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Old Oct 14, 2012, 05:36 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
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Originally Posted by Bravo47 View Post
My Edge550 is getting close now to being dialed how i like it. So I cranked open the throttle this morning at the field for the first time. It flew very reliably with the exception of when it was at top speed near the end of a full throttle pass where I would get some flutter. The speed was I'm guessing at between 85-95mph. I know with my other foam models that anything in excess of 80mph starts to stress the wing into a flutter, but I do have a gyro on the AILE as well so that could still need a little tweaking. I should have had the sense to turn the gyro off before my pack was running low and try another pass. I will do that next flight. I'm curious though on other peoples experience at full speed. Could somebody tell me is their Edge550 stable at top speed, or does it get a bit of a wobble up?

Mick
If it's wing flutter then lost likely is gyro initiated. n my Parkjet with Gyro ... this exhibits exact same even when turned right down. I've since removed it and flutter has dissapeared.
It's based on : take a slow speed - you need quite a movement of surface to do as you wish .. increase speed significantly and that movement needed is far less. Now think of the poor old gyro - unless you link it's sense to throttle - you will have siimilar corrective output whatever speed by the gyro.

Just my 2c's worth ...

Nigel
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 05:39 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
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I read all these reports and see about CoG ... planes stall character .... landing etc. etc.

I pose this question : is this not a model of a hairy full size plane anyway ? As I understand it the full size has a difficulty rating also that makes it one hairy machine to fly. So do we want a docile sport machine or a true to life machine ? Divided camps methinks ?

Nigel
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 02:59 PM
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
If it's wing flutter then lost likely is gyro initiated. n my Parkjet with Gyro ... this exhibits exact same even when turned right down. I've since removed it and flutter has dissapeared.
It's based on : take a slow speed - you need quite a movement of surface to do as you wish .. increase speed significantly and that movement needed is far less. Now think of the poor old gyro - unless you link it's sense to throttle - you will have siimilar corrective output whatever speed by the gyro.

Just my 2c's worth ...

Nigel
Thanks Nigel, that makes sense. Its easy enough to flick a switch and turn the gyro off when I'm moving quick and flick it back on for landing. I think I will do that next flight and see how it goes.

Mick
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Old Oct 14, 2012, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solentlife View Post
I read all these reports and see about CoG ... planes stall character .... landing etc. etc.

I pose this question : is this not a model of a hairy full size plane anyway ? As I understand it the full size has a difficulty rating also that makes it one hairy machine to fly. So do we want a docile sport machine or a true to life machine ? Divided camps methinks ?

Nigel
I moving the CG forward of the recommended does not make this aircraft docile, it just makes it more reliable I think. It doesnt really neuter the aircraft.

Mick
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 11:38 AM
" Plain Crazy! "
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Australia, WA, Broome
Joined Oct 2008
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Missing Parts from Hobbyking Shipment

Well I have purchased countless models from HK over the fast 5 years.....and I lost count of the Thousands of dollars amount!! but I received this kit the other day minus bag Spare Parts Bag 1 and 3!! So ended up without a spinner, although the propeller was separate in the packing.......and the rear brace to attach the tailplane and fin.

Usual story from the wonderful service at HK on line chat......"weigh the box and take pictures" yes after they basically turn the box inside out for you when they pack it to save their packaging materials so it makes it very difficult to put it all back together again to de engineer their packing process.

Yes I told them where to go for that as the 2 missing parts bags would have barely weighed 15gms!!!



Why cant they admit that their quality control in their packing department in leaving out things appears to be on the rise??? Maybe my parts ended up in some one elses Edge 540 box as extras....lucky for them.

But all I want is one spinner and the tail brace !!!! but I have to go through a whole lot of burecauracy to get that!

I have managed to put the kit together with another spinner (white) that I have in my years of collecting spares...and I fashioned a brace out of tin plate and painted it.....to get over that. That was definitely faster than getting my paid parts back from HK.

But I will still be taking this up with Scott or Stuart.....if they are reading this post to see if they can simply just send me these two parts in an envelope......which customer serviced from HK should do in the first place WITHOUT QUESTIION.

After all I did spend nearly $200 including batteries on this shipment to be basiclly left with a grounded model!

Posted a pic below of my rig...work in progress. I have installed Wing Fences that have worked on my previous models to improve aerodynamics and laminar flow over the aerofoil at high AOA. I am using a MAC of 120 mm as a guide for a
25% to 35% calculation of COG which places it between 40mm and 30mm from the LE. My all up flying weight will be well over 700gm with the Turnigy 1.8 Nanotechs and I will be using the same Tx computer programming I have for my Retro series "Pioneer" including flaperons would you believe! My COG because of the high finished wieght of this model (which is about the same of my HK Tiger Moth at 726g FW) will be set at the forward limit 30mm.

HJ
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 01:52 PM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bravo47 View Post
I moving the CG forward of the recommended does not make this aircraft docile, it just makes it more reliable I think. It doesnt really neuter the aircraft.

Mick
Please don't misunderstand me ... I'm not saying anyone is wrong in moving CoG fwd or whatever ... we all have to arrive at a set-up we can live with.
No - my point is that the model is of a hairy full size machine and I would expect the model to exhibit similar ...

Take a Pitts for example ....... short moment arms, huge movements, high power engine to low weight small frame ... do you expect it to fly like a trainer ?

Not trying to upset anyone - just making a comment ...

I value EVERY post here as the box is leaving HK about now and I wish to have best chance for it to survive maiden flight !!

Cheers
Nigel
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by solentlife View Post

Not trying to upset anyone - just making a comment ...

