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Old Aug 28, 2005, 01:52 AM
Who's your Slope Daddy !
DSSlopeGuru's Avatar
Alta Vista Ca
Joined May 2003
379 Posts
Epp Slope Combat

Hello, I was curious if anyone would be interested in a lil epp Slope Combat? Open to all types of epp foam planes and wings. I tried to contact a local group who will remain nameless...LOL....and they told me they only did PSS type planes and NO WINGS. Well ok......I guess if they are scared of a lil zagi then so be it. its not like mine is glassed and full of Carbon and Kevlar.......I dont think ? LOL Hey I offered to be the target drone, but they passed. Anyway heres my plan.
1. Open top all types of aircraft (foamies)
2. No size restriction (with-in reason)
3. Cost is 1.00 or 2.00 bucks in the cookie jar per flight
4. winner is determined by being last man flying?
5. oh ya........winner gets the cookie jar

I am not sure this is going to work, but if you might be interested or have a better idea, let me know and we can plan a day of Combat, BBQ and cold drinks
Thanks T.J.
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Old Aug 28, 2005, 02:08 AM
It pays to be a winner
Keith R.'s Avatar
T-Town, AZ
Joined Jun 2004
1,733 Posts
I'm intrested (if i coud get a ride up there ). Sounds like the ideal combat to me TJ . Come down to Bluff Park and i'll be able to attend a nice combat compatition.

Were is it going to be?

-Keith
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 10:25 AM
Who's your Slope Daddy !
DSSlopeGuru's Avatar
Alta Vista Ca
Joined May 2003
379 Posts
This is a one time bump........and I will then put it to rest if no one is interested. I guess no one wants to crash foam
T.J.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 11:20 AM
slope-a-holic
aneigher24's Avatar
Oak Park, CA
Joined Mar 2005
577 Posts
Im sure i woudl love to come down and fly a bit of combat... we should have it at grass mtn... lots of air and an ancual slope face to go down in if need be...plus my dad who only started flying a month or two ago loves combating with me so hes in too...

When and where??

@lex
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 11:41 AM
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Chief High Horse's Avatar
Orange County, CA
Joined Oct 2004
3,509 Posts
I'm in and can probably come up with two or three others guys with me. Sounds like fun!
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 01:46 PM
Who's your Slope Daddy !
DSSlopeGuru's Avatar
Alta Vista Ca
Joined May 2003
379 Posts
Well are right then. I am glad to see this is getting a lil more interest. Now this wouldn't be a party without KingOfTheHill.......Hey JOe what do you say? And the rest of you guys......put the glass & carbon down and come and play with foam for a day. I am open to most any spot.......but hence the name "HIGH DESERT SLOPE COMBAT"
It kinda has a nice ring to it, so lets keep it up here. I am open to dates.....some time in Sept? I found a basic set of slope combat rules.......is this something we need? or every man for himself lol T.J.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 03:58 PM
Something MUST FLY!
IMoonBark's Avatar
OC, there is no "The OC"
Joined Jun 2004
1,070 Posts
Location , location , location.... where did you say you want to do this?

Badger, badger, badger...
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 04:56 PM
Ninja of the Nasty
KingOfTheHill's Avatar
Joined Jan 2004
10,642 Posts
you can count me in...

grass MT is probably not the BEST choice for combat, considering the HUGE backside you can loose your plane in, and the lift band is a fair bit out over the super rough brush stuff that you cant crawl through without getting torn up...

i would say parker because most of the DS guys have been going to vincent for summer flying, parker will be more forgiving with wind directions, and retrieval is easy on both sides...

i would suggest Parker or Little Mt.....

JOe
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 07:43 PM
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timmig's Avatar
Southern California
Joined Sep 2003
6,901 Posts
No size restriction? So one of those giant wings can fly? A Mother ship? Combats fun-- and it's good you're setting up your own event. Not beating on the local club to change their rules for you. Fear is not a factor-- choice of equipment is. Any size wing? really? That should make it really interesting. Where and when?
Timmig
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 07:48 PM
Ninja of the Nasty
KingOfTheHill's Avatar
Joined Jan 2004
10,642 Posts
lol, seriously....

plane size rules should be in effect...

previous combat events ive heard of have stated, no larger that 52" in span, and 3pounds...

any size chord, any size tips, just 52" span or less and under 3lbs.

JOe
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 08:21 PM
Who's your Slope Daddy !
DSSlopeGuru's Avatar
Alta Vista Ca
Joined May 2003
379 Posts
OK here is the site rules........Let me know if these are ok or if we need to change them up a lil. Remember this is supposed to be fun. I am in now way trying to dog any of the OTHER clubs out there .

