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View Poll Results: How much foam do you consume?
1 bundle or less per year 83 33.88%
1-2 bundles per year 98 40.00%
2-6 bundles per year 42 17.14%
1-2 bundles per month 7 2.86%
2-4 bundles per month 4 1.63%
4 or more bundles per month 11 4.49%
Voters: 245. You may not vote on this poll

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Old Dec 01, 2011, 05:35 PM
Registered User
Northwest Ohio
Joined Jan 2002
2,674 Posts
We use a few thousand sheets of 6 mm Depron a year. For us to be interested the material would need to be as good or better than Depron and delivered in sheets in perfect condition, flat with no perforations or skin. I would forget about colors other than white. It will be a challenge to get any company in the US interested in producing it at all, let alone multiple colors.

There are a few companies who could produce the material in the US if the demand were there, but I really question if the demand is even close to being enough. Nevertheless, I'm happy to see someone investigating this and it would be great to have a competitive product to Depron. I'll be following the thread!

Scott

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Old Dec 01, 2011, 06:44 PM
Slipping the Surly Bonds
dz1sfb's Avatar
Attica, MI
Joined Dec 2006
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Scott,

Thank you for your interest.

Ken
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 06:59 PM
AKA Don
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United States, MI, Houghton Lake
Joined Dec 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Model Aero View Post
We use a few thousand sheets of 6 mm Depron a year. For us to be interested the material would need to be as good or better than Depron and delivered in sheets in perfect condition, flat with no perforations or skin. I would forget about colors other than white. It will be a challenge to get any company in the US interested in producing it at all, let alone multiple colors.

There are a few companies who could produce the material in the US if the demand were there, but I really question if the demand is even close to being enough. Nevertheless, I'm happy to see someone investigating this and it would be great to have a competitive product to Depron. I'll be following the thread!

Scott

www.ModelAero.com
How many is "a few thousand"? The highest catagory in the pole is 4 bundles a month, which is 1200 sheets per year. Please add your usage in the poll at the top of the page.
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 07:11 PM
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Northwest Ohio
Joined Jan 2002
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Usage added. Is there any reason you would spec 5 mm and not 6 mm which is the standard for Depron? That would be a deal breaker for us.

Scott

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Old Dec 01, 2011, 08:03 PM
Re-Kitting Expert :o
Bullhead City, Arizona
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I think 6mm is pretty universal. Isn't blucore about 6?
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 08:06 PM
AKA Don
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United States, MI, Houghton Lake
Joined Dec 2002
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Scott,
Thanks for adding your usage and your comment. I agree 6 mm would be the best target thickness for the initial product with perhaps 3 mm following later.

I am guessing that Kens initial request for 5 mm was because it is closer to the Dollar Store "Ready Board" and the Dow protection board which are current products from this manufacturer. But again, I agree a 6mm sheet would be a better choice, unless it results in some extra tooling or other expense.

By the way are 2'x4' sheets an exceptable size for you?

And how about 23.5"X4'? That is favored by some Phlatprinter users.
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 09:04 PM
low tech high tech
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Southern Vermont
Joined Feb 2007
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I'd buy 2 bundles per year for sure. Numbers added. Might even be tempted to try to kit something commercially if the quality and cost made this favorable -- which at $50 or so a bundle for flat white uniform stock would make it do-able.
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 09:43 PM
AKA Don
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United States, MI, Houghton Lake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GorillaBob View Post
I think 6mm is pretty universal. Isn't blucore about 6?
Ken has purchased and measured a lot more Protection board and other FFF than I. Maybe he can share his data on thickness.
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Old Dec 01, 2011, 10:27 PM
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United States, PA, Beaver
Joined Sep 2001
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bz1mcr View Post

And how about 23.5"X4'? That is favored by some Phlatprinter users.
FWIW, as a PhlatPrinter owner, the 2'x4' works just fine.
When designing in SU for FFF, I use 6mm as the standard for the tabs, slots, and about 85% of the time that works just fine. It does vary a bit even on the same sheet (long piece with multiple tabs/slots, most are perfect fit, some aren't)

Also 5MM would be fine with me, but I would prefer 6mm and then 3mm as a close second.
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Old Dec 02, 2011, 06:38 AM
Slipping the Surly Bonds
dz1sfb's Avatar
Attica, MI
Joined Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcav8r2 View Post
FWIW, as a PhlatPrinter owner, the 2'x4' works just fine.
When designing in SU for FFF, I use 6mm as the standard for the tabs, slots, and about 85% of the time that works just fine. It does vary a bit even on the same sheet (long piece with multiple tabs/slots, most are perfect fit, some aren't)

Also 5MM would be fine with me, but I would prefer 6mm and then 3mm as a close second.
Ditto!

