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Old Jul 09, 2012, 08:19 AM
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A few more thoughts.

I would very much like to see a detailed review with videos, multiple flight scenarios, torture testing, close ups of construction, etc.

You might try going out and spontaneously joining a bunch of flyers and letting them give it a go. Record their reactions and post the video. Take it to a contest. Send a working sample to one of the bigger clubs here in the states, UK, and elsewhere besides NZ, and let them bang on it a while. Get their impressions.

What the toy industry does is get a room full of children and watch them play from behind a 2 way mirror. They learn more from watching the end user work with the product then they ever would trying to figure it out themselves. Their improvements and ideas for future products come from the children - their customers.
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Old Jul 09, 2012, 04:24 PM
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Hi Pilots - too many "quotes" to post back on so I will try and answer all on this one post

Yes - Hi from New Zealand!!!!!

Yes it is designed for the slope. My frustration is not being able to fly at any "free moment" and only when the conditions were right, also being restricted to a certain area to fly from.

There are plenty of true thermal ships out there, my brother and others have some beautiful aircraft - but again limited to conditions and area to fly (or rather land). Many wings were pierced due to branches, hard landings. Also having to drag out a bungy cord 50meters!

We wanted to make a ship which was all round and that even being an experienced pilot, or a newbie - there was something which is simply "fun" to fly.

Landings are always an issue when we open ourselves up to an aircraft which is built to fly in any condition - so we had to make it strong. Gravel, rocky surface, trees, shrubs - it has all past the test. The most damage done was when a battery disconnected at high altitude and it nose dived into solid ground from 50feet! The fuse broke, but was able to be repaired - all else survived and was able to be flown again.

Good points about making it so pilots can upgrade this ship to an advanced level - but for now it will be a simple, fun 3 channel aircraft which is super strong. Again, just to make it simple, great looking and put the joy in flying round.

I will try and find the youtube clips of other people testing this. With this build I will show details for you guys, there are some simple, yet new construction methods used which are pretty cool.

Price wise we can never compete with China, as an example they quoted products machined and finished less than we can by the raw material - how do they do that??????? Just import tax here, then re shipping was an issue.

We will have to invest a good bit of cash to make up moulds and set up for mass production, the ones I will show you are all hand made and will not have the slick moulded finish we will achieve until we go to production.

Just think, a super strong, super slick fun aircraft which has an all round performance using advanced fabrication technology to offer you pilots one sexy ship!
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Old Jul 09, 2012, 05:23 PM
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Mike I quote the lead in on this thread
"Gordon here from Ridgehogs VERY long story short, we wanted to make a shock resistant Sailplane which is designed for slope soaring, can catch thermals easy, can perform well, is suited for the beginner and advanced pilot - oh and is indestructible!! - too much to ask? "

Perhaps that is why we ask about thewrmaling ability.
Rick
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Old Jul 09, 2012, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by tailsld View Post
Mike I quote the lead in on this thread
"Gordon here from Ridgehogs VERY long story short, we wanted to make a shock resistant Sailplane which is designed for slope soaring, can catch thermals easy, can perform well, is suited for the beginner and advanced pilot - oh and is indestructible!! - too much to ask? "

Perhaps that is why we ask about thewrmaling ability.
Rick

Cool! Yes correct. I will try and PM the guys who flew it at last years slope festival at Manilla. When there was no wind and all the other slope pilots sat round, the TR035 hogged the skyline catching all the thermals

I will log onto that forum to see if I can get a response and paste it here.

Thanks again.
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Old Jul 09, 2012, 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike Seale View Post
The OP clearly states 'designed for slope soaring'...so I'm not sure why so many are coming back and saying they want it to be dedesigned as a thermal model as its primary role. It would be like me going into the thermal forum and suggesting that someone redesign their model for electric/slope use.

Do they? Care to share?

"Gordon here from Ridgehogs VERY long story short, we wanted to make a shock resistant Sailplane which is designed for slope soaring, can catch thermals easy, can perform well, is suited for the beginner and advanced pilot - oh and is indestructible!! - too much to ask? "

See in bold. That's why.
I've heard some slope purists a while back frown upon powered planes on the slopes...
Thermal planes will easily fly on the slopes but Slope planes won't thermal as easily.