Hey Timmy not a problem....... "and it's good you're setting up your own event. Not beating on the local club to change their rules for you. Fear is not a factor--

Very true there is NO FEAR HERE !!!!!!!! I just want to fly with everyone and this way....if I hit you by accident, then so be it......no hard feelings its combat lol and if I knock you all out of the sky......then the cookie jar is mine T.J.

GUIDELINES FOR SLOPE COMBAT FLYING
The purpose of Slope Combat is to encourage an improvement in the flying skills of pilots particularly in the ability to judge their model's separation from the ground and it's position relative to other models or obstructions whilst flying. Slope Combat encourages it's participants to appreciate the suitability of the sites from which they fly their models with due consideration for the topographical features, other flyers and any spectators.

The following guidelines are put forward as a basis for safe and fair Combat Flying whether for fun or in competition.

1. GENERAL MODEL CHARACTERISTICS:

Models must be unpowered gliders not fitted with I/C engines, electric motors, rockets or other form of propulsion.




IMPERIAL METRIC
Max. Span; 50 inches 1,270 mm
Max. Wing Loading 12 oz/sq.ft 49gm/sq.dm
Max. Model Weight 35 ounces 1,008 gm


2. No ballast, other than that required to establish either the fore and aft or lateral centre of gravity of the model, may be added either temporarily or permanently to increase flying speed. Where ballast is added to adjust the centre of gravity of the model the maximum total weight of ballast added must not exceed 4 ounces, 115 gm.

3. MODEL CONSTRUCTION:

A. Models should be of generally all foam construction, preferably Expanded Polypropylene Foam (EPP), and, where covered, the covering should be of flexible plastic or parcel tape type materials. No rigid covering material, wood, GRP or vacuum formed plastic are permitted.

B. The fuselage may have longerons of any material provided the total cross section area of all longerons does not exceed ½sq.inch, 161sq.mm, and their forward end/s are not less than 2inch, 50.8mm, from the nose of the model. The nose block should have a minimum radius of ½inch, 12·7mm, vertically and ½inch, 12.7mm, laterally and not be made of wood, rigid plastic or other hard material. Only foam, RTV (silicone), polysulphide rubber, cork etc. are allowed.

C. Wings may have main spars of any material as above. The total cross section area of all spars must not exceed ¾sq.inch, 363sq.mm,. There must be no rigid structural member, i.e. wood or cfk leading edge or leading edge sheeting, ahead of the mainspar and the mainspar must not be located less than 20% of the chord from the leading edge of the wing at any point. Ideally the forward 20% of the wing should be made of EPP foam covered with a flexible material.

D. All wing spar outer ends must stop not less than 2inch, 50.8mm, from each wing tip. No rigid materials i.e. wood, GRP or vacuum formed plastic are to be used for the wing tips. Flying wings fitted with tip fins made of fluted plastic material should have the fin edges 'rounded' by application of a silicone bead or by securing flexible tubing to the edges.

E. Servos should be securely fixed, not just wedged into place. Where quick links are exposed, either at the control horn or servo arm end, the quick link should be sleeved or taped to prevent accidental disconnection. It is recommended that steering servo savers, as used on electric model racing cars, be used on servo outputs connected to the two primary steering controls. Where push rods are exposed for any distance, i.e. on top or bottom of wing, then a suitable guard should be fitted to minimise the chance of the rod being bent or detached so causing loss of control.

F. Special care must be taken with the location and fixing of heavy items such as the radio battery or balance weight/s. All parts of the battery, balance weight/s and any box or structure to secure them must be located not less than 2 inches, 50.8mm, from the nose of the model. With swept flying wings having no fuselage no part of any such heavy item or supporting structure may be located less than 2 inches, 50.8mm, from the nearest point on the leading edge measured perpendicular to the leading edge of the wing.

G. All batteries and balance weight/s must be secured by an adequate safety strap secured to a 'strong point' within the model (wing fixing or fuselage keel for instance) to ensure that there is no likelihood of such heavy items falling away from the model whilst in flight.

THE ABOVE ITEMS MUST BE CONSIDERED ESSENTIALSAFETY REQUIREMENTS.

