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Old Mar 10, 2011, 05:30 PM
Extreme CNC Alloy EDF
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Australia
Joined Mar 2006
11,356 Posts
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South East Model Products, is this acceptable?

Recently I ordered a thrust stand from Larry Epifiano at SOUTH EAST MODEL PRODUCTS, I asked all the questions, he answered with photo of what I would get.

Photos below show what I was supposed to get (minus the fan and gauge) and what I ended up with. Now on the surface the end product might not look "that different" but I can tell you this is not the case!

His last email actually edmitted to rushing the job as he had accepted some 6month job interstate and ran out of time.... and then offered to clean it up if I sent it back and paid all shipping costs (another $200.00) and waited until August/September for him to come back from the job and fix all his mistakes!!

Next post shows all the reasons why you should avoid this guy, his shoddy workmanship and his lies as to what you will actually get.
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Old Mar 10, 2011, 05:32 PM
Extreme CNC Alloy EDF
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Australia
Joined Mar 2006
11,356 Posts
Apon unpacking the stand I found many mistakes, some of which are unnacceptable in a $500.00 (plus paypal fees plus shipping = $637.00) product that is supposedly "precision made in the USA"


First up the side panels, held on with 2 bolts, 2 of which have been drilled and tapped out of alignment and actually protrude into the machined rails of the base plate.

The bas
eplate arrived damaged, the bearings had been bashing up and down on it and dug out the sides of the slots right where you would want the carriage to sit, total mess and all due to the very poor packing, if he had even put a sheet of cardboard between the base and carriage it would have survived better.


The panelling is all scratched to hell, its been heavily scribed so it can be hand machined, rough too I might add, I can and do better on my own mini mill. The stand is supposed to have a clean brushed finish, look at the photo in the first post sent by Larry, "This is what you will get minus the fan and gauge" are his exact words.


The base of the carriage has mistakes, holes bored in the wrong place and rebored as you can see in the photo below.


Bearing outer races touch the sides of the carriage and need shim washers to correctly space them.

BIG MISTAKE NO 1:
The steel shafts that screw into the side panels and hold the bearings are machined out of round so when you insert them the bearings move in an elliptical fashion, means when they are all tight the bearings do not sit on a flat surface, you need to loosen one or more to get the bearing to drop and allow the carriage to actually sit flat!! ROUGH AS GUTS WORKMANSHIP


EVEN BIGGER MISTAKE NO 2:
The holes bored and tapped for the fan mounting plates are rough and one of the rear holes has been overbored and is stripped, the first 2/3 inch of the bore has no thread at all!! How the hell do you bolt your plate down with no thread I am going to have to helicoil them all to fix this major structural problem.



Even the fan mounting plates are Rubbish, the slots are roughly machined and at one end they are oversize like he rammed the cutter into the plate and chattered the hell out of it before cutting the slot, or he bored it with a drill bit first.
Look at the photo of his mounting plates and one of the ones I had to manufacture to replace the abominations supplied. Easy to see the difference!


He didnt even supply washers for the bolts holding the plates down...


And then he tells me it costs him $300.00 in materials to build one I purchased a 12mm sheet to replace the baseplate , (The biggest part on the stand) PLUS 6 pieces for new fan mounting plates, all for $30.00 including all cutting of the panels to exact size!


The guys workmanship is the worst I have seen, he has ripped me off not only with a poorly made product, but also with $25.00 excess shipping fees which he claims is to fill the tank of his gas guzzling truck so he can go down to the post office to mail it off!
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Old Mar 10, 2011, 10:58 PM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
United States, CA, Lodi
Joined Feb 2001
4,092 Posts
Sorry you got burned. This guy has made some customers pretty upset in the past and now he's just adding to the list. That's extremely overpriced anyway isn't it?

I got ripped for $850 from a guy in Florida. I think when they are so far away, they have no fear of you.

SC
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 09:25 AM
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Joined Jun 2002
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The Whole Truth - Whose really the Thief ?

