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Old Jun 05, 2011, 08:01 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
1,369 Posts
Decided I'd mount the canopy permanently and cut the hatch for the gear from the bottom.

I glued the fan in the nacelle and made a detachable front end held with rare earth magnets to provide acess for maintenance.

Mounted the servos in a foam tray glued in the fuselage. Added a bulkhead behind the servos for mounting pushrod tubes. Pitch/yaw/roll control via ruddervators.

g
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 12:33 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
1,369 Posts
Almost done. Here's a pic from below. Still have to connect the servos to the elevons and make/add the decals/markings.

I took it out in the yard a few days ago - with just the motor and fan installed and no RX, ESC or servos, and gave it a few tosses to see how it glides. It flew straight and glided in a slightly nose down attitude and skidded in on it's belly. I am happy about that.

But, like the Dollar Tree glider I originally started with, this one, I'm afraid, is also gonna be too heavy for the fan/motor combo. Maybe I'll stick a 40mm fan in it. There's enough room for it.

It should have been done in about a 12" WS for a 30mm fan. Instead of the 15" WS this one is. I didn't need the nacelle to be nearly as big as it is for a 30mm fan. Anyway, I'm already preparing for another go in a more scaled down version.

I was checking other versions of the HE-162 to try and determine where the CG should be and it looks like it will be somewhere in the neighborhood of 35% of the wing chord where it intersects the fuselage. If any of you know better please let me know.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 04:45 PM
Team30 Micro EDF
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Adelaide, Australia
Joined Apr 2004
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Good stuff giuseppi. Nothing wrong with going through a few versions to tweak it out.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 04:55 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NitroCharged View Post
Good stuff giuseppi. Nothing wrong with going through a few versions to tweak it out.

You're right, NC. Thanks. I'm having a lot of fun with it, too.

g
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 07:12 PM
Not enough hours in the day
Slaanesh's Avatar
Melbourne
Joined Feb 2009
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My StarMax HE-162 was closer to the leading edge than 35%. I think it was more like 20% from memory.

... looking ...

Ah yes, have a look at this post I made about the Starmax HE-162.
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Old Jun 08, 2011, 07:55 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
1,369 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slaanesh View Post
My StarMax HE-162 was closer to the leading edge than 35%. I think it was more like 20% from memory.

... looking ...

Ah yes, have a look at this post I made about the Starmax HE-162.
Thanks, Slaanesh. What is interesting about your data is that's about where it wants to balance w/o me having to manipulate the gear inside too much.

Thanks again to all of you who have provided your support and expertise.



g
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Old Jun 09, 2011, 06:35 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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Broke down and bought one of these this morning: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=p5197.c0.m619

I don't think what I have in it now has enough guts to fly it.

I have 6 blade rotor I can use to replace the three blade ( broken GWS 6 blade trimmed to 3 blade ) in it now. Do y'all think the 6 blade will produce more thrust than a 3 blade?

I finished connecting the controls. I hooked up the 2S 180mah battery and tested it all out. I throttled up the fan and let it run full for about 10 seconds a couple of time. The motor acted like it was getting stronger the more it ran. Is it possible brushless outrunners nee to go through a break in procedure?

I'll get some pictures and possibly a video of it later. I want y'all to listen to it and tell me what you think.

g
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 12:05 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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Well I do believe I named this thread incorrectly. Should have called it "The Ever Evolving, Never Ending He-162 EDF Thread"

I've exceeded my AUW goal by about 150%. Paint must weigh a lot more than I considered. And since the Dollar Tree version @ around 100g wouldn't fly on the same power system it's time to consider an alternate power source.

So, out with the 30mm and in with the 40mm.

Going with this motor I purchased a few months ago :http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=14555 and a GWS 40mm EDF assembly.

Can't decide about the rotor. I have a 50mm that can be cut down. I believe the vanes are beefier than the 40mm rotors, and will flex less. Or just go with the 40mm rotor and bore the hole to fit the shaft. Any thoughts?

g
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 05:06 PM
Team30 Micro EDF
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Adelaide, Australia
Joined Apr 2004
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Crikey Giuseppi!! Is the motor big enough?

The kV is no where near high enough. Got anything else in the hobby box you can use?
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 06:26 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NitroCharged View Post
Crikey Giuseppi!! Is the motor big enough?

The kV is no where near high enough. Got anything else in the hobby box you can use?
Yeah, I've been finding that out the hard way. Got nothing else I can use unless you think the motor I have for the 30mm will work.

Or I'll wait a couple weeks until this arrives: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=p5197.c0.m619

On the bright side, I am getting an education.

