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Old Oct 07, 2014, 09:38 AM
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Delta Ray with 180 Upgrade Motors vs. Parkzone Warbird..

I have a Delta Ray, which I have been flying for a year. I like it, for several reasons, the main one being a combination of the factors that it's easy to fly and it can fly in a relatively small area. That it's affordable, robust, has a panic switch (for fun as much as for a safety-backup..) and is cool looking are just additional positives. With time though (and I guess experience) it has come to seem very slow by about halfway through the second consecutive pack. On another thread I just saw you can upgrade the motors with 180 something-or-others. I watched a youtube video on how to do it, and it didn't look too bad..

Last year, I bought a Parkzone P-47, and it's been sitting in a box ever since, basically because I feel like I need much more space than the places where I normally fly the DR. And I simply don't have such a space. Anyway, I could go drive an hour away, probably pay a visitor fee at a club, etc.., and try it. Maybe I'd realize that I could fly it in less space than I assume.. I just don't know. But right now I'm still wary of even taking it out. I don't even know where...

Anyway, I was wondering, just re flight characteristics, how would an upgraded DR compare to the P-47? Though I am somewhat of a WWII plane buff and like the P-47 especially, I'm more interested in flying than scaleness or whatever.. I also almost definitely need a hand-launcher/belly-lander. Would the upgraded DR be as fast as the P-47? Less, as, or more maneuverable? I've got to assume the P-47 needs a lot more space to land, stalls easier, etc.. But in some ways flies better - tighter rolls for ex. Anyway, just brainstorming.. It seems like an upgraded DR could be the better way for me to go to the next (speed and performance) level than going from the stock DR to the P-47.. Thoughts?
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 10:06 AM
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Afraid I haven't flown either the DeltaRay or the PK P-47.

However making the DeltaRay faster probably won't change how it flies, it'll just cover the flying space in less time.

The P-47 is likely to be quite different to fly no matter. However I can understand that it is a bigger model and will need more space most likely. I have the 49" wingspan Parkzone Mosquito, which is fab, but it's much faster than my UMX Beast 3D and requires a lot more room to fly.

I would personally say a motor upgrade to the DeltaRay may well be worthwhile regardless. But maybe you need to consider some other planes to get your fix.


The FunFighter warbirds sold through hobbyking are smaller:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...rch=funfighter

Approx 24-25" wingspan.

There are many different planes available in this range (some look better than others).

Try one out on 3S and it should be a healthy bit quicker than your DeltaRay, then when you want more switch to 4S power for 80mph+ ability.


Keeping with the mini/micro scene. While not a warbird, but you might want to consider the Eflite UMX Sbach 342, these will run on 3S out of the box (not officially rated for it) and should be zippy for it's size. Planes like the Inversa or Edge are 280 sized (you can get a Mustang in this size too). Which might suit better for you than your current warbird.

Hobbyking also offer quite a nice range of mini and micro planes that might fit the bill.
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 11:00 AM
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I've found with UMX planes that batteries can make a difference, in particular a higher c rating. The stock batteries are 25C, there are 45 C of somewhat higher capacity, and they really make a big difference in the performance.

I'd think of this as a halfway step in upgrade, as compared to going from 2s to 3s. The upgrade path doesn't sound too bad, either.

However, let's back up a bit. Is your problem that you want it to go somewhat faster than it is now (back to what the original perceived performance was); or are you really wanting to make it go a lot faster?

- If a bit faster, I'd try better batteries, then motor upgrade.
- If a lot faster, I'd look for a faster airplane. There's only so much you can do to a plane before you reach a limit (mechanical or financial)

I think that's not inconsistent with the advice from ChickenSteak although framed a bit differently,

Regards
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 11:16 AM
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I really like the DR in terms of size, looks, easiness to fly(and land), the panic button, and space required.

Ideally Hobbyzone would make a "pimp" version with brushless motors.. Got to be a market for it..

But to answer your questions, I want to go a fair bit faster. The faster the better, I guess.. As it is now, when I get out to fly, by midway through the second pack I'm really starting to want more speed and power.

What batteries can I use with 45C? Would defo try that first....