Cheers
Nigel
I was not upset Nigel, in the slightest. I am by no way an expert on these things and I like reading all points of view

regards

Mick
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 12:22 AM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
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Anyone have any updates ... further info ?

All good stuff ....

Nigel
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 08:06 AM
what ?!
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France, Midi-Pyrénées, Tarbes
Joined Nov 2011
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... and any comments on the same size Sbach ?!

It may not be the good place for that but I couldn't find any dedicated topic on the 800mm Sbach from HK..

The "airframe only" version of the Sbach is cheap enough for me and would allow me to use some spare servos, ESC and motor.. but after all I could read on the Edge, I'm wondering if this would be a good investment..
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Old Oct 19, 2012, 05:02 PM
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... and any comments on the same size Sbach ?!
I plane on buying a Sbach later this year, but I will most likly buy the 1400mm wing version, as fast 800mm wing aircraft can cause orientation problems for me when they are out wide at the end of our flying field. They do an orange and a black/red version in the 1400mm.

Link- http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=20703

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Originally Posted by Guiltz View Post
but after all I could read on the Edge, I'm wondering if this would be a good investment..
There is nothing wrong with the 800mm Edge apart from the manuals CG reference being wrong, weak engine mount, and nil spares available. Other than that just set the control surface rates at around 50% to start and Its a great little aircraft.


Mick
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Old Oct 22, 2012, 04:29 AM
what ?!
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France, Midi-Pyrénées, Tarbes
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Thanks for your answer Bravo47... I was just wondering if I could handle this plane as it really corresponds to what I am looking for in term of size (800 mm wingspan)..! I use to fly in the fields behind my house and the space is not that big.. I'm also not used to fly "fast" aircraft..
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 07:49 PM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
Latvia, Ventspils pilsēta, Ventspils
Joined Jan 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bravo47 View Post
..........There is nothing wrong with the 800mm Edge apart from the manuals CG reference being wrong, weak engine mount, and nil spares available. Other than that just set the control surface rates at around 50% to start and Its a great little aircraft.


Mick
With greatest respect to others and I'm sure majority are vastly better RC pilots than I ... but I cannot help but feel that a certain amount of underestimation of characteristics occurs ....

These planes in full size are serious machines that require care and skill. Translating that to a model surely incurs a touchy model. It's same if you do a Pitts correctly ... many would find a correctly translated Pitts a handful.

I'm waiting to return home and put the Edge together and fly ... I've noted from this thread that a) CoG needs to be a bit more fwd than book says, b) that undercarraige needs to be looked at and possibly more secure, (I'm a great believer in weaker and only break immediate area - not more !), c) weak engine mount and check for this strange bent up corner !

On CoG ... this subject always surprises me ... as I always lived by the 30% rule ... I would average out the location no matter what wing form and fly ... generally it was safe and then I would adjust to what I wanted from the model. It worked for Mirage 2000, WOT4, Pitts, Nieport 28 ... just a few wide range examples ... this leads to a question ...

Does no-one now work like that ? They just trust the book ... and look to others to set the location ?

For me - I have a style of flying that many I fly with would not use ... means I fly with CoG often a little back from normal with aerobatic and more fwd on EDF etc. Book figures are purely a number to start with.

Nigel
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 09:29 PM
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b) that undercarraige needs to be looked at and possibly more secure, (I'm a great believer in weaker and only break immediate area - not more !)

Nigel
The under carriage is actually quite sturdy and robust. It breaks off on occasion because it is glued into a 10mm thick section of the foam fuse. This for me has only happened if my landing angle was poor and the front of the wheel pants catch on the runway and drag the carriage off. If it were a regular fix I think I would just remove the wheel pants.

I start at 30% if I have no manual reference to go by. We just assume that the people that wrote the manual went through a whole lot of testing to come to that value. It probably just depends on your flight style I guess. I'm no ace pilot so I like my CG a bit more forward to keep me in the comfort zone.

Mick
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Old Oct 24, 2012, 10:16 PM
222 km/hr Parkjet flyer
solentlife's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bravo47 View Post
The under carriage is actually quite sturdy and robust. It breaks off on occasion because it is glued into a 10mm thick section of the foam fuse. This for me has only happened if my landing angle was poor and the front of the wheel pants catch on the runway and drag the carriage off. If it were a regular fix I think I would just remove the wheel pants.

I start at 30% if I have no manual reference to go by. We just assume that the people that wrote the manual went through a whole lot of testing to come to that value. It probably just depends on your flight style I guess. I'm no ace pilot so I like my CG a bit more forward to keep me in the comfort zone.

Mick
That sounds fair enough ... just surprises me the number of posts about "Where's CoG on a model" ... must be about 5 or 6 running now on here and Wattflyer ..

I agree that CoG advised is usually a good point to start ... but we all fly diffferent. My Ultimate is unflyable by some of the guys I fly with ... they want to stuff lead in the nose and tame her down .. me .. I love it ... she'll stand on her nose at blink of an eye ! (twitch of a stick actually .... )

The Edge I have ordered and believe has reached home judging by Wifes comments ... will be set-up as poeple above have found ... but I bet I end up edging it back a bit ... !! Time will tell.

Nigel
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Old Oct 25, 2012, 12:11 AM
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Look forward to hear your review Nigel, as most people post one extreme or the other. Its either love or hate this bird. I did read one guy reported that he used a lower kv motor with an SF prop to get more air over the surfaces at slower speeds to tame his down. I quite like it going fast as I have my YAK55 for slow tricky stuff, and the little EDGE550 suits my needs when i'm pretending to be Paul Bonhomme

Mick
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