Ken
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Old Dec 02, 2011, 10:30 AM
Flying Models for 51 Years!
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Georgia, United States
Joined Oct 2002
809 Posts
I agree that 6mm will be the preferred thickness. As for the size of the Foam sheets, I prefer 2' x 4' sheets of Foam. That is the same size as the original FFF Sheets. Why 2' x 4', 99% of the Models we Scratch Builders build have wingspan's less than 4'! So, with a 4' long sheet you can build a wing with out having to glue two sheets together. Comments welcome.

Bobby
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Old Dec 02, 2011, 01:21 PM
Slipping the Surly Bonds
dz1sfb's Avatar
Attica, MI
Joined Dec 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bz1mcr View Post
Ken has purchased and measured a lot more Protection board and other FFF than I. Maybe he can share his data on thickness.
Between Blu-Core, PBIII, HPU, OC Foamular, and $Tree Readiboard, thickness ranges from .250" down to .188", and they all deviate to around .2" or 5mm. I know that is not exact, but there is that much variation across these products.

BC = .25"
PBIII = .188" - .2"
HPU = .2" - .225"
OC Foamular = .2" - .23"
Readiboard = .188" - .2"


Ken
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Old Dec 02, 2011, 04:41 PM
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Northwest Ohio
Joined Jan 2002
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bz1mcr View Post
Scott,
Thanks for adding your usage and your comment. I agree 6 mm would be the best target thickness for the initial product with perhaps 3 mm following later.

I am guessing that Kens initial request for 5 mm was because it is closer to the Dollar Store "Ready Board" and the Dow protection board which are current products from this manufacturer. But again, I agree a 6mm sheet would be a better choice, unless it results in some extra tooling or other expense.

By the way are 2'x4' sheets an exceptable size for you?

And how about 23.5"X4'? That is favored by some Phlatprinter users.
I have to cut the sheets down to 23" x 34" fit the laser so anything larger than that could work. I have laid out the kit parts to use the cutoffs for some of the smaller parts. So there is very little waste from the full size Depron sheets.

Personally I'm not sure if I'd be interested in 5 mm foam. It just wouldn't work well for our kits.

Scott

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Old Dec 02, 2011, 09:08 PM
low tech high tech
vtdiy's Avatar
Southern Vermont
Joined Feb 2007
3,028 Posts
I think surface finish is important -- beyond just no holes or waves.

A good acrylic paintable surface would be great. I've had acrylics peel off of Cellfoam88 rather easily -- it has a hard shiny finish. If you sand it then it suddenly turns into a hard sponge texture.

I'd really like to see a smooth somewhat matte finish that would mechanically key into acrylic paints well. The paint could be gloss even if the foam finish was matte -- the foam finish is just there to let the paint grab, it doesn't determine the paint finish.

That would also be better for gluing as well.

BTW, I have written before that Yankee Dollar stores here in the NE US carry a 3mm painted foam that is perfectly flat and smooth in a variety of colors, sold as poster board. It has no paper covering. And it costs a dollar a sheet. I wonder if Adams makes that as well?

It seems a little fragile, to me, but I haven't had anything to compare it with of that size.

see:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1493432
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Old Dec 02, 2011, 09:59 PM
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United States, IN, Indianapolis
Joined Dec 2005
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My CNC table is 4' x8' BUT I currently only have a 2' x 4' Vac hold down.
So Any of those sizes are OK with me. I currently process mostly the 13x39 depron.

My vote is 6mm or .25 " which ever.
Almost Everything I do is set up for 6mm slots and tabs.

!!!!!****!!!!!
Don, Ken, Guys, lets NOT loose sight of Other foam characteristics.
There are denser and more brittle and more floppy/rubbery formulations out there.
Even Depron is not ultra consistant and Grey/Black is not the same a White.

I've run into several of these grades over the years.
I picked up some bargain foam, once upon a time -
it's so brittle that it's useless for models.
I use it for packing material.

I also took a run at Other manufacturers of foam and wound up with a floppy
but better than EPP foam that was useable but not as desirable as depron.

I once found an Asian place that wouldnt even let me PURCHASE samples.
But they want me to buy a CONTAINER of what ever they are selling.
NOT !!!

Bob
Northwest Cutout Service
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