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Old Apr 01, 2010, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig View Post
This has nothing to do with lazyness, but about guys who are worried getting their hand caught by the prop.
Never had any accidents with propellors or rotor blades. Neither with wheels, gearing or whatever. Just lazyness and the need for more power, something like this one.
Multiplex Blizzard - Overpowered 4S Chair Launch ! (0 min 11 sec)


My FunJet and MiniMag do comply with my needs.
MiniMag Vertical Takeoff From A Fence (1 min 39 sec)
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleurhutje View Post
Never had any accidents with propellors or rotor blades. ...
Your examples don't have a prop at the tail end.

That being said, I also don't recall any accidents with props and/or rotor blades, but some guys have reported about cases.

Jürgen
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig View Post
Your examples don't have a prop at the tail end.
The FunJet and several other wings do. I'm not worried about the prop at the back. When throwing correctly and pretty firm, your hand is way below the prop by the time it would be possible to cut your hand.
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 09:56 AM
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OOPS, DP

Jürgen
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sleurhutje View Post
...
When throwing correctly and pretty firm, your hand is way below the prop by the time it would be possible to cut your hand.
This is correct, but there are obviously some guys who get bitten by the prop. Either they forget to continue with the forward/downward movement of the hand, or they slip or whatever:

http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showp...&postcount=617

Just because you and I don't have a problem, a rear prop remains a potential risk for injuries.

Jürgen
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig View Post
This is correct, but there are obviously some guys who get bitten by the prop. Either they forget to continue with the forward/downward movement of the hand, or they slip or whatever:

http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showp...&postcount=617

Just because you and I don't have a problem, a rear prop remains a potential risk for injuries.
LOL That's why the shaft is the weakest link. Just a safety precaution. A steel shaft is for professional javelin throwing Xeno pilots.
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Old Apr 01, 2010, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig View Post
This has nothing to do with lazyness, but about guys who are worried getting their hand caught by the prop.

Jürgen
You are so right .......

Who was it that posted some desperate photo's of his bloody fingers after being hit by the Xeno prop on launch? ......... anyway, I guess that certainly turned me off Xeno full power throws for sure (side throws excepted) .....
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by hobie14 View Post
Once upon a time if there was anyone who would post a Video about any model it was Jurgen ......

I can't remember any videos of you and your Xeno .......

Please Jurgen ..... don't be shy .....
OK, you wanted a video and here it is :

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/Jur...03-04-2010.wmv

First flight with the new steel shaft by the way.

Jürgen
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 12:04 PM
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Hi Jurgen,
Very Nice video, still waiting for my Steel shaft, hope to have it some day, as they said they will send me one
Joe
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 12:36 PM
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Bloody Fingers!

That was me with the bloody finger! Trust me - it doesn't matter how good you are at launching models, a rearward prop is always going to be a potential danger! I have been throwing models by hand for over 35 years and the Xeno was the first one that ever bit me on launch!!!

Since my accident I have now had over 30 flights all launched with the motor off like Jürgen in his video (nice video Jürgen) and never had a problem.

By the way, I have been experimenting with the Xeno as a potential FPV platform but the first problem that came to light was that when I fitted a spy cam to the nose and noticed the fact that it tends to Dutch roll and oscillate badly from side to side (Yaw) when exiting a turn, flying slowly or in a cross wind. While this is not much of a problem or even noticeable when flying normally, on camera (and therefore FPV) it looks awful. However, by increasing the fin area by about 100% I have managed to almost eliminate it completely. It's so stable now that I can even fly round me in a very tight turn like a control line model at low throttle settings without it falling out the sky!


George.
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 03:55 PM
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Can you show us the shape of the enlarged fins ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by georgebinns View Post
By the way, I have been experimenting with the Xeno as a potential FPV platform but the first problem that came to light was that when I fitted a spy cam to the nose and noticed the fact that it tends to Dutch roll and oscillate badly from side to side (Yaw) when exiting a turn, flying slowly or in a cross wind. While this is not much of a problem or even noticeable when flying normally, on camera (and therefore FPV) it looks awful. However, by increasing the fin area by about 100% I have managed to almost eliminate it completely. It's so stable now that I can even fly round me in a very tight turn like a control line model at low throttle settings without it falling out the sky!


George.
The stock fins looked a bit small to me, I am so used to looking at my twin jet

Can you post a photo of your new fins ? What material did you use ?
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurgen Heilig View Post
OK, you wanted a video and here it is :

http://airtoimedia.nl/web/upload/Jur...03-04-2010.wmv

First flight with the new steel shaft by the way.

Jürgen
Well done Jurgen ...... the video demonstrates the total confidence you have in the new shaft ...... I must admit although my own replacement shaft (based on CF material) is still flying ok, I keep fulll power to an absolute minimum and I'm not testing the plane to anywhere near it's potential ...... I'm looking forward to getting my replacement steel shaft from MPX ..... I have no word on its expected delivery yet .....

hand throws into a good strong head wind don't trouble me either......
I can do them too without a problem and it climbs away without power ...... it's throws into light/zero wind that I really need to have done by a Buddie ....

George ...... would be interested to see a video from the ground as well as onboard with your alternate fins .....
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Old Apr 02, 2010, 05:14 PM
Multirotors blow
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Peterborough, England
Joined Dec 2006
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Xeno enlarged fins

I'll sort a photograph out over the weekend so you can see what I have done. In my opinion the designer of the Xeno didn't get the size or position of the fins right for ideal flight performance although it does look good. They are way too small and too near the centre of the model to be effective. It's no coincident that most flying wings have the fins at the wing tips. It makes them more effective as they are further behind the centre of gravity at the tips on a swept wing and will have a bigger smoothing effect on yaw moments.

All I did to get the larger fins was to glue the originals on to some balsa wood cut twice the size and filled in the gaps with lightweight filler. Then I sanded them to an aerofoil shape and covered them in film. It's made a big difference to the stability although it has added a little extra drag. To be honest the extra drag is no big deal as the Xeno is no great speed machine anyway. If I was making another version I would extend the extra surface area more to the rear of the Xeno to effectively move the pivot point even further back.
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Old Apr 03, 2010, 06:11 AM
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Always tweeking George!

I'm working today but will try to give you a call over the weekend.

Simon.
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Old Apr 03, 2010, 06:41 AM
Multirotors blow
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Peterborough, England
Joined Dec 2006
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You know me Simon, always pushing for better performance! Yes give me a call - it will be good to catch up.
Here is a short video of one of my recent flights from a very confined T/off and landing space at a local church - don't ask!
I used the very low throttle technique to slow the model down for the restricted landing - works great!

Thornbury3.mov (4 min 7 sec)

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