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Old Jul 16, 2012, 03:49 PM
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Canada, ON, Pickering
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Originally Posted by Jovanx View Post
At first I couldn't figure out what the holes in the wings were for. I thought maybe they were to let air out as you are shoving the spar into the wing, but the Radian Pro doesn't have them. Then I realized they must be there for holding the wings on, since there didn't seem to be anything else holding them.

I know there's this other guy on the net who uses bungee cords, but I just thought I would share this picture of a different way to do it. The hooks can be easily separated for transport.
Very funny, , don't bring that Id..t ShooGoo guy in here, don't we have enough issues in this thread!!
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Old Jul 16, 2012, 05:29 PM
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Canada
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I meant to say Throttle on the left -stick

So, Paul use it like a flaperon meaning he use it as aileron as well, humm.

My thinking is, I like the radian as a Rudder plane stil. I would only use the flaps as flaps as well as camber changes. Thus my radio set-up question.

Ronald
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Old Jul 16, 2012, 05:42 PM
Tossing planes into the snow
Canada, BC, Smithers
Joined Nov 2011
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Originally Posted by rkhoo View Post
I meant to say Throttle on the left -stick

So, Paul use it like a flaperon meaning he use it as aileron as well, humm.

My thinking is, I like the radian as a Rudder plane stil. I would only use the flaps as flaps as well as camber changes. Thus my radio set-up question.

Ronald
I had the same question in my mind while watching that video. Here is what I think he is doing, but this is only a guess...He is using the flaps not only for spot landings but to get some camber and reflex as well. They are also functioning as ailerons, moving in opposite directions and giving roll control. I am guessing he has the rudder still on the right stick, and the ailerons are slaved to that with a mix. That would be the opposite of the usual setup, where the right stick controls the ailerons and the rudder is added in as a mix.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 08:04 AM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
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United States, IA, Des Moines
Joined Apr 2011
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ordering new Radian friday after i get paid- will do the Paul mods and a new paint job- then i will have both a stock plane for cams and a sleek thermal hunter...
hmm can i fly both at the same time-lol
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 09:41 AM
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ordering new Radian friday after i get paid- l
Looking forward to your report. I suggest checking the incidence angles after you add the tail boom stiffening (assuming you will be doing that) before cutting the new stab slot. They are not all the same. Paul's numbers might not be right for everyone. If you go too far and get into a negative decalage situation the plane might become unstable.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 12:24 PM
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I flew the dusty old Radian Novice yesterday. I've been flying 3D planes exclusively lately, so she's been a little neglected. The Radian brings back a lot of great memories when I first started in this hobby. She's a little beat up, but she still flies great!

Parkzone Radian at LRCC (4 min 50 sec)
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 01:32 PM
Tossing planes into the snow
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Originally Posted by scottdearinger View Post
hmm can i fly both at the same time-lol
Yes you can. I can't see that it would be that hard, especially if you had someone standing by to help out in case of trouble. I actually had 2 planes flying at the same time with a single transmitter, the Ember 2 and Vapor. They gradually got further and further apart and I had to let them down onto the grass before running out of field.

These Radians fly so well hands-off, that there could be contests to see how many one man could juggle. Of course, that would be done with multiple transmitters.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 05:25 PM
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Des Moines IA
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Originally Posted by kaptondave View Post
Looking forward to your report. I suggest checking the incidence angles after you add the tail boom stiffening (assuming you will be doing that) before cutting the new stab slot. They are not all the same. Paul's numbers might not be right for everyone. If you go too far and get into a negative decalage situation the plane might become unstable.
I hope eyeballing it will get us close as we don't have a meter to check the angles.
The other day we were looking at our radians and you could see that they were way off.
One thing I was wondering about was how much do you reduce the throw after you have done the incidence mod from the stock set up?
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 05:41 PM
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I hope eyeballing it will get us close as we don't have a meter to check the angles.
The other day we were looking at our radians and you could see that they were way off.
One thing I was wondering about was how much do you reduce the throw after you have done the incidence mod from the stock set up?
An easy way to visualize the incidence angles is to put the fuselage on its side and lay a yard stick over the wing cutout on the line between the front of the leading edge and the tip of the trailing edge, then compare that to the horizontal stabilizer slot.

