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Old Oct 02, 2012, 12:12 PM
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Originally Posted by invertmast View Post
The reason why people build with foam more than balsa now, is bc the wind generator industry has taken over the balsa wood market. They always get the highest quality wood, and pay at a premium for it. So the quality if our wood is less.

Just 5 years ago, i could get 3/32"x6"x48" contest grade balsa for $2.50 a sheet, that same sheet is now around $6-7!

The arf industry is huge bc labor is cheap, the wood is cheap, the glue is cheap and in many cases, a few molds and fiberglass fuselages can be made cheaper than an all wood fuse. Granted, there are those arfs that are pretty expensive. But for the most part, i think the quality of most Arfs is already low. But its still cheaper and faster to buy an arf and modify it than it is to buy a kit.

The price of good balsa and plywood has shot up over the past 5-10 years and is killing the wood kits. Not to mention, the instant satisfaction needed with most of society today
I agree with this but there is one factor that you missed ,there are some of us who dont like the ordinary planes arf companys put out and we try to build weird stuff .The other thing you did not say is how long a foam plane last's compaired to a well built balsa one. I have old timers that i silked and doped that look like i finished them yesterday my scratch built foam ones look bad after flying them for a year or so. In our way of thinking i would rather buy balsa and build my own even if it costs me more ,it's my hobby building and flying them, if i wanted to save money i would collect butterflys. lmao joe
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 01:20 PM
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Joe,
I agree, i like to build things that are different as well, but the arf manufacturers are beginning to offer more varied items as well. Look at Esm, they offer a me109, fw190, lancaster, Do335 and some other unique giant scale arfs. Horizon also has the twin otter, piper pawnee and the beast. Again unique airplanes.

One thingnot mentioned about the foamie airplanes, is most of the cheap scratch-built ones are built for a different reason. They are cheap to build, which means cheap to replace. For most, that means they will do and try things they never would with a wooden airplane. The foamies are even easier to repair. In some instances, you can slam them into the ground, spend 10 minutes (or less) repairing them, then fly again!

The foamies have there own mindset as far as flying them, and most of the time its to have FUN and not have to worry about crashing them!
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 01:35 PM
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You are right intvertmast ,i build foam planes for two reasons tho .1 is so i dont get burnt out on my big balsa builds and 2 so i can go flying fast with out having to load up my bigger planes .Most of the ones i build are slow and easy to fly but i also pick out different ones that most here would not find or build. It does not worry me about flying my big builds and i have no hanger queens in my fleet but time is a factor in my life now till i finaly stop working soon. joe
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 04:49 PM
use the 4s luke, use the 4s...
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Well Im going to start re-sratch building the simple with a few mods. It is gonna have a rubber band on wing and hatch so i dont have to worry about losing the screws, a servo in the wing so it os easy to take off, maybe ill do a slightly bigger wingspan built up wing insted of the foam core one that the kit came with and probably with the next reincarnation im gonna do a stick built fuse insted of the slab side for even less weight. Is approx $4 aud alright for a 1000mm by 90mm piece of balsa alright?
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 05:31 PM
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Hey you guys who like building in the traditional materials, be sure to vote on the starting of a new Forum entitled: "Balsa and Lite Ply Scratch and Kit Build Forum"

Question: What are the chances people will vote no, because they build in Foam; or, Fiberglass, or two by fours, or concrete block? Which further begs question, if your not interested in building in the traditional methods, why would you be interested in even taking time to VOTE?
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 05:38 PM
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Vote on starting of a new....... ?
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Mode One View Post
Hey you guys who like building in the traditional materials, be sure to vote on the starting of a new Forum entitled: "Balsa and Lite Ply Scratch and Kit Build Forum"

Question: What are the chances people will vote no, because they build in Foam; or, Fiberglass, or two by fours, or concrete block? Which further begs question, if your not interested in building in the traditional methods, why would you be interested in even taking time to VOTE?
We have had some guys who build with foam say no already and some who said another building thread would confuse them.lmao I thought to myself how they tied there shoes in the morning if a balsa build thred could confuse them. Its not like they have to walk through a building to find the threads its point and click ,daaaaaa
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 06:54 PM
use the 4s luke, use the 4s...
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And that is why i prefer balsa. Maybe they use foam becausenthey can get confused very easily what up and down is
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 10:12 PM
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Now, now, careful how you "talk".

Incidently, I voted yes, cause I think it's a good idea.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Thermalin View Post
So after 156 pages....who is introducing someone building or offering advice on a build to a new builder and buildling along with someone?
Well.............. yes I've helped a couple of guys out on a pretty regular basis the last couple of years. Answered a ton of questions on the phone and E-Mails.