First of all, Tell the whole truth. When you first contacted me to purchase the test stand, I told you I didn't have the time to make it, in the time frame you wanted it. After I decided I would make it, I told you that it must be prepaid in advanced and it was going to take 4 to 6 months. You paid me $100 deposit, and started bugging me about when you were going to get it a couple of weeks later. I ended up making it sooner staying up late evenings to get it complete. I have made 53 of the thrust stands as of the present time. You were the only one to complain. You said the the finish was not to your satisfaction. I told you it was the same finish that the other 52 units had. The test stand I shipped you workrd flawlessly before I shipped it. In fact I included the mounting plate to mount a fish scale. THe bottom line is you had mo intention of keeping it, you bought it to copy, which you did. Now here is the real kicker. You complained to Paypal that I sold you the stand and it didn't meet your expections. Paypal took $538 out of my account and returned it to you. You were suppose to send back the stand and to this day I still haven't seen it. It jerks like you that have ruined this hobby. "YOUR A LYING CROOK" That must be an oximorone, is there an honest crook? Its bad enough having to deal with jerks here in the US, but now the Internet has opened up the world. Sure glad that extrateristal life form hasn't made themselves known. In the 10 yeras I been in business I have only had 2 complaints. I guess thats not to bad. Next time BUT IT FROM CHINA. This will be my only post on this matter, as I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed idiot.

Larry E.
SouthEast Model Products Inc.
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 11:11 AM
HAL... Open the damn doors!
jfetter's Avatar
Miramar, Florida
Joined Jul 2007
7,938 Posts
The machining is definitely sub-par but if it's true you had the payment revoked by PayPal then you do owe him sending it back. PayPal does NOT cover shipping costs, that's just the way of the world. I am somewhat disapointed though because I wanted one of these stands, Luckily I didn't pull the trigger...

Jack
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 11:28 AM
EDF all the way!
bruff's Avatar
Gilbert, Az
Joined Jun 1999
7,844 Posts
I saw one of the 1st ones. Quality is much better on it. Looks to be sub average machining on this one.
Bob
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 12:18 PM
Carbon fiber is our friend
Steve C's Avatar
United States, CA, Lodi
Joined Feb 2001
4,092 Posts
$538 for what looks like a blem/throw away part. I wouldn't boast that the other 52 units looked like that!

I've seen one in person too and it certainly didn't look as rough as the one in these pics. I wonder if someone else made it?
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 12:24 PM
There was a crease in the plan
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Joined Jun 2010
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My $10 plywood stand does the job very nicely.
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 04:13 PM
Extreme CNC Alloy EDF
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Australia
Joined Mar 2006
11,356 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by LJE4357 View Post
First of all, Tell the whole truth. When you first contacted me to purchase the test stand, I told you I didn't have the time to make it, in the time frame you wanted it. After I decided I would make it, I told you that it must be prepaid in advanced and it was going to take 4 to 6 months. You paid me $100 deposit, and started bugging me about when you were going to get it a couple of weeks later. I ended up making it sooner staying up late evenings to get it complete. I have made 53 of the thrust stands as of the present time. You were the only one to complain. You said the the finish was not to your satisfaction. I told you it was the same finish that the other 52 units had. The test stand I shipped you workrd flawlessly before I shipped it. In fact I included the mounting plate to mount a fish scale. THe bottom line is you had mo intention of keeping it, you bought it to copy, which you did. Now here is the real kicker. You complained to Paypal that I sold you the stand and it didn't meet your expections. Paypal took $538 out of my account and returned it to you. You were suppose to send back the stand and to this day I still haven't seen it. It jerks like you that have ruined this hobby. "YOUR A LYING CROOK" That must be an oximorone, is there an honest crook? Its bad enough having to deal with jerks here in the US, but now the Internet has opened up the world. Sure glad that extrateristal life form hasn't made themselves known. In the 10 yeras I been in business I have only had 2 complaints. I guess thats not to bad. Next time BUT IT FROM CHINA. This will be my only post on this matter, as I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed idiot.
Larry E.
SouthEast Model Products Inc.
You are a Liar Larry and I have all the emails to prove it. I never bugged you or pushed you about building it within a few weeks, I asked you how long would it take, you told me 60-90 days, I asked you if it could be done quicker and you said no, you had jobs booked in already and it would take that long to finish it, I said ok I want it.

I sent you deposit mid November, on December 23rd I emailed you asking if you were close to starting as the AUD$$ was strong and I would like to send the balance through.

YOU decided to make it?? LOL what a crock, YOU decided to take my money and send me a half finished half buggered lump of aluminum!

