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Old Oct 30, 2012, 07:47 PM
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Austria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by i812 View Post
The "Flat" part of the EL/AIL Gyro Pot, can be considered as the "tail" of a "pointer/arrow". ..............
......
......
i812 thanks for posting this useful info!
May I ask you how did you find these O-Clock positions and gyro gain percentages? Is it official from Walkera or you concluded it by doing some tests?
Thanks!
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Old Oct 30, 2012, 09:24 PM
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I figured it out in the "dark" with my eyes, hands, mind, and observing how the Mini responds to changes in cyclic commands depending on Pot position.

1) Both videos I posted show how "1-turn" Pots are physically constructed. Without repeating too much of what was described in the videos, each "end" of the Pot's Solder Tab is an electrical extreme end of the Pot, and the Pot's "Wiper" (normally the center solder tab) can be rotated to "wipe" from one extreme end to the other.

2) Most Pot's have a "dead-end" stop at their extreme travel postions; however, the inexpensive Walkera Pot's don't, and instead the Walkera Pot's have "speed" bumps. If you are careful and pay attention you can feel the Pot's Wiper hit the "speed" bumps at both extreme ends of travel. The bumps are to warn (prevent?) the operator from going over the "speed" bumps. I haven't taken a Walkera Pot apart; however, most Pot's will get (Wiper) damaged (over time?) if the Wiper is forced past the "speed" bump. I haven't read about it this year; however I believe a year or two ago, some people have posted that the more they make their Wiper go over the end of travel bumps, the more their Pot looses life expectancy. Imagine what would happen to your car, if you drove over street curbs, over, and over, and over ...

3) I've experimented flying on the 6-O'Clock side between 1 and 11 O'Clock and the stability continuously decreases the closer the Pot is adjusted to 1. I haven't experimented with what happens in the "midnight" hour, because I've self taught myself not to force the Wiper past the "speed" bumps, thinking it will decrease the Pot's life expectancy.

There is a possibility that I may be wrong, but in this case I doubt it since all 3 "facts" line up and agree with each other. In other words: Even if I didn't understand how the Pot was built, why would a Pot manufacturer go through the extra trouble and go out of their way to intentionally place "speed" bumps inside the Pot? I'm an old fart, and over the years I've learned, most people (and manufacturers) are lazy and are more likely to take "short cuts" saving time and money. Whenever someone does extra work and spend extra money (i.e. add "speed" bumps), there is normally a reason why they think it is worth the extra effort in the long run.

Off Topic: I haven't posted an Off Topic Music video in a while. I feel the urge!!

Here's a Rebel Yell to help you remember the hazards of flying in the "Midnight Hour":

Billy Idol - Rebel Yell (4 min 59 sec)

(now I feel like tweaking my Pot to midnight!!! )
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Last edited by i812; Dec 07, 2012 at 06:38 PM. Reason: grammar
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Old Oct 31, 2012, 08:30 AM
Mini CP - Nano CPX - Devo 6
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Originally Posted by i812 View Post
It is difficult to see from the somewhat blurry photos, but it looks like they are the "classic" images of what happens when someone "parks" their soldering iron for too long, and/or excessively man-handles parts and ruins solder pads and traces when trying to remove parts.

Solder bridges (I'm not certain you have any) can be removed by careful reheating and allowing excess solder to "wick" onto the tip of a "clean" soldering iron or onto a bare wire. Clean tip of soldering, or cut of tip of bare wire and re-wick as required to remove all excess solder.

Lifted/Missing solder Pads (it looks like you may have a few at the Power Lead connections on both sides of the PWB) can be made functional by the Jumper-wire technique. Most of the PWB traces can be improvised by solder tacking 30 AWG insulated wire from component lead to component lead. BTW, I believe most people lift or ruin Solder Pads or traces is from using excessive manhandling of parts when trying to remove them from the PWB. Probably the best way to remove "stubborn" through hole parts from a PWB is to "wick" (as described above on how to remove solder bridges) and remove the existing solder from the joint, prior to gently removing the part. Using excessive force to "rip" the part off the PWB, is probably the easiest way to ruin a solder pad or trace.

One of the most important things to learn about soldering is DON'T CAMP. Just heat the solder joint long enough to melt the solder joint, then LEAVE. You're not trying to "roast" stuff, you're only trying to "wet" (turn solid crystalline solid into it's liquid phase) the solder, any additional heating after the melting point will not make the solder "wetter" (more liquid), it will only raise the temperature. When soldering you only want to use enough heat to melt the solder, not raise the temperature much more than the melting point. "Camping" with a soldering iron, should only be done for roasting things like marshmallows, and hot dogs, not electrical parts.

