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Old Jan 04, 2013, 01:43 AM
iCharger
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New iCharger 4010DUO, 308DUO & 406DUO Have Been Released!!!

Hi guys, welcome to our new thread for iCharger DUO chargers, you can find detailed information about DUO chargers here.
If you have any problems about using these new chargers please contact us; and any comments and suggestion from you are always appreciated.

iCharger upgrader: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/upgrader.rar

iCharger 4010DUO
4010DUO's manual: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/4010DUO_Manual_en.pdf
iCharger 4010DUO's upgrading software: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/iC4010DUO_V215.bin 
4010DUO's update notes:  http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/Re...ger4010Duo.txt


iCharger 308DUO
308DUO's manual: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/308DUO_Manual_en.pdf
iCharger 308DUO's upgrading software: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/iC308DUO_V215.bin
308DUO's update notes: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/Re...rger308Duo.txt

New iCharger 406DUO
406DUO's manual: http://www.hillrc.com/UploadFiles/406DUO_Manual_en.pdf


Technical support, please contact harrief111@hotmail.com, szjunsi@163.com or service@hillrc.com
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 06:39 AM
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ilium007's Avatar
Australia, QLD, Brisbane
Joined Jan 2009
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It looks like a 1990's game console !!!!!! Why did it have to look like that !



Still, an interesting addition to the iCharger lineup.
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 06:52 AM
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What would be a recomended 110v power sourse for this very powerful charger???????
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 06:55 AM
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Australia, QLD, Brisbane
Joined Jan 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Tug View Post
What would be a recomended 110v power sourse for this very powerful charger???????
Most guys here convert server power supplies - these supplies can provide up to 100A at 12V and can be placed in series to give 24V at 100A if you know what you are doing. See: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1292514

These can be picked up of eBay for chump change whereas a commercial MeanWell 100A power supply will run somewhere around $700
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 04:10 PM
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Denmark, Capital Region of Denmark, CPH
Joined Aug 2012
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Hi

I have played around with my new 4010duo. There are some points that I dont understand:

1:
After making a memory with a 2200 mah lipo it states on the infoscreen that end capacity is 2650 mah... I can see that it is 20% higher than the 2200 mah that i have entered which somehow matches with the 120% default safety limit of the chargemode. If i enter 100% then the endcapacity on the infoscreen is correct at 2200 mah.

So now i simply dont understand why one would need to have a higher capacity entered than the real battery?? and again to what use is the endcapacity indication on the infoscreen if it is based on a userdefined arbitrary value?

2.
The charger has a huge ability to tweak how the balancer works but i simply dont understand the balance overcharge feature, - can anyone explain it for me?

Otherwise i am extremely impressed with the new 4010 charger- its very solid build, quiet and is able to really rock my parallel charging

Cheers

C.
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 05:02 PM
Proud to eat Kraut ;-)
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Germany
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavokk View Post
[]2.
The charger has a huge ability to tweak how the balancer works but i simply dont understand the balance overcharge feature, - can anyone explain it for me?
[]
Hi!

I would be inclined to say that this has to do something with the FastMod I suggested some time ago:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...d#post23214351

But Junsi can surely clarify this.

Cheers,

Julez
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 05:21 PM
Southern Pride
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Haralson County GA. USA
Joined Oct 2004
34,812 Posts
Default for LiPoly Capacity is Ignore and I see no logic in setting a max. capacity.

With other chargers the first two things I changed was to increase LiPoly capacity to max. and set the Time Out to max.

LiPolys are charged CC /CV and I see no way a capacity limit can be considered a safety feacture. Capacity limit can only be a safety for Ni batteries and even then if they are fully discharged before the start of a charge.

Charles
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Old Jan 04, 2013, 06:58 PM
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DaveNH's Avatar
United States, NH
Joined Nov 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilium007 View Post
It looks like a 1990's game console !!!!!! Why did it have to look like that !



Still, an interesting addition to the iCharger lineup.
First thing that came to mind when I saw that pic was Nintendo
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Old Jan 05, 2013, 01:30 AM
iCharger
junsi's Avatar
Joined Mar 2007
1,087 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavokk View Post
1:
After making a memory with a 2200 mah lipo it states on the infoscreen that end capacity is 2650 mah... I can see that it is 20% higher than the 2200 mah that i have entered which somehow matches with the 120% default safety limit of the chargemode. If i enter 100% then the endcapacity on the infoscreen is correct at 2200 mah.

So now i simply dont understand why one would need to have a higher capacity entered than the real battery?? and again to what use is the endcapacity indication on the infoscreen if it is based on a userdefined arbitrary value?
2.
The charger has a huge ability to tweak how the balancer works but i simply dont understand the balance overcharge feature, - can anyone explain it for me?
1. As for the battery capacity, the nominal value should have a certain balance; our charger has protective effect, so it sets higher end capacity; and it involves the problem of conversion efficiency.