I don't feel there is any need to change the throws. I am guessing you are asking because of comments that the mod makes the plane more sensitive in pitch. That means the pitch attitude is more responsive to changes in lift caused by thermals, not that it it more sensitive to control inputs. I fly with the same dual rates I used before the mod, usually on the low rate setting.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 06:34 PM
Tossing planes into the snow
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Originally Posted by kaptondave View Post
An easy way to visualize the incidence angles is to put the fuselage on its side and lay a yard stick over the wing cutout on the line between the front of the leading edge and the tip of the trailing edge, then compare that to the horizontal stabilizer slot.
I was just doing that this morning, and was amazed at how little of a difference there was. I guess it must have moved more than I thought when gluing in the fuselage stiffener. At this point I am not inclined to alter the stabilizer, but as someone said recently, we reserve the right to change our minds at any time.

If I eyeball a line that extends from the stabilizer towards the front, it ends up being about 1-1/4" above the fuselage at it's highest point (just behind the canopy magnet). I'm getting the same number by eyeballing it from the front and from the back. While that number is meaningless by itself, it might be an easy way to compare different Radians. It would be interesting to hear what number other people come up with.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 08:09 PM
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Des Moines IA
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Originally Posted by kaptondave View Post
An easy way to visualize the incidence angles is to put the fuselage on its side and lay a yard stick over the wing cutout on the line between the front of the leading edge and the tip of the trailing edge, then compare that to the horizontal stabilizer slot.

I don't feel there is any need to change the throws. I am guessing you are asking because of comments that the mod makes the plane more sensitive in pitch. That means the pitch attitude is more responsive to changes in lift caused by thermals, not that it it more sensitive to control inputs. I fly with the same dual rates I used before the mod, usually on the low rate setting.
Thanks for the help.
I don't use dual rates but will be fun to test out.
From looking at our Radians we can see there is a huge diff in incidence.
You are correct in the vid he has lowered the throws after doing said mod.
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 08:47 PM
Gravity? No, the Earth sucks
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United States, IA, Des Moines
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Originally Posted by kaptondave View Post
Looking forward to your report. I suggest checking the incidence angles after you add the tail boom stiffening (assuming you will be doing that) before cutting the new stab slot. They are not all the same. Paul's numbers might not be right for everyone. If you go too far and get into a negative decalage situation the plane might become unstable.
I will absolutely add a carbon arrow shaft to stiffen my boom and will try to do most of the incidence angle change that way- at least that's my plan- i love the carbon spar i added to my old Radian after a crash- response became much crisper and immediate after the spar was added
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 10:47 PM
Zor
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Pitch sensitivity

Hello guys,

It is interesting to follow this thread and read some statement.

One example is the pitch sensitivity.
I have read many times that due to decreased decalage (a smaller angle or near or at zero angle) and the CG moved rearward is the cause of more senstive pitch control.

I have not read any reason that I can recall.

The hoizontal tail surface has not changed . . .
The moment arm (distance from CG if anyhing is less) is reduced by up to one inch.
The mass distribution is not changed much by the addition of some reinforcement at the fuselage rear end.

So I am trying to figure out what would cause the pitch sensitivity to be so much different.

Is it real or just psychological ?
Does some claim that higher sensitivity just because someone else wrote it ?

I certainly would appreciate a logical reason that explains the reported difference.

Zor
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 11:19 PM
Zor
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Originally Posted by scottdearinger View Post
I will absolutely add a carbon arrow shaft to stiffen my boom and will try to do most of the incidence angle change that way- at least that's my plan- i love the carbon spar i added to my old Radian after a crash- response became much crisper and immediate after the spar was added
The Radian pro has a distance of just about 26 inches from CG to the elevator hinges.

Is it logical to assume that the Radian is very close to that ?

I understand and believe that the horizontal tail determines the angle of attack of the main wings.

If the elevator remains in line with the stab and the fuselage bends behind the wings (up or down) that amount would have to be nearly 1/2" for a one degree change. The calculated value is 0.454".

Now if the fuselage is reinforced to prevent it from bending the result is reported as the "response became much crisper and immediate after the spar was added"

I want to believe that but I also try to figure and compare the effect of up to 30 or even 40 degrees of elevator rotation on the rate of pitch atitude changes.

I consider that having a "much crisper and immediate" is a rate at which the action is taking place.

A very fascinating subject well worth evaluating.

Zor
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Old Jul 17, 2012, 11:48 PM
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Originally Posted by scottdearinger View Post
I will absolutely add a carbon arrow shaft to stiffen my boom and will try to do most of the incidence angle change that way- at least that's my plan- i love the carbon spar i added to my old Radian after a crash- response became much crisper and immediate after the spar was added
I don't wish to dampen you creative spirit but
I really think it would be a mistake to attempt doing the incidence change by bending the boom. It is so easy and fool-proof to do the other way.
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