I can't tell for certain by looking at your blurry photos, but from the first photo on the left, it looks like both Power lead solder pads on that side of the board are questionable (no longer making good electrical connections). If so, I would simply improvise a new/extra electrical connection from each power lead to the Capacitor (yellowish looking part to the left of Power lead solder pads)

I can't tell for certain by looking at your blurry photos, but from the second photo on the right, it looks like both Power lead solder pads may be missing (not making electrical connections) on that side of the board. If so, then I'd use the 30 AWG Jumper Wire repair technique. Without assembly drawings giving component names, it would be difficult and time consuming for me to describe the required "From .... To ..." Jumper Wire connections. It would be much simpler to have someone take a close-up photo showing the traces on a good PWB, so you can inspect and identify where all the required electrical component connects should be, as well as what is NOT supposed to be connected. I would take a close up photo of a good PWB for you to compare against, but I don't have the proper equipment. If you want to attempt do the micro-soldering repair, then perhaps you can request someone post a close-up photo of both sides of a a good PWB?

Finally, some of the electrical parts in your photo look like they are discolored. The discoloration may be a sign that the electrical part may have been heated to much, and may have been internally deformed/damaged. Most electrical parts are designed to withstand some heat (enough heat AND for as long a time to melt solder, BUT not for extended time periods - i.e. NO CAMPING )

Soldering is fairly easy to learn and do; however it is best to learn on scrap boards, because if you learn on your own like I did (last century), you'll learn from trial and error. It was easier to learn how to solder last century, because the electrical parts and PWB traces back then were about ten times larger. Today, electrical circuit board rework requires better vision, steadier hand, more patience, and smaller soldering tip (actually most of the rework on this board would probably best be accomplished with a Hot Air Reflow Nozzle).

If any of y'all in the US have boards that you'll be trashing, please give them to me. I'll gladly pay for the shipping (should be about $2 USPS First Class Mail). I have a few boards someone asked me to fix but they are missing parts (connectors, FETS, etc).

I'd offer to fix your board, because it looks like it only needs re-soldering and maybe some extra Jumper Wire; however, I don't think it would be fair to fix yours before I fix the others that I have.
Thank you for the thorough reply, I really appreciate you taking your time out to explain the process. I probably did leave my iron on the pcb a little too long, and I'm not too sure I have the skills needed to repair it. I'll try repairing it on my own as per your instructions, but just incase I went ahead and ordered an extra one as well. Thank you again, it's honesty people like yourself that make RCG what it is today.
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Old Oct 31, 2012, 09:01 AM
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To the guy with the bad RX solder. There is a guy on helifreak in the minicp forum that repairs boards. 30$ and he can fix just about anything wrong with it. Its cheaper then a new one! I would fix it for you for free since I know how to solder but I dont know where the jumper wire would be needed. I am unsure of the boards layout in that respect. If I were you then I would take it to a local tv repair place. If you can find one that looks really old and has just one old guy working then most likely he will do it for free. Hopefully he isnt a grumpy old guy.

To the guy who was looking for a motor, I keep hearing good things about the AEO hummingbird motor. Its a c05 but stronger, it has a ducted fan type thing on it but these little motors never get hot. People on helifreak say that the hummingbird is probably the same as the matt bockman prototype motor(do a search on google for that). I have the bockman motor and it is a lot stronger then the older c05 motor. When I say old c05 it means the older version, I had read there is a new version c05 that is par with the bockman motor, or so I have read. The hp05 from what itsmillertime had posted was getting 10 minutes of mild/great flipping flight! with governor enabled blheli flashed esc. But he was using 500mah or 550mah batteries. He had said that with the hp06v2 he was getting 5 or 6min governed crazy nuts power with the 500 or 550mah batteries.

I have my blheli flashed esc in the mail and my next upgrade will be the hp02 tail motor with xp3a esc for tail. When you have the blheli flashed esc then you can get a governor mode which is fantastic! If you can rewind motors then I would rewind a m5 which is a c05 that sits higher. They are much easier to rewind since you done have to take the stator off. If you only have a c05 then stick it in the freezer for a day, wrap it in paper towel and grap the stator with pliers and it will spin off.