Soar!
Jun
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Old Jul 12, 2012, 11:01 PM
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I am currently searching for something just as you describe, that can fly in moderate wind on the slopes (under 20mph) and still be somewhat capable of thermalling, and an electric motor would be fabulous!!
My Radian Pro is impossible to fly in even a little bit of wind, and it was $250. I'd readily pay $300 for what you are describing.
I'd do everything I could to add a rudder, though.
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Old Jul 13, 2012, 11:10 AM
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They all look great, but I like the lighter colors.... because I like the bottom of the aircraft to have the darker color. Then I can tell which way is up at a distance!

Maybe you can start marketing decal sets for existing gliders... I know I'd like my Radian to look different than everyone else's, but I don't have the paint skills.

Colin

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgehogs View Post
Hi Pilots,

Well I will do a post on the next TR035 Build, but first (and again) I need your help

As part of my "day job" I am a designer and I mainly build aircraft looking cool first before I test them. Most of my aircraft fail due to this

With this one it was build as an all round electric glider, tested first, now I can make it look like the coolest on the market

Part of this new process allows me to get the most detail yet in coloring the aircraft, so grab a coffee, yet your friends together and vote on the wing design (color scheme) you like best.

The chosen one will then get laid out to show what it will look like, then I will make one, film it in detail and test fly it.

So you choose -
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Old Jul 19, 2012, 06:57 AM
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Sounds interesting but I gotta tell ya,(PS I'm not in purchasing mode these days but I still shop)
From the first posting till now all you have said is fluff.
It took awhile to even find out this is a 2.5m 2 piece wing,E-assist 'Thermal Racer' slope soarer.What does that mean exactly?
Special building technique? Well,how special? Details man!
I would need to know what this is made of,how it's made,what level of durability I can expect,what glues do I use to assemble/repair,planform details,etc. before I would consider spending any money.
Aileron/elev. w/ e-power? Gonna need rudder and either flaps or spoilers (or both,ya know there's spoiler people & flap people out here).
I think the TR looks great. The spinner fit needs work though.
Would really like to Know more.
Skies
J
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Old Jul 19, 2012, 09:11 AM
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I don't think the quotes are unrealistic or unfair.
The radian pro is 250 BNF. the PNP is 185. And it's a known tested well built glider. no kit available but it should be well below 150 I guess.
Not looking at HK ...

People are willing to pay 250 for a KIT (at least I do).
I think it's fair.
As the OP said, the biggest problem they will have is getting this product to be seen differently to the usual foam stuff out there. Talking about Radians and Easygliders and Cularii etc, is I think unfair to what they are trying to do here. To quote: "the aircraft has a special "skin" which is stronger than any glass sailplane and is similar to carbon fiber". Now if that statement were proven to be true, I would be prepared to pay a whole lot more for such a glider (should I like the way it flies) than for any foamie currently on the market.

Chris
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Old Jul 19, 2012, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by AirBornOne View Post
Sounds interesting but I gotta tell ya,(PS I'm not in purchasing mode these days but I still shop)
From the first posting till now all you have said is fluff.
It took awhile to even find out this is a 2.5m 2 piece wing,E-assist 'Thermal Racer' slope soarer.What does that mean exactly?
Special building technique? Well,how special? Details man!
I would need to know what this is made of,how it's made,what level of durability I can expect,what glues do I use to assemble/repair,planform details,etc. before I would consider spending any money.
Aileron/elev. w/ e-power? Gonna need rudder and either flaps or spoilers (or both,ya know there's spoiler people & flap people out here).
I think the TR looks great. The spinner fit needs work though.
Would really like to Know more.
Skies
J
I agree; there is a paucity of details here. The most effort seems to have gone into the plane's graphics, which is a bit *sre backwards, but perhaps not unexpected given the design background here...

A few thoughts occur to me:

1. The details of the airfoil need to be made public. I for one wouldn't think of buying a plane without knowing a bit about it's airfoil (i.e. either that it's from a huge setup like Mutliplex, or otherwise the actual cross section needs to be published, as well as the designers' reasons and thought's behind what he expects the foil to do).

2. Not providing a rudder or flaps goes against my understanding of the price point I thought your'e aiming for (as I explain in my previous post above). If you market the plane as a "beginners model" with no rudder and flaps, you WILL have to charge less than a Radian or EasyGlider, notwithstanding any superior finish the plane may have...

3. We really ned to know more about this material that is "similar to carbon fibre"!

Chris
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Old Jul 19, 2012, 08:30 PM
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Hi Pilots!

Yes thank you again for all your great posts - keep them coming!

