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Old Mar 26, 2014, 05:25 PM
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Canada, ON, Little Britain
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Build Log
Baby Ace in 1/3rd scale.

Hi Gents.

Well I'm a way into getting all the bit's together for a 1/3rd scale Baby Ace.
This is the craft that was designed in the 1930's, the one that made home built aircraft a feature for so many in the world - see image.

I have an issue with getting hold of a 1/3rd scale"fake" engine of either a Continental or Lycoming, (Rotax or UL would also work for modern power plants)
Does anyone make one of these beasties?
I'm keeping her indoors happy so the beastie has got to be electric and so long as I build light it wont be an issue - 18-20 lb at a rough calculation including batteries & pilot.

To stay as close to scale the aircraft will be mimmicing the real deal,
so I've purchased a set of the real aircraft plans - it's basically a big model anyway.
Fuselage & tail surfaces to be constructed in steel tube of various diameters & thicknesses,
Wings of built up ribs with steel tube wing tips & steel parts where they were originally used on the full size craft.
Built up spars rather than 1/4" thick full height units (full size dont use this method as it cant be checked inside for any issues - we dont have this problem).
The only real departure from scale will be the wing supports as no one makes 1" x 5/16" aero tubing, so it's going to use a K&S 3/4" aly aero section sleeved over a 1/4" diameter steel tube for the strength needed - these bonded together with some rather nice high strength epoxy - DP420.
All tubing to be braised/silver soldered.
Basically I'm building a larger version of Paolo Severin's beautiful work but using the full size method of wing attachment.

Spec's are as follows.
106" Wing span.
18" Wing chord.
2 1/8" Wing rib depth.
55 1/16" Fuz Length (steel parts only).
28" Stabiliser span.
15" Rudder height.

I'll post stuff as I get it squared away/purchased parts etc. but I thought I'd ask about the engine before I go and make a 3D printed one that costs a bloomin fortune.

Rgds & I hope you all enjoy this one.

Paul
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Old Mar 26, 2014, 09:24 PM
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United States, CA, Twentynine Palms
Joined Jun 2002
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I look forward to seeing this come together. I love the early home builts and can't wait to see what you can do.

Jeff
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Old Mar 26, 2014, 10:14 PM
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Canada, ON, Little Britain
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bosley View Post
I look forward to seeing this come together. I love the early home builts and can't wait to see what you can do.

Jeff
Taking the full size n shrinking it to be honest is all I'm doing.
yup they are pleasing to the eye.

Here's a few more spec's - bit of a so far shopping list really.

Rimfire 1.60 motor.
Castle Creations Ice2 80A ESC.
Varioprop 22.5" x variable pitch prop.

Receiver - Spectrum 6ch.
Servos from Hitec - 645MG - 4x, HS55 1x.
Rudder & elevator lines will run as per the original aircraft onto the stick & pedals but to do the ailerons I'll use a mini servo to actuate the control stick and 2 normal ones built into the wing.
Not too sure on batteries for power and batteries for the radio gear but want to keep those circuits separate.

Wheels - Topmodel in France - Airtop 160mm Balloon type mains & Ecotop 1.5"tail wheel.
Aluminium wheel rims - custom designed by me & machining thanks to a friend.
UHMWP bushed to make em spin nicely.
Pilot - AH Designs 1/3rd scale Civilian style full length - I might have to do a few mod's to the clothes to match the plane - oh and I'll need a deck-chair for static displays.

All stainless steel (304 grade) tubing from either VitaNeedle in the US or McMaster Carr - various thicknesses and diameters corresponding as close as I can to scale in thickness and diameter.

Spruce & ply for the wing ribs/spars - built up style as per original.
there will be a small amount of laser cut ply for parts that were cut from ply originally.
I'll use Birch even though it's heavy as it's immensely strong - Toronto Laser cutters are great for this.

Covering in Solartex - white.
Rib tapes/patches & stitching from Mick Reeves Models in the UK.

Glass fiber nose/cowl I'll custom make.
Fake Infernal combustion engine ???????? HELP!!!!

Control wires - fishing trace nylon coated braided steel 80lb - Canadian Tire.
If I need to get stronger it's not an issue

Nuts/bolts/washers & various fasteners - McMaster Carr.

Phew - enough for the evening.
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Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:10 AM
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USA, NC, Clayton
Joined Feb 2001
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heres a really nice source for dummy engines

http://www.topnotchkits.com/index_files/TN_Kit11.htm
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Old Mar 27, 2014, 06:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Hogue View Post
heres a really nice source for dummy engines

http://www.topnotchkits.com/index_files/TN_Kit11.htm
OHHHH YOU ARE A SAINT!!!!!!!!!!!!
ordering one today.

thanks heaps.
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Old Mar 27, 2014, 12:44 PM
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It's a happy day!
I ordered my dummy engine from John at Top Notch Kits.
should be up to me in a week or so.
everything i've read suggests it's a great package to work with.
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Old Mar 29, 2014, 06:05 AM
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Traverse City, Michigan
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The Top Notch kit can be build into a nice dummy engine.

You have an interesting project, one I've dreamed about myself. If you don't mind if a wet fuel guy hanging around, I'll follow your progress.
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Old Mar 29, 2014, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TomCrump View Post
The Top Notch kit can be build into a nice dummy engine.

You have an interesting project, one I've dreamed about myself. If you don't mind if a wet fuel guy hanging around, I'll follow your progress.
LOL no issues to wet fuel people
used to be one myself - just petrol doesn't go nicely in the house and the missus is an aircraft nut so as long as they don't smell of fuel and aren't sticky she's a happy bunny - who am I to argue...

Parts will get done slowly over the next year or so there is no rush going on here.