I've yet to see another plane that really interests me. I appreciate the suggestions Chickensteak, but none of those type planes appeals to me. I'm still at the beginner end of the spectrum, and my priority is to get better at flying.. - but something that (I think) looks cool. And as I've learned having bought the P-47, being able to fly in a normal size area is absolutely critical. The DR checks all the right boxes basically - belly lander, not too expensive, looks good, lands practically by itself, has a panic button, can be flown in tightish areas where for ex. a PZ warbird can't, isn't too big to fit in the car, etc etc.. EXCEPT, speed and performance. What other plane would give me everything the DR does then, but with more speed?
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 11:39 AM
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Check this out(starting at about 5:15):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0gdUJFmW-s

THAT looks like fun. With all of the beginner friendliness, ease of landing, etc.. I couldn't handle that at full power right away, but there's ssssooo much potential to work up to...
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 12:24 PM
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This is pretty awesome looking:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2221374

Not available in Europe though...
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 12:26 PM
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I watched that video and I could swear there was a sonic boom at 5:54!!! That setup looks about as fast as anyone needs to go.

I suspect DR with brushless and 4s is going to out run the P47, out of the box.

Regards
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 12:28 PM
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Yeah, but that mod is surely more involved than the one with the 180's. Almost certainly beyond what I would be comfortable attempting. The 180's with soldering etc.. would be pushing it...
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 01:27 PM
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When I took this hobby up it was to realize my childhood dream of flying a model plane. Those dreams were unrealized as a youth, as I built lots of Guillows ff models which never flew. "Free flight", what irony!!!! "Freely exploding" is more like it.

So, no interest in building, just flying. But you can't get away from at least a little bit of fixing in this hobby.. and then that leads to modifications, and before you know it I actually built a simple plane. I've got a less simple plane on the workbench; and this may lead to a "real" build eventually.

I think the moral to that story is probably on the lines of "walk before you run". If the 180 upgrade seems like something you're comfortable with, go for it. You'll probably find it wasn't as difficult as it seemed and the next, more demanding mod will seem do-able.

And then you'll well and truly be addicted, but that's not a bad thing in this hobby.

Regards
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Old Oct 07, 2014, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Herrsavage View Post
This is pretty awesome looking:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2221374

Not available in Europe though...
Yep is available from the UK Warehouse. However it's a 42" wingspan, so not the smallest. The Funfigters are in essence a smaller version of this, just in warbird dress and are only 30" or under wingspan.

I'm not saying there won't be a learning curve. But if you feel comfortable with 4ch and doing rolls and loops then I don't think it should be to much of a jump up.

Btw it's worth learning what C rating means and understanding how and why it can affect performance and why it may not.
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Old Oct 08, 2014, 05:10 AM
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The size looks spot on. Just a question of much space it needs...
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Old Oct 08, 2014, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Herrsavage View Post
The size looks spot on. Just a question of much space it needs...
Ok. Although I'd be surprised if this needed less space than your P-47. The EFX Racer is a fast plane, it'll eat up space really quickly. Take a look at some of the vids of them flying.

Unless you are looking at pure 3D flight which doesn't need much space, then larger planes will as a rule need more space, whether they fly slow or fast.
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Old Oct 08, 2014, 09:11 AM
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I just looked at the thread for the DR brushless conversion, and being honest with myself, that's not something I would be confident undertaking at this stage.

How much more power do the 180's give over stock, then how much more would brushless give? For ex. 180's give %30 more power and speed, brushless double that again?

Actually, in the few vids I've seen, the DR looks WAY faster brushless than with the 180's.. But again, I'm wary of getting into ordering a bunch of stuff from HK, soldering, getting everything properly set up and balanced, etc...
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Old Oct 08, 2014, 08:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Herrsavage View Post
I have a Delta Ray, which I have been flying for a year.
Just curious, are you flying it in expert mode all the time, now?

I've got a couple flying buddies that have them (and I just got mine this week). One of them has bought the 180s but hasn't installed them until he confirms the receiver/ESC can handle them for the long run. He used to complain about power but we looked at it and found he wasn't getting the nose level. He's made a few adjustments and has gotten remarkably good in just the last 3 months. He's flying in expert much of the time but still up 2 mistakes high.

He may yet buy another DR airframe using the old one to build it brushless with a KK gyro and an added rudder.

The other DR owner is quite experienced with many, many planes and a few helicopters in his trailer/shop that he tows to the field. He flies the DR every time I see him there - still finds it challenging to fly it stock.
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Old Oct 09, 2014, 12:17 AM
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I fly in advanced only these days. I never liked beginner, from the beginning. Too limiting IMO... Especially if you don't have the space.

One possibility is that my batteries are fading.. They have started to puff a bit. Need some new ones. But still, I would like a DR with considerably more speed and performance.
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