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Old Sep 09, 2012, 09:50 AM
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United States, AR, Benton
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Guardian in EFlite Super Cub 25

? I just installed the Guardian 2D/3D in an EFlite Super Cub 25. I followed the Manual directions - set Axis Gain Dials at about half way, correcting rudder to CCW for reversed servo. All corrections are in the proper direction. I have the Master Gain on a rotary proportional channel on my Futaba 8FG, currently set at "0" (medium) and theMode/Config Switch on a three position toggle. I am using the Dual Ail Wing Configuration with the Differential programmed in the Tx to EFlite's recommendation. I set triple rates consistent with the manual with minimal (10% expo on higher rates) and 0 on low. My question concerns using Flap to Elevator mix to avoid "ballooning" on deployment. The flaps are not run through the 2D/3D, but of course the Elevator is. My guess is that when in active mode the Guardian should resistist pitch up when flaps deploy, but would have no influence when stabilization is disabled. If I add TX mix it should work regardles of Mode selection, just reduce need when deployed iwhen either 2D or 3D is selected. I am also planning to use Auto Turn Coordination Iin 2D Mode) which should smooth 2D buffered flight. Every thing appears to be working as expected. Should I program Flap to Ele mix?? BTW I have set "Level Flight and Trim" using a center bubble level (available at Home Depot, indicates pitch and roll status simultaneously!) mounted in the plane with the Guardian, a very useful tool.

Any suggestions before maiden flight (hope to Tuesday)??
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 10:14 AM
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If you have 3D Heading Hold enabled, then no need to mix elevator with flaps. If you have 3D heading Hold disabled (Rate mode) then yes, you need the elevator mixed with flaps.

It is my personal preference to start your gyro experiance with 3D Heading Hold disabled. Because it is more like normal flying than Heading Hold enabled. Also, I think (I never experimented) but 3D heading hold enabled may fight the differential.
If you find the nose pitching up in a turn, coordinate your turns with rudder. Heck, a cub should be flown with rudder in the turns anyway so try getting used to it. Just know that you will have to look for how it reacts when you bank the plane for a turn is all I'm pointing out. Every plane will be different. And with differential, it will help. Just the difference is less in rate mode is all.
good luck.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 02:14 PM
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OK, I did a search and couldn't find it. I am not using the master gain (left unconnected) and I have maxed out the roll pot and I still want to try it at a higher setting. Can the master gain be reset to a higher 'default" setting? In other words is there a way to turn up the master gain and then fly without it connected to a channel of my receiver?

Thanks.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Melnic View Post
I think (I never experimented) but 3D heading hold enabled may fight the differential.
Guardian seems to do just fine with differential. I have a Fancy Foam 42" P47 and had to use differential (set adjusting up and down aileron travels individually, DX7s) and a bit of down elevator with aileron mix to get nice axial rolls. With Guardian turned on (3D Heading Hold) you can see the results of changing both differential and the aileron to elevator mix.

I Have a 26" flying wing also with mixes for throttle to elevator and throttle to aileron so it will fly straight from stall speed to flat out. Both set with Guardian off then turning Guardian on and doing a trim reset. At least in 3D Heading Hold the mixes seem to be necessary. Might be a gain thing as the flying wing won't take much gain without flapping.

This is using 3D Heading Hold. 2D is just too "locked down", even on minimal settings, for my purposes.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Crist Rigotti View Post
I am not using the master gain (left unconnected) and I have maxed out the roll pot and I still want to try it at a higher setting. Can the master gain be reset to a higher 'default" setting?
I believe you'll need to hook Guardian to your laptop and increase the "Derivative Gain".
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
I have maxed out the roll pot and I still want to try it at a higher setting.
Why not increase the throw by going out a hole on the servo arm or in a hole on the control horn?