Given 2 guys a taste of hot wire cutting here at home. Its amazing how fast they learn when someone shows them in person, rather then watching a video.One guy now has " another weapon " in his quiver, the other now has more " Latitude" to build with!

I think a lot of people would build if they thought that they could, but for some reason feel that they can't. Once they find out where to start they do very well!

I don't think it matters much if a model is " Foam" and that includes many different ways in itself, Balsa or is a Moldie. Honestly , I think that a larger number of people are building now then they were even 5 years ago, or at least it seems that way to me.

Blue Skies...........................Tim
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 07:12 AM
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Well, here's some evidence that building is alive ... at least in East Yorkshire.

Here's my "floorboard plane"... all wooden structure salvaged from a skip. The metal cowl is from a biscuit tin and is secured by bike' spokes. Elevator and rudder hinges (not shown in photos) are made from "recycled" aluminium, salvaged from my mate's Opticians Shop.

Span is 74". Weight is 3lbs and 12oz ... but I need to cover it and add the flight pack. Approx 6.5 square feet of wing. Hoping to keep the auw below 5lbs. Will be nylon and dope covering. Loads of wires required to keep things stiff. There will be at least 8 flying wires and 4 landing wires. Plus, there is wire bracing to the undercarriage structure.

There is some commercially-provided plywood involved; but not much. With the benefit of hindsight, I realise that I could have done without that plywood. Next time, maybe. When I can source a good bit of hardwood, I'll turn up some home-made wheels... the commercial ones will have to do until then.

Yes, it's risky taking photos before the beast has flown ... I don't normally do that, but the structure is so pleasing to me that I want a record of it.

Obviously, this is going to be a light-weather model, so it might be quite a while before I get the chance to fly it. Anyways, I need decent weather for the covering, 'cos I have to do it outside ... can't tolerate doping indoors.

I hope you lot appreciate this ... it took me ages to get those photos. And, the dog is not best pleased, 'cos I had to steal her blanket to use as a back-drop.


.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 08:59 AM
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Illinois
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mode One View Post
Hey you guys who like building in the traditional materials, be sure to vote on the starting of a new Forum entitled: "Balsa and Lite Ply Scratch and Kit Build Forum"

Question: What are the chances people will vote no, because they build in Foam; or, Fiberglass, or two by fours, or concrete block? Which further begs question, if your not interested in building in the traditional methods, why would you be interested in even taking time to VOTE?
I voted NO because I think ADDING a forum is stupid. Just rename this one.

Andy
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 09:37 AM
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And why is it "stupid"?

The builders forum is for "Discussion of RC model building techniques, including scratchbuilding, kits, plans, and related tools, machining, etc."

This would be for just BUILDING with balsa and/or ply. The builders workshop should be about the workshop IMO.

And again I would like to mention that there is a Foamies (kits) and a Foamies (scratchbuilt) forums. Two separate forums.

Robert
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 12:24 PM
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I voted yes. There aren't very many foam airplane designs I'm interested in building. Keith Sparks' stuff is pretty amazing and there are a couple of others who actually 'craft' foam into shapes just like crafting balsa but most foamy scratchbuilds look like the box they came in.
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Old Oct 03, 2012, 01:36 PM
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Illinois
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingconsulting View Post
And why is it "stupid"?

The builders forum is for "Discussion of RC model building techniques, including scratchbuilding, kits, plans, and related tools, machining, etc."

This would be for just BUILDING with balsa and/or ply. The builders workshop should be about the workshop IMO.

And again I would like to mention that there is a Foamies (kits) and a Foamies (scratchbuilt) forums. Two separate forums.

Robert
Hi Robert,

I already answered your "why" question in my previous post. I guess you need more detail, so I will allow you to infer it from the following nominations.

I hereby nominate YOU to sort through THIS forum and identify all the non-building-related threads to the new forum.

I also nominate YOU to keep track of both forums, and report when items appear in the wrong forum.

Finally, I nominate YOU to teach people how to properly organize their thoughts so that TECHNIQUES appear in one forum, since they could not possibly be confused with MATERIALS.

Honestly, I think having the foam guys in separate forums is exactly the reason that people think "building is dying." If the foam guys were part of this forum, this thread would have been closed ages ago for its very obvious invalid concept.

By separating into various forums (and thereby separating the builders) the following occur:

1) The myth that "building is dying" is promulagated,
2) The cross-pollination that should be occurring between users of different materials is hindered,
3) Builders begin to assume they're each a Tigger ("I'm the only one") and they can more-easily be discouraged.

Now, you tell me what part about separating into Yet Another Forum is SMART?

Andy
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