I also have this : http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=6551

and this: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...idProduct=5358

that I'm willing to try my hand at rewinding but am in serious need of guidance.

g
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Old Jun 10, 2011, 08:57 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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Okay. Where to begin? After reading NitroCharged comments ( the "Crikey" really got my attention, lol ) I grabbed my box of EDF stuff and headed back out to the garage and sat down and thought about what I do and do not know.

More specifically, I have some idea why a 30mm and a 40mm fan need 2 to 3 times the rpm/kV that a 50mm needs, but I'm not positive about it. Maybe someone can explain it to me.

Anyway, after having a look at the 40mm impeller that I'd installed on the 4200kV motor and realizing it'd be more hassle than it's worth to adapt it to the Turnigy 1220 10200kV motor I grabbed a fresh 40mm impeller out of the box.

To my surprise/delight it turns out the hole and the shaft are a near perfect fit. It's not tight enough to be a press fit but it does require pressure to fit it on the shaft and a drop of CA fixes it permanently.

I then hooked everything up and checked that nothing rubbed and it ran true.

Then I put everything back in the airframe and hooked the battery up again to make sure everything was still working.

Here's where I made a mistake but nothing disastrous. I took it outside and throttled up and gave it a toss. It never attempted to move on it's own and nosed right in about 15 feet away.

The fan popped out of the nacelle and the nose dented in a bit. The battery, (2s 800mAh) was too heavy and too far forward as well. Even if it could fly with a battery as heavy as it is there is no room to place it back far enough to balance correctly.

If I hadn't messed up my 2S 180mAh battery earlier in an attempt to add a third cell to it I would have test flown it with it. I have a 2S 350mAh that will probably work but isn't charged. None of my other smaller 2S battery have the correct connector to fit the ESC.

After I picked it up to assess the damage I noticed the formers that had been left in the nacelle to accomodate the thrust tube for the 30mm fan were restricting the airflow.

After removing the formers I connected the battery again, but this time left it outside the fuselage. I slowly increased the throttle and generated enough thrust to rock the nose forward. So I went ahead and glued the fan in the nacelle.

One thing I noticed is the ESC was getting a bit warm so it may be necessary to increase to more than a 10amp controller.

I think i may finally be on the right track.

g
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:11 AM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
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I did a couple more things.

I mounted my other Turnigy 1220 10300kv inrunner in another HK EDF 30 Ducted Housing w/ GWS 6 blade fan.

I also built a thrust stand.

I mounted the motor a little differently than before. The spacing of the holes in the housing and motor don't line up exactly requiring the holes in the housing to be reamed and countersunk.

Instead I chucked the housing in my little Harbor Freight Mini Wood Lathe and turned the center of the mount to just under 12mm to allow the motor can to press fit in the mount. I added a couple drops of CA for insurance.

I also had to remove a bit of the fan's blades to clear the housing. The lathe is handy for that as well.

I mounted the jet in the thrust stand. The 40mm fan with the Turnigy 1220 10300kv motor and a 3S 640mah 20C LiPo is only making 29g of thrust. It runs smoothly, so I don't think balance is an issue. The motor, I think, is just not powerful enough.

The 30mm fan was mounted on the stand and on 2S 350mah 20C LiPo is making 79g thrust.

AUW with the 350mah battery is 137.3g

Is 79g thrust enough to sustain flight in a 137g airframe?

Is there a simple guideline between the relationship of thrust to weight?

I read somewhere that a 33% thrust to weight ratio is enough to sustain the flight of an EDF jet. 1lb of thrust to 3lb weight.

g
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 12:06 PM
Suspended Account
United States, PA, Grove City
Joined Jan 2011
751 Posts
Nice build. I like the Dollar Store glider origins. I bashed mine from the remaining fuse of a FlyZone Mosquito.
Bill
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Old Jun 19, 2011, 01:12 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
1,369 Posts
Hey, Bill. Nice Heinkel. Yeah, the dollar glider started it off then I couldn't find 'em for $1.00 anymore. So' it's become a different animal entirely.

What are yours' dimensions, power system etc.

I did some more surgery on mine this morning. I cut out the 40mm fan and replaced it with the just built 30mm. The glue is setting up now.

I have some single 240mah 20C batteries on the way from China. I'm gonna build a couple 3S packs. Maybe even a 4S.


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Old Jun 19, 2011, 10:23 PM
CV-15 VB-16
giuseppi's Avatar
USA, TX, Friendswood
Joined Jul 2007
1,369 Posts
After removing the GWS 40mm w/ Turnigy 1220 10300kv motor I put it on the thrust stand and with a 2S 450mah 12c battery and HK 10a ESC it's producing 84g of thrust. It was only making about 30g thrust while mounted in the model.

Could the opening in the front of the nacelle be restricting the air flow and need to be increased.

Any thoughts from you micro gurus out there?

g
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