I believe most overestimate how much correctilon the Guardian needs to be able to supply.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 03:52 PM
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I believe most overestimate how much correctilon the Guardian needs to be able to supply.
I'm amazed he wants more gain. I have Guardians on 3 planes and none will get near max gain without flapping their wings.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by t.edwards View Post
I'm amazed he wants more gain. I have Guardians on 3 planes and none will get near max gain without flapping their wings.
This is a Guardian 2D/3D not the regular Guardian.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 05:09 PM
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This is a Guardian 2D/3D not the regular Guardian.
That's what I have and was referring to. Guardian 2D/3D. Should have spelled it out I guess but being in a Guardian 2D/3D specific thread...
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 06:05 PM
First to go over 106K feet
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Originally Posted by t.edwards View Post
I believe you'll need to hook Guardian to your laptop and increase the "Derivative Gain".
Where in the Guardian menu is the derivative gain setting?

The only setting like that is in the Safety Menu. At least that I'm aware of.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Crist Rigotti View Post
Where in the Guardian menu is the derivative gain setting?
Pg 11, item #8 in the manual.

If you hook up your laptop it's item #4 on the 3D page (tab). Default setting is the mid-point, 5.
See page 13 in the manual.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by JDougherty, Erie View Post
? I just installed the Guardian 2D/3D in an EFlite Super Cub 25. I followed the Manual directions - set Axis Gain Dials at about half way, correcting rudder to CCW for reversed servo. All corrections are in the proper direction. I have the Master Gain on a rotary proportional channel on my Futaba 8FG, currently set at "0" (medium) and theMode/Config Switch on a three position toggle. I am using the Dual Ail Wing Configuration with the Differential programmed in the Tx to EFlite's recommendation. I set triple rates consistent with the manual with minimal (10% expo on higher rates) and 0 on low. My question concerns using Flap to Elevator mix to avoid "ballooning" on deployment. The flaps are not run through the 2D/3D, but of course the Elevator is. My guess is that when in active mode the Guardian should resistist pitch up when flaps deploy, but would have no influence when stabilization is disabled. If I add TX mix it should work regardles of Mode selection, just reduce need when deployed iwhen either 2D or 3D is selected. I am also planning to use Auto Turn Coordination Iin 2D Mode) which should smooth 2D buffered flight. Every thing appears to be working as expected. Should I program Flap to Ele mix?? BTW I have set "Level Flight and Trim" using a center bubble level (available at Home Depot, indicates pitch and roll status simultaneously!) mounted in the plane with the Guardian, a very useful tool.

Any suggestions before maiden flight (hope to Tuesday)??
I plan to use a Guardian on my Super Cub 25e as well and will be interested in your set-up and expeiences with it. Please post details!! Where did you mount it? Do you have the cockpit kit? Thanks!
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 07:12 PM
First to go over 106K feet
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USA, IA, North Liberty
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t.edwards View Post
Pg 11, item #8 in the manual.

If you hook up your laptop it's item #4 on the 3D page (tab). Default setting is the mid-point, 5.
See page 13 in the manual.
OK, I'm only flying in the 2D mode. Do you think the 3D setting would affect the 2D mode?
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Crist Rigotti View Post
OK, I'm only flying in the 2D mode. Do you think the 3D setting would affect the 2D mode?
I think gain is gain but I can't say for sure. If you want to find out I'd suggest making a big change like from 5 to 1 or 5 to 10 and see. That much change should be very obvious. You can always change it back.

In 2D, which I don't really like after having tried it, I set the Heading Hold real low, to 1 or 2. Then enabled Center Stick Stabilization Only Mode, and set it down to 1 or 2. It was still plenty stabilized but started to have some response to the sticks and "fought" stick inputs less.
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Old Sep 09, 2012, 09:51 PM
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First Guardian flights - mediocre

I finally got my 3DHS Edge 540 in the air today. I dialed the various gains in over a couple of flights. It took almost full elevator gain to get the pitch to oscillate and I never could get yaw to oscillate.

In 2D mode it flew nice and flat but if I tried to steer with rudder it leaned out of the turn? I had to steer with aileron or it really would not turn.

I had hoped to use 3D mode to learn to hover better, ramping the gain channel down as I got better. I think it was worse that nothing at all. I realized the gains might need to be higher for such a slow speed maneuver. I dialed up the derivative gain, played with all the other gains again but overall it really was not impressive.

My clunky primitive FY-20A as limited as it is performs better in 3D mode. I am hoping somebody can point out something to try.
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