Spent a few evenings last week getting all the steel plate work from the full size plans into CAD, so I can get it laser cut at a local friend/vendor - CNC Profiles in Port Perry Ontario.
Tom is great and also an artist so he enjoys the fiddly stuff,
all the flat stock parts will be laid out onto a tree/sprue and anything that falls away is scrap.
the bits I want are then all on one sheet connected with a small tab - I can just side cutter them off just like a plastic kit - images to come next week of the CAD.
I'll get the sheet cut and take Images of that too when I get it sorted.
it just beats the hell out of hand cutting 1mm stainless steel.
Formed parts are old school hand bent or shaped.
Bending the tubes will be done with wire rope/cable slid inside of it to stop the tube collapsing,
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Old Apr 03, 2014, 03:54 PM
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The Top Notch kit has arrived.
I'll keep all posted on the covers progress for this mini model part.
John is a real nice chap - I got a free thickness guage in the box that'll come in very handy.

I did some laying out for the steel sheet - all 1.0mm thick.
the main square is 1ft so it gives an idea of scale,
the larger of the holes are 3.0mm the smaller are 2.4mm,
I still have to join all the parts together with 2mm wide runners that'll be clipped off when I want the part, gentle file on the sharp edge and then weld onto the tubes.
lots of cutting so it wont be cheap - but after an hour or so it'll be done.
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Old Apr 03, 2014, 04:02 PM
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A bit more for tonight.

The rims have been designed for the wheels - stronger than the plastic ones and only 3 bolts to assemble.
They also have bushings pressed in to ensure they spin properly/smoothly.
The axle will be a stainless steel part - again 304 as it silver solders/brazes easily.
and strength in this instance really isnt an issue - we are so over the top...
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Old Apr 03, 2014, 10:45 PM
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This will be interesting. Subscribing in.

raipe
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Old Apr 04, 2014, 01:12 PM
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I forgot that I hadnt posted any colour schemes for the beastie.
so these are here purely for reference purposes.
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Old Apr 08, 2014, 11:51 PM
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United States, NE, Kearney
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I am about 60% of the way on a 1/4 scale Baby Ace.
The version you show in post #12 is a "C" model which I have selected also.
The C is essentially a whole bunch of Cub parts adapted to the Corben fuselage. The wings are still Corben, but with different tips and ailerons from the Cub or "B" model.
The tail feathers are Cub, as is the gear, cowl, and powerplant installation.


I started with a Great Planes, "D" version. The "D" is a side by side, 2 seat, squared off tail bits, again, different wing tips, and a pressure cowl configuration (like a Super-Cub).
I have scaled down images of the full scale plans for the "C".
Comparing the model plans with the full size, the wingspan and cord are fairly close to 1/4 scale.
But checking the fuselage dimensions, the kit is slightly less than 1/4 scale from the nose to the cabanes, but grossly short from the cockpit to the tailpost.

Knowing the errors, I plunged forward. Some of the wing detail had to be adapted to get the ailerons and tips into proper configuration. The wing is a true 2 piece like the real plane. The cabanes and lift struts are all fully load bearing.Name: Corben_002.jpg
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Description:

All the tail feathers were re-drawn and scaled to 1/4 scale of the original "C" model.
If there's going to be a dawnfall to this model, it'll be the smallish tailgroup hung on a short tail moment. All I can do is hope there's enough "back there" to keep the nose going where it needs to go.

I ditched the SuperCub cowl and got a 1/4 scale regular Cub cowl from Balsa USA. It'll hide a Turnigy sk3 5055-470 kv . Battery power will be 5 cell, 5000 mAh. I have room to stack a couple of them into the fuselage if I need more duration.

One other thing I did. The cowl mounts to the firewall with 6 small #4 sheet metal screws.
On the back side of the firewall, I used extruded aluminum angle pieces that slide snugly inside the fuselage and held in place through the side of the fuse with 6-32 allen bolts.
To load the batteries, I remove the whole nose assembly...Name: Corben_Firewall 002.jpg
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I bought a fully functional gear set from the Hanger 9 SuperCub. That's all fit and ready.Name: Corben_.jpg
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I'm guessing it'll weight 10 pounds with one battery; 11-1/2 pounds with both batteries.

The other reason I built the nose the way I did was to be able to easily access the front of the fuselage for later adapting a sound system into the plane.
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Old Apr 09, 2014, 08:17 AM
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Hey she's cool.

Nice work & good on ya for taking the plunge & ignoring "modellers conventions" of enlarging the tail surfaces and stretching the Fuz.
Did the original fly without the need of auto stabilisation & computers? - I think so!
therefore the model should fly just as well - at least at these larger scales they do.
Rather than take off the whole nose, see if you can put a "post hole" for the battery/batterys in the bottom of the firewall and then hinge or remove the lower cowling to gain access (cowl clips as per original?)
It would be more structural and less prone to alignment changes with the mounting/re-mounting of the motor assy.

Keep up the good work and please keep posting your news...

Yup a C model is nice - the B is good too,
but I liked the look of the C's tail surfaces.
The missus has decided that she'll be in a natural linen & red scheme so I have to get Mick Reeves in the UK to send me 20m of linen Solartex (and more rib tapes just to make sure!)
yet again this isnt going to be a quick or cheap project - but then I never told her indoors that model making was.
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Old Apr 09, 2014, 10:40 AM
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Traverse City, Michigan
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If you're interested Balsa USA has 10 meter rolls of linen Solartex. http://shop.balsausa.com/product_p/549.htm

Pink-it has rib tapes made from Solartex. http://www.pink-it.net/

You would probably get your order sooner, by ordering from them, as they are geographically closer to you.

I've compared the Reeves tapes to Pink-ir tapes, and feel that Pink-it has a nicer product, with sharper "pinks".

Just a suggestion, if you are interested.
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