2. Please refer to the following description:
Balance Over Charge, the maximum overcharge compensation voltage acts as accelerated charge, and the larger the value, the more obvious of accelerated charge.
For example: Charge Lipo with Vstd, set Balance Over charge to Vboc,the cells internal resistance detected is Ri, when the charge current is Ia, the actual CV value of cells is Va
IF Ri*Ia > Vboc THEN
Va = Vstd + Vboc
ELSE
Va = Vstd+Ri*Ia

For example: one cell Vstd is 4.2V, Ri is 4 mohm, Vboc is 5mV, when the battery enters CV status, if the current Ia is 10A, then the voltage drop on the internal resistance is 10A*4 mohm>Vboc, and the actual CV value of cells is Va=4.2V+Vboc=4.205V;
if Ia drops to 1A, then it should be 1A*4 mohm<Vboc, the Va=4.2V+4mV=4.204V;
Similarly Ia drops to 0.2A, the Va=4.2V+0.8mV=4.2008V.

Junsi
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Old Jan 05, 2013, 01:49 AM
iCharger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julez View Post
Hi!

I would be inclined to say that this has to do something with the FastMod I suggested some time ago:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...d#post23214351

But Junsi can surely clarify this.

Cheers,

Julez
Hello Julez,

Your suggestion Fastmod LiXX Charging is similar with our parameters of overcharge, but due to the safety consideration, we set the limit only up to 10mV. And this method is also used for accelerated storage via internal resistance correction.
Addition to these parts, we consider fully the impact of internal resistance when balance, by adding compensation, especially for the battery with larger internal resistance, the balance effect will be better.
Set separate current reduction values for "alarm" and "charge termination" is the same with the feature "Keep charging after the done".

Junsi
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Old Jan 05, 2013, 11:49 AM
Proud to eat Kraut ;-)
Julez's Avatar
Germany
Joined Dec 2003
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Hi Junsi,

great to hear!
These are good features.

Cheers,

Julez
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Old Jan 05, 2013, 12:33 PM
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So. Cal.
Joined Oct 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi View Post
For example: Charge Lipo with Vstd, set Balance Over charge to Vboc,the cells internal resistance detected is Ri, when the charge current is Ia, the actual CV value of cells is Va
IF Ri*Ia > Vboc THEN
Va = Vstd + Vboc
ELSE
Va = Vstd+Ri*Ia

For example: one cell Vstd is 4.2V, Ri is 4 mohm, Vboc is 5mV, when the battery enters CV status, if the current Ia is 10A, then the voltage drop on the internal resistance is 10A*4 mohm>Vboc, and the actual CV value of cells is Va=4.2V+Vboc=4.25V;
if Ia drops to 1A, then it should be 1A*4 mohm<Vboc, the Va=4.2V+4mV=4.24V;
Similarly Ia drops to 0.2A, the Va=4.2V+0.8mV=4.208V.
As I understand the logic diagram of this feature, selecting this feature and setting a value above 0 may actually result in increased charge times as Balance Over is only engaged when Vboc is less than Ri*Ia. If Vboc is greater than Ri*Ia, the charger defaults to Va = Vstd+Ri*Ia. Since Vstd+Ri*Ia is greater than Vstd + Vboc, the charge cycle will be faster without enabling this 'feature'.

There's some bad units in the above calculations as well. 4mV = .004V, not .04V. Likewise, 4mOhm = .004 Ohm, not .04 Ohm

Something's fishy or I need a cup of coffee, or both. Somebody help me out here.

Julez,
As an aside, I have accomplished what you're seeking by using John Julian's cutoff circuit in conjunction with a constant current charge setting to create custom charge cycles with virtually no CV stage for charging my 18650 cells. One simply needs to know that internal resistance of individual cell being charged as well as the charge current to set a custom interrupt. I set it on the low side as IR decreases during charge.

Mark
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Old Jan 05, 2013, 07:44 PM
iCharger
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Originally Posted by mrforsyth View Post
As I understand the logic diagram of this feature, selecting this feature and setting a value above 0 may actually result in increased charge times as Balance Over is only engaged when Vboc is less than Ri*Ia. If Vboc is greater than Ri*Ia, the charger defaults to Va = Vstd+Ri*Ia. Since Vstd+Ri*Ia is greater than Vstd + Vboc, the charge cycle will be faster without enabling this 'feature'.

There's some bad units in the above calculations as well. 4mV = .004V, not .04V. Likewise, 4mOhm = .004 Ohm, not .04 Ohm
Mark,

Sorry for our mistake, and thanks for pointing out, have corrected.

Junsi
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Old Jan 06, 2013, 01:22 AM
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Thanks for the update Junsi. Confirms my suspicion that this feature likely has negligible benefit. Will have to get my hands on a 4010 to understand it better. Need another beta tester?

Have been thumbing through the manual and am intrigued by some of the new features.

Regards,
Mark
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Old Jan 06, 2013, 02:55 AM
iCharger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrforsyth View Post
Thanks for the update Junsi. Confirms my suspicion that this feature likely has negligible benefit. Will have to get my hands on a 4010 to understand it better. Need another beta tester?
Mark
Mark,

Thanks for your support on our products. As the test for 4010DUO has been finished so it was released. Hope you can understand, and any comments or suggestion from you is always appreciated.

Junsi
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