I sent you $100.00 deposit to hold my place in YOUR Queue. My experience of Paypal is if I sent the full amount at the start, 4 months later I am screwed if I needed to claim.

Soon as you emailed that you were about to start it I sent you the balance of $532.00 which included your paypal fees, AND $100.00 in shipping which cost you $74.00 to ship.

PAYPAL HAS NOT REFUNDED A SINGLE CENT TO ME. I requested a partial refund that would cover my time and material costs to re-machine all the faulty parts. $200.00 is what I requested.

PAYPAL then sent me a reply saying they would only refund the full amount apon return of the item. Shipping it back was going to cost me almost 100 bucks, and I was not guaranteed of getting a cent back from you, if there was no balance in your account then paypal would be obliged to give me nothing but a "sorry the seller has no funds, we managed to get $5.00 off him".

ALSO PAYPAL was not going to refund $538.00 they were only working on the final payment of $532.00, the deposit of $100.00 was going to be lost along with the $100.00 to ship it back to you,
end of the day it was cheaper for me to buy materials and waste my own time fixing your DODGY WORKMANSHIP!

This is what you said about the balance:
Look like the total is $532, and I didn't charge you the $10 handeling fee I usually charge. That's what it cost me in gas to
go to and from the PO


Then when it arrived and I questioned the extra $26.00 charged for shipping you told me:
$99 shipping, includes packing supplies, and trip to the post office.
Gas isn't free here, the post office is 20 miles one way. I get 10 mi/gal
with my van. Gas is over $4/gal


Packing?? What packing! A single piece of bubble wrap between the sled and the base, little wonder the base has bash marks all over it from the bearings.
A prepaid USPS priority Mail box, arent those supplied by USPS??

I stand by everything I have said, I would not have posted this up had I actually received ANY sort of compensation for this abomination.
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 04:43 PM
steve morris
wekiva springs,florida
Joined Jul 2006
229 Posts
Extreme Rc, I know where Larry lives in Orlando and it's not 20 miles from a post office,try 5 minutes. I whent to his house to check out a 90mm fan that he had made. Sorry you got ripped.
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Old Mar 11, 2011, 05:39 PM
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Joined Oct 2010
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ooh another great thread on rcgroups.

Too bad neither of you guys are happy, but such is buisness over the internet.

Good luck and God Speed..............
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Old Mar 12, 2011, 11:20 PM
Extreme CNC Alloy EDF
Extreme_RC's Avatar
Australia
Joined Mar 2006
11,356 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by In N Out View Post
ooh another great thread on rcgroups.
too bad neither of you guys are happy, but such is buisness over the internet.
What do you mean?? I imagine he is happy with the $632.00 in his pocket, I am the one out of pocket and ripped off. So the thread isnt to your liking, should we stay quiet when we get ripped off or should we bring it to the attention of others who might be thinking of purchasing the same thing?
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Old Mar 14, 2011, 02:06 PM
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Luzern/Switzerland
Joined Aug 2008
2,894 Posts
Well another Story of Dodgy Internet Business.

I am electrified by reading such stories, especially from People who take Advantage of Buyer's from other Countries.

Gas in the States is by far Cheaper then in Australia btw, and also cheaper then in Europe, and 20miles to drive..wow what a distance for an Oldtimer, ey?

Seriously such people make me sick taking advantage from International Customers and should be blacklisted/avoided accordingly.

If you would be in my Country, you truly would be in serious trouble. Not only Health wise, but also LAW wise.

Sorry Mark for getting ripped off

Regards

NS.
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Old Mar 15, 2011, 04:56 AM
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United Kingdom, England, Redcar
Joined Jan 2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by In N Out View Post
ooh another great thread on rcgroups.

Too bad neither of you guys are happy, but such is buisness over the internet.

Good luck and God Speed..............
Jog on.



As for the workmanship , thats pretty dire for that amount of money , one of the reasons i have been buying domestically even at the increased cost , when you can drive to their door they sing a dfferent tune.
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Old Mar 15, 2011, 06:35 AM
Extreme CNC Alloy EDF
Extreme_RC's Avatar
Australia
Joined Mar 2006
11,356 Posts
Yeah well its supposed to be a precision made in the USA product, I would have got 100 times better from my CNC guy in China and at half the price...
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