Again we are a small business looking at diving into a huge market and are looking at a style of market research before we take the plunge - to manufacture in mass.

The "skin" and style of foam is secrete as it has never been used, so we have to now show you some hard hits/landings to prove the quality.

This is never going to be a high end ship, rather a pure fun electric glider and with only 3 channel we will loose a pile of customers. But in saying that, this version will be what we launch into the marketplace with due to budget.

Many pilots are so skilled in building and modifying, these will put flaps and rudder on this sailplane.

Yes detail/show means a great deal to me as I love to admire the aircraft I am flying - but first of all we made sure it flew great and did all the things we wanted it to do.

The reason for the holding back on details is that we have two other aircraft ready for production, a large scale EDF jet and a scale stunt plane. All use the same manufacturing process/set up.

I am building a TR035 now and will post the build here to give you guys some good insight to construction, foils and strength.

I am nearly finished the XUAF EDF build which will allow this thread (the TR035) to ramp up in feeding you pilots all the info needed - but for now have a look at what we have created... A custom build/design based on a BAE and F4 mix..... Scratch build is on this site.
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Old Jul 20, 2012, 02:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Ridgehogs View Post
This is never going to be a high end ship, rather a pure fun electric glider and with only 3 channel we will loose a pile of customers. But in saying that, this version will be what we launch into the marketplace with due to budget.
This thread is a form of market research and most/all are telling you it needs a rudder. There's the thermal guys who want to add more dihedral and they will want a rudder. Then there's those who are moving up from Easygliders and Radians and they will expect a rudder. And finally there's those who already have one of everything and they'll be wondering why they have to cut your tougher than carbon skin in order to make a rudder.

If you release this model without a rudder and it fails to sell there will be a lot of people ready to say "told you so". You really do need to rethink this one.

Mike
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Old Jul 20, 2012, 05:00 AM
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The "skin" and style of foam is secrete as it has never been used, so we have to now show you some hard hits/landings to prove the quality.
Ok Ok me first,I guess a .010" - .020" polycarbonate sheet that is thermoformed in a mold and then back filled with a foaming polyurethane adhesive. Maybe after some structure (linkages etc.) or hard points are placed.
Actually the skin can be thinner to allow for direct printing on a large format commercial machine.
Sounds like it maybe advantageous to setup the TE for full span hinging to allow a simple DIY mod for adding flaps (include provision for a servo).
As for rudder,though not absolutely necessary,make some method of providing a not to problematic manner of adding it in. DIY.
In the mean time,how about some up close/detail photos of your TR?
Just think,in a few years we can all say...we we're there
Skies and fortunes to you fellas.
Jay.
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Old Jul 20, 2012, 08:27 AM
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Neat looking EDF there. Sort of like a cross between a Phantom and a Hawk. Nice.

Back to the glider. I think Mike summed up nicely the reasons for adding rudder/flaps but I understand that you may be reluctant to put them in right away. I think you mentioned earlier that you may add them in a later version. Had you considered doing something like you often see on some foam warbirds. If you do produce the model without flaps/rudder, have the servo bays/mounts and grooves necessary for adding these controls already pre-marked/grooved ready to go. That way if you wish to keep the model simple for those that do not need flaps/rudder, then all is good. But for those that won't buy it without them (I would count myself in that category), everything is already in place for a quick and painless conversion.
Good luck with your venture. I'll certainly be following with interest.
Cheers Mike
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Old Jul 20, 2012, 07:49 PM
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Originally Posted by AirBornOne View Post
Ok Ok me first,I guess a .010" - .020" polycarbonate sheet that is thermoformed in a mold and then back filled with a foaming polyurethane adhesive. Maybe after some structure (linkages etc.) or hard points are placed.
Actually the skin can be thinner to allow for direct printing on a large format commercial machine.
Sounds like it maybe advantageous to setup the TE for full span hinging to allow a simple DIY mod for adding flaps (include provision for a servo).
As for rudder,though not absolutely necessary,make some method of providing a not to problematic manner of adding it in. DIY.
In the mean time,how about some up close/detail photos of your TR?
Just think,in a few years we can all say...we we're there
Skies and fortunes to you fellas.
Jay.
BANG ON!!! NAIL ON HEAD!

We have a new foam, much better than EPS, EPP and EPO, plus a new UV Stable carbon poly style of sheeting which has many advantages.

Also re the rudder - I will have a look at what we can do so that the pilot/customer can request/select the option they want weather 3, 4 or 5 channel.
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