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Old Jan 21, 2013, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by therealthing691 View Post
Hi Otto,
like the idea is very similiar to the trailing edge propotional steering i thought of trying in the past but this is by off setting the articulation great idea i think.
As it only takes minimal difference to make a orni turn a great idea i think
Otto regards Brian
Brian , thanks for the idea appreciation and yes I think so, this have to be an very responsive form of control .
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kaku View Post
This is a good idea. I may make it and test it.
Doctor glad you liked the idea and I will be happy if you try it and it work well.
After that you probably will be able to use only elevator servo on the tail, so the weight increase will be minimal.
Your tail equipped birds are pretty responsive and without this system but for the bats and especially articulated one it will help, I hope.


Success
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Old Jan 21, 2013, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by seagull10 View Post
Brian , thanks for the idea appreciation and yes I think so, this have to be an very responsive form of control .
i agree totally i think this will be a very resoponse form of control .I have flown a great deal of hours over the past 7yrs and know it doesnt take much to offset trim in a bird. I would love to make a articulated bird later this year after i return from my trip to europe and use this form of control.Also if my memory serves me correct Robert Koroblenick did something similair to that form of control on standard SK birds non articulated. The same principle though as Otto has mentioned
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Old Jan 22, 2013, 10:14 PM
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Doctor, I suppose this variation probably will be more easy to build and will work more stable mechanically
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 07:39 AM
K Kakuta
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Bat 18-4 with articulated wings and swing legs: Third Flight test

Bat 18-4 with articulated wings and swing legs: Third Flight test

Bat 18-4 with articulated wings and swing legs: Third Flight test (2 min 5 sec)


I let rise angles of a hind leg increase.
So, control of flight was improved.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 08:48 AM
K Kakuta
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Bat 18-3 Swing legs: 4th Flight test Hand catch.

Bat 18-3 Swing legs: 4th Flight test Hand catch.

Bat 18-3 Swing legs: 4th Flight test Hand catch. (2 min 19 sec)


I let rise angles of a hind leg increase.
So, control of flight was improved.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:00 PM
K Kakuta
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Originally Posted by seagull10 View Post
Doctor, I suppose this variation probably will be more easy to build and will work more stable mechanically
Now I am trying to make this idea.

Because some strength is not enough, it does not yet fly.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kaku View Post
Now I am trying to make this idea.

Because some strength is not enough, it does not yet fly.
It will fly Doctor.

I am sure! You are able to happen everything

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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by seagull10 View Post
It will fly Doctor.

I am sure! You are able to happen everything

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+100 great work Doctor you are one amazing Person regards Brian
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 11:14 PM
DIY Mania from Taiwan
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Originally Posted by therealthing691 View Post
+100 great work Doctor you are one amazing Person regards Brian
+ ANOTHER 100
eager to watch this one
best regards
Sam
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 08:15 AM
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SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system

SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system

SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system (2 min 27 sec)


A conclusion:
Unfortunately, by this system, it is difficult to change direction.
Ornithopter can not turn.
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kaku View Post
SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hEv6wFSEDo

A conclusion:
Unfortunately, by this system, it is difficult to change direction.
Ornithopter can not turn.
I think, for this system is necessary action of gravity.
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 09:05 AM
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Mr. Kazu I am 100% sure you will find the answer. Its there, it hasn't manifest itself yet.
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kaku View Post
SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hEv6wFSEDo

A conclusion:
Unfortunately, by this system, it is difficult to change direction.
Ornithopter can not turn.
i wonder if proportional control of the trailing edge would work with this type of wing is just a thought something similair to what is shown in this video the same concept any way lowering and raising the trailing edge regards Brian

da vinci history the worlds smallest ornithopter (5 min 14 sec)
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Old Jan 26, 2013, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazu-kaku View Post
SlowHawk2 with Articulated wings Turn system

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hEv6wFSEDo

A conclusion:
Unfortunately, by this system, it is difficult to change direction.
Ornithopter can not turn.
Hi Doctor,
First thanks for the experiment ,the video and all the efforts!
I have watched the video few times and there is my thoughts:

1. I think that it is evident there is not slight but pretty strong tendency of turning right by some reasons which will analyze later.

2. There is almost no difference with the plate fixed in the center and fixed to the right .

3.When the plate is fixed to the left the system ornithopter - test stand behave strange .First start to turn left and after all the system achieve a good amplitude of shaking, it change the direction of turning to the right again? The last one I think is evident as well.

I think that there is some mechanical reason for such a system's behavior related to the system's shaking and mechanical instability. From what I see on the video only fastening clamp is evidently offset to the left . Probably it act like pendulum and precession force push the test stand to the right .Bigger amplitude on left wing is also possible in result of the shaking and twisting of the stand beam on which the clamp and the ornitopter are fastened.

Probably there are additionally stand leveling issues as well.

So IMO the experiment isn't absolutely pure and it's early to conclude that this new system isn't work.

Mr. Velkov opinion make sense as well and probably in the air without test stand influence the ornithopter will behave different .

I will suggest one more time the same experiment with the clamp mounted backwards.
Also if you still want to experiment it(I don't want to press you in any way) , make this ornithopter to fly first by the articulation system only and after that try this new turning system . This way you will be sure that the ornithopter generate symmetric thrust forces before starting experimenting with the new turning system.

One more time thank you for everything you do and you are the fastest model builder experimenter I have seen ever .
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