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Old Jun 23, 2014, 08:34 PM
La Mesa Air
La Mesa, CA
Joined Mar 2010
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FAA says all (goggles) FPV is illegal

New FAA memo came out today:
"By definition, a model aircraft must be “flown within visual line of sight of the person operating the aircraft.” P.L. 112-95, section 336(c)(2).1 Based on the plain language of the statute, the FAA interprets this requirement to mean that: (1) the aircraft must be visible at all times to the operator; (2) that the operator must use his or her own natural vision (which includes vision corrected by standard eyeglasses or contact lenses) to observe the aircraft; and (3) people other than the operator may not be used in lieu of the operator for maintaining visual line of sight. Under the criteria above, visual line of sight would mean that the operator has an unobstructed view of the model aircraft. To ensure that the operator has the best view of the aircraft, the statutory requirement would preclude the use of vision-enhancing devices, such as binoculars, night vision goggles, powered vision magnifying devices, and goggles designed to provide a “first-person view” from the model."
More on my blog here:
http://www.techenstein.com/faa-comes...odel-aircraft/

I am litterally pissed about this. Already spoke with my AMA rep.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 08:51 PM
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Demo7's Avatar
United States, CA, Laguna Niguel
Joined Oct 2013
627 Posts
Yes, truly dissapointing
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 08:54 PM
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branflakes's Avatar
Joined Jan 2011
2,234 Posts
It says goggles not monitor on tripod

Change title to '...goggles are illegal' the other is too hype

I was under impression they don't have power until the court decision was overruled?

Details...I can look up and down hundreds of cycles while flying fpv at night a mile away with orientation lights legally fulfilling their exact requirement, changing nothing.
I just stated a way to uphold their regs and do sick fpv. We can orient by Los alone, and return home with no rth, from a mile, due to red blue white orientation lights for sure. By FAA regs we can fpv at night much easier than the day? Orientation is simple with blasting LEDs.
Details

Change title of thread my vote
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 08:59 PM
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Demo7's Avatar
United States, CA, Laguna Niguel
Joined Oct 2013
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I thought according to FAA vs Trappy the judge ruled that the FAA had no legal authority over model aircraft. Correct me if I'm wrong , I'm going by memory here.
If that is true, wouldent this new ruling be a paper tiger?
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:00 PM
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It sure as heck doesn't account for night fpv at long distance w massive light up LEDs with a monitor that doesn't necessarily obstruct view
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:01 PM
Too many numbers
United States, OH, Troy
Joined Oct 2010
1,631 Posts
For whatever reason, there was an automatic "stay" on the judgment pending review and ruling of the full board. So you've got it backwards there. The original ruling was basically thrown out, and the full board will make its own ruling based on- well, based on whatever they want, really.

According to what the FAA has written there, you can't take your eyes off the model aircraft at all, period. If you watch it on a monitor, you aren't watching the airplane.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:01 PM
Sink Stinks
Silent-AV8R's Avatar
Orange County, CA
Joined Aug 2004
4,174 Posts
Here's the Summary from the actual document:

Quote:
SUMMARY: This action provides interested persons with the opportunity to comment on the FAA’s interpretation of the special rule for model aircraft established by Congress in the FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012. In this interpretation, the FAA clarifies that: model aircraft must satisfy the criteria in the Act to qualify as model aircraft and to be exempt from future FAA rulemaking action; and consistent with the Act, if a model aircraft operator endangers the safety of the National Airspace System, the FAA has the authority to take enforcement action against those operators for those safety violations.
So for right now they are seeking comments on their interpretation. Hopefully a reasoned outcry will knock some sense into them. I deal with regulatory agencies as part of my work. It is not uncommon for them to take an overly restrictive line at the start knowing that they may have to settle for less. Let's hope that is the case here.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:02 PM
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Daemon's Avatar
Lakewood, Colorado
Joined Aug 2002
28,122 Posts
Please, read the full document, and provide your comments to the FAA directly.
http://02b954f.netsolhost.com/docs/m..._spec_rule.pdf

FAA is doubling down on their assertion that they have full regulatory authority over
model aircraft today (in spite of what the NTSB judge ruled), and that
P.L. 112-95, section 336 actually re-codifies that authority.

BTW, they are not actually saying that FAA piloting is banned. They're
saying that FPV piloting is inconsistent with the conditions of P.L. 112-95, section 336,
which gives the FAA the sole discretion as to how to regulate it
(based on their existing claimed authority). The end of the document
pretty much lays out the considerations they'd use to go after someone
(which they used on Trappy).
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:07 PM
La Mesa Air
La Mesa, CA
Joined Mar 2010
299 Posts
branflakes - true they do say goggles, but since they are stretching quite a bit already, if monitors on tripods becomes en vouge, do you think they would claim you are not maintaining visual line of sight when looking down at the monitor?

Fromt he doc:
"visual line of sight would mean that the operator has an unobstructed view of the model aircraft"
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:15 PM
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Demo7's Avatar
United States, CA, Laguna Niguel
Joined Oct 2013
627 Posts
....and can I carry a fpv system on my quad as an emergency backup system I case of loss of orientation. The whole "I smoked but didn't inhale" arguement?
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:21 PM
La Mesa Air
La Mesa, CA
Joined Mar 2010
299 Posts
OK, maybe it's time to design a set of one-eyed FPV goggles.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:28 PM
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Liquidsilver's Avatar
United States, NY, Kings County
Joined May 2012
50 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by kf6bbl View Post
OK, maybe it's time to design a set of one-eyed FPV goggles.
Just time for the Google Glass app.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:37 PM
Registered User
DeSoto MO
Joined May 2003
570 Posts
I say business as usual.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:39 PM
La Mesa Air
La Mesa, CA
Joined Mar 2010
299 Posts
I agree Nick_P, except for the part where they are asking for comment. In that respect, it's go time.
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Old Jun 23, 2014, 09:45 PM
FPV Racer - N4FPV
Eddie James's Avatar
United States, GA, Kennesaw
Joined Sep 2009
852 Posts
Good thing Oculus Rift DK2 is shipping next month. Those really aren't "goggles".

The show the WHOLE range of vision.
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