
O.k., give me some time for these pics or even a video, please !
regards
hans

PS: I always consider 500 watts per pound ( or 1 kilowatt per kilogramm for us ! ) and above
as a starting point for my performance planes - makes them really lively
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Old Mar 27, 2015, 12:32 PM
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Last season I crashed a 2nd hand bought Comet DH-88.
It was 5.5kg and had only 1000watt......

Repairing it now and it will get 1900watt instead.

Most of my planes have 350watt per KG. Some even more, like my funjet or pylon racer.
Tiger Moth or some other scale planes don't need that much of course.

Sure power is great but the downsize is often a bigger weight.

Looking forward to see some pictures

Rob
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Old Apr 03, 2015, 05:29 AM
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Hi Rob,
Here are the promised pics`s - it does fly as fast as it looks !!!
Will take some video footage upon the next flyout to proove that Genesis can be made to hold up to the title of this forum
see you
Hans

PS: actually, this airframe has just been built to be a flying testbed for a self developped constant speed propeller drive that my friend and me intend
to fit into a wonderful Aeronaut PC-21 ! The mechanical layout of this powertrain is complete but we do struggle with the controlling of that constant speed
function throughout the whole flight envelope -genesis shall help us to achieve that goal !
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Old Apr 03, 2015, 05:56 AM
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Some pics of our project plane - it will be "high performance " as well !

Constant Speed Propeller Testlauf (1 min 56 sec)
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Old Apr 03, 2015, 11:01 AM
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Awesome Hans!

Indeed, it looks great and fast! The black canopy is also looking good!!!!

Interesting project with the P-21 and this variable pitch prop

Thanks for sharing and I am looking forward to a video

Rob
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Old Apr 04, 2015, 03:34 AM
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Hi Rob

I also built a Genesis after the HK Nemesis NXT. My powerplant is also from the Nemesis!
NTM 50-60 380kv, on 6S 5000 with an APC14x14. Very quiet and pretty fast!
I had to replace the firewall, it was so soft that the blind nuts where pulled clean through the wood when mounting the motor! Also the wing joiner alloy tube was very soft, I could bend it with my bare hands without much effort! I replaced it with the carbon rod from the Nemesis.
I left out the gear bay covers to have cooling air excit holes.
I also mounted the tail wheel directly in the rudder, like the Nemesis.
Why did they supply a 70mm spinner, when the cowl needs a 75mm one?
I finished the build yesterday.

René
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Old Apr 04, 2015, 04:01 AM
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Hi René

Thanks for the input and tips! I am still waiting for mine to arrive. It was sold out and will be stock again somewhere half April.

What is the weight? I guess firm over 3kg.

Cheers,
Rob
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Old Apr 04, 2015, 05:36 AM
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Rob, the finished weight of my Genesis is ~3770gr, my NXT with the same components was 4.5kg!
Where did you order yours? I got it from Hobby Inn.

René
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Old Apr 04, 2015, 06:13 AM
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That is a firm weight! But of course allot power comes with more weight!

I hope to keep it 2.7kg or 2.8kg with 4000 5s pack. Maybe I switch to 5000 5s

The HK plane I had I liked allot, but did crash with a stupid action. It was 2.7kg
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=173

It is not available anymore, so I searched for a new one. It had plenty of power and speed with my setup.
The Genesis has a thinner airfoil, so I expect more speed.

I did order the Genesis at W&W in Waldfeught, just cross the border in Germany.
Nice shop with lot's of service. I hope to get it half April.

Cheers,
Rob
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Old Apr 06, 2015, 02:40 PM
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Hi Genesis fans,
I did two more flights today with this ship ( sorry here, Rob, no video yet ) and figured out a general problem that this type of airframe has - it uses simply too much battery capacity if it is flown according to its nature ! ( say at an average speed of 80 to 100mph )
It is exactly the same problem that you run into when flying classic pattern planes with an electric set up ! ( an old "classic" .61 engine with a 12 oz. tank has the same power (+/- 2kw ), but stores double the energy compared to a 5s/5000mah set up !! )
The flight times therefore are restricted to +/- 4min when using electric set up`s of the same total weight compared to the nitro one !
Drag increases by the power of 2 to the speed, that is the problem here, because the average flying speed of such an airplane type is roughly double compared to that of a modern pattern plane or trainer !
Since weight is not really a factor for Genesis, I will probably go and use 10000mah in the future to achieve my standard 8min flight time !
Actual weight (5s/5000mah) is 3.3 kg, so, 5s/10000mah will get me to around 3.9 kg .
If you do NOT load to much g`s to these lightly built up wings, it should be fine !

see you
Hans
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Old Apr 06, 2015, 04:18 PM
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I am using the the NTM 4248 650kv also with the Comet D-88 (in progress)
Did measure the RPM with 12x8 APC prop and had over 10.000rpm

http://adamone.rchomepage.com/calc_thrust.htm

It resuls with the 12x8 in:
91mph / 146 kmh
Static thrust 3290gram

Alternative I could use the 13x8 prop, but this means less speed and more thrust.
Even 13x10 I used with the Nemesis, but than it uses up to 70amps which is at the limit of the motor.

Anyhow, from my Funjet I learned that you need 'thrust' to maintain speed. On a Funjet the 4.7x4.7 prop works less compared to the 5.5x4.3 prop. The 4.7 has more speed...but you also need thrust to generate the speed. The airfoil of the funjet is thick, so it needs this 5.5x4.3 prop.

The Genesis has a lesser thick airfoil compared to the Nemesis. So instead of 13x8 I am going to use the 12x8, because the thrust is 3290gram.

I estimate a weight of 2.8kg with the 4000 5s pack.

Well.... we have to wait and see of course.
For me 145kmh is nice figure for speed, for this plane. Alternative would be 12x12 but I guess it will go 70amps for sure.

Cheers,
Rob
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Old Apr 06, 2015, 06:00 PM
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Hi Rob,
Well, hope you get lucky with your set up then !
Myself, I am not really happy with mine - it is too little " spicy " !!
But I am somewhat spoiled by the performance of my other, real high performance airplanes, I do know !
see you
Hans
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