4. FLYING SITE CONSIDERATIONS:

A. General

i Not all slope sites will be suitable for Combat flying. The following aspects should be given careful consideration when assessing their suitability.

a) The proximity of a road, railway line, footpath, picnic area, public viewing or observation point or car park in the area ahead of, to each side of or behind the proposed flying site where a models may come to earth.

b) The proximity of private houses and gardens, schools, factories or other structures or enclosed areas immediately ahead or to the side of or behind the proposed flying site where a models may come to earth.

c) Access to the proposed flying site by the general public. If the general public have unrestricted access do 'you' have the necessary authority to establish a 'safe' spectator area? If you do not have the authority to establish such an area that site should be considered unsuitable for Combat Flying.

ii If any of the above conditions apply then the site being evaluated is unlikely to be suitable for Combat Flying.

NOTE 1: Most National Trust sites are unlikely to be suitable for Combat Flying because of unrestricted public access and 'your' inability to control this access.

NOTE 2: Where the site is on 'Common Land' it is against Common Law to establish any area, even to ensure the safety of individuals, which seeks to deny access to any part of that area of common land to any person without the express permission of the controlling conservators or commoners.

NOTE 3:Whilst Slope Combat Flying is a legitimate model flying activity, it is known that the CAA are concerned about the possible consequences of the activity. Before embarking on Combat Flying we strongly recommend that every pilot should carefully consider how they would defend their flying if an action is taken against them by the CAA under ANO 56, following receipt of a complaint of endangering from a member of the general public. Please remember you do not have to hit and injure a person to endanger them!

A. Where a site is deemed suitable for Combat Flying the following guidelines should be followed:

i) A Safety Line as for F3b and F3f should be established along the line of the hill.

ii) The Pilot's Operating line should be behind the Safety Line.

iii) A second Safety (Spectator) Line should be established at least 10 yards, 9 metres, behind the Pilots Operating line. Any public footpaths, spectator area and pits should be located behind this line.

iv) Where possible polite notices should be placed at either end of this Spectator Line to indicate to passers by the 'safe' side of the line on which to pass or from where to watch.

v) All combat challenges must be made to windward of the Safety Line.

B. Where a site is shared between combat and general flying an agreement about flying combat within 'exclusive slots' should be made unless the working slope is long enough to allow combat flying to be restricted to a defined area.

C. Whatever agreement is reached concerning the exclusive or shared use of a slope an agreement on the allocation of frequencies between the two groups must be reached.

THE ABOVE ITEMS MUST BE CONSIDERED NECESSARY SAFETY REQUIREMENTS.

NOTE 4: Before commencing to fly any model in combat both the flyer, and anyone organising a combat event, must ensure that they are adequately covered by a THIRD PARTY PUBLIC LIABILITY INSURANCE CERTIFICATE giving a minimum of £5,000,000 liability protection.

NOTE 5: The holding of an appropriate third party liability insurance policy in no way diminishes a pilot's or organisers' responsibility to operate at all times within the Air Navigation Orders applicable to the flying of Small (model) Aircraft and the guidance issued by the CAA in their publication CAP 658, Small (Model) Aircraft: A guide to Safe Flying.

5. SPECIAL NOTES:

DELIBERATE ATTEMPTS TO FLY ANY MODEL INTO ANY PERSON, ANIMAL OR OBJECT; OTHER THAN OTHER COMBAT MODELS, MUST NOT BE ENGAGED IN OR ALLOWED AT ANY TIME.

Remember; Slope Combat is a legitimate model flying activity but it does have safety implications beyond that of flying the models. Great care must be taken selecting the flying site for combat flying to safeguard your sport and to minimise the possibility of any action being taken against you by the CAA.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 08:39 PM
Striving to Rip the Bring
raptor22's Avatar
San Diego, socal, USA, North America, Earth, Solar System, the Orion arm, Milky way, Universe
Joined Apr 2003
6,320 Posts
Really? no ballast? Seems that, if it is within weight range, ballast should be allowed.

I think the best way to determine the winner is witha scoring system. if the last one flying wins, then anyone can just float above the action and win from doing nothing.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 09:11 PM
Who's your Slope Daddy !
DSSlopeGuru's Avatar
Alta Vista Ca
Joined May 2003
379 Posts
Very true, flying high and staying out of the way seems to be the safe bet.......but its the guy thats making all the kills is gonna have to take out the high guy to win.....right? Now lets say the low guy kills everyone, and then the high guy swoops down and kills the last low guy....well then the high guy wins? No points needed .........basic............last man flying wins. Your right....it doesnt seem fair? I also am curious.....if the wind or pilot seem to come up a bit short......and need to land and re-take off is there a point taken away? How does this work?

OK I am new to this. I was just looking for a way I could fly, and not have everyone land with wispers of "New Guy" taking off LOL
Open to any and all ideas. Beuller......Beuller.....Bueller
T.J.
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