Depending on how you wind it either delta or WYE you will find that you can get a wide range of results. You can get a screaming fast motor thats eats batteries in a minute or one that I managed 81 flips in 6min 30 seconds and still had battery to spare usind the 300mah batteries from hobbyking for the solopro http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s..._Pro_100_.html only 1.82$
The one c05/m5 wired delta zipped right int0o the ceiling on my first pitch pump. I wasnt expecting that much power I didnt think it was possible with a m5/c05 but battery life was under a minute. The good thing about wiring the motor for delta config. is if the motor is too powerful then you can solder it up as WYE. If you wire a motor up WYE and want to change it to delta it is almost impossible. If you need to ask why etc then you need to read up on it all.
It is a lot of fun rewinding a motor. You really dont know what you will end up with at the end, its definitely addicting too. Here is a post with a vid of one my rewinds. http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/newre...eply&t=1570630
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Old Oct 31, 2012, 09:47 AM
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Israel, Adi
Joined May 2006
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is this the one you are talking about?
http://www.topcopter.com/AEO-m5-Brus...otor-p/770.htm

how is it at stock because i am not sure i will be able to rewind without destroy it...

also found this one

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...elicopter.html

looks like the same.
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Old Oct 31, 2012, 10:23 AM
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yes that is the more powerful motor. If you want to take a shot a rewinding then buy a used one or an old one. If you can rewind well enough and use the right combination with turns and wire size then you can always guarantee more power then what the stock can push out.

I had read that the humminbird might be the new 14,000kv c05/m5 main motor from hobbyking here http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...dProduct=25435 and here is a review of the 14,000kv m5/c05 motor from hk
http://www.helifreak.com/showpost.ph...5&postcount=24

They also have a tail motor too!!
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...X_FBL100_.html

here are some reviews here http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=452658
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Old Nov 02, 2012, 04:01 PM
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Big Island of Hawaii
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbstnp View Post
003 rings are a bit thinner than stock dampeners, so you basically need a thin washer otherwise you will get play. Possibly you can run like that though, these micros can take a lot of mechanical imperfections.
Opps, My mistake, U R correct. I forgot to mention that I used small washers as spacers when replaceing the stock dampeners with -003 90 durometer o-rings. IMO well worth the results.
RD
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Old Nov 03, 2012, 12:24 PM
Heli Crash Survivor
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United States, AR, North Little Rock
Joined Feb 2011
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I put a HM-V120D06-Z-09 tail motor on my MCP which has a HP05S main I took off my crashed V100D08. Tail on hard pitch pumps & ever thing is rock solid no more blow outs. Also rldeveer thanks for the tip on getting those hyperions 320mah batteries to fit in the MCP stock battery cage/skid. Haven't done it yet still using the stock 350mah from my V100D08 which are a perfect fit on stock MCP skid. With the HP05S & 350mah I get a good 3 minute flight time. Think I'll will be trying soon to get my 600mah to fit some way on the MCP I use on my V120D02's.

rldeveer solution below for those 320mah.

I have one skid modified to use this battery, that I keep on one of my 2 BL Mini/Genius'. Heated a pair of needle nose pliers and inserted where batt goes and applied pressure in the open position. Take it slow and keep working it. After widened, cut out the bottom ribs so it can clamp onto the batt. Getting a good solid 5:30 compared to 3:00 on the 240mah. Worth having a special skid IMO. Easy to change on a Mini.
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 09:11 AM
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Joined Jul 2008
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that HM-V120D06-Z-09 tail motor, is that a direct fit? or is it 7mm? If its 7mm then where did you buy your mount? Do you use the stock minicp tail prop with that motor? Do you have to enlarge the hole on the prop or is it press fit?

Any idea of how much the HM-V120D06-Z-09 weighs compared to the mini's stock tail motor? I am very intrigued, please tell me more!!! I dont like the idea of adding an extra esc for a brushless tail. Plus that is extra weight too.
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 10:52 AM
Heli Crash Survivor
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United States, AR, North Little Rock
Joined Feb 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mescalinedream View Post
that HM-V120D06-Z-09 tail motor, is that a direct fit? or is it 7mm? If its 7mm then where did you buy your mount? Do you use the stock minicp tail prop with that motor? Do you have to enlarge the hole on the prop or is it press fit?

Any idea of how much the HM-V120D06-Z-09 weighs compared to the mini's stock tail motor? I am very intrigued, please tell me more!!! I dont like the idea of adding an extra esc for a brushless tail. Plus that is extra weight too.
Bought this MCP used from indoorheli & the tail motor mount I believe is for the Blade MCPX. But the tail mount was still to small & I used a round file but in the process of filing & checking fit the tail mount split. It went in then so I just hot glued it. I also had to reverse polarity of the tail motor wires for it to spin counter clock wise & it's 7mm. I did use the stock tail prop & one spin thru with a size 60/.040 drill bit fit perfect. Don't know the weight but it's the same length & 1mm larger. Bought this to learn & bang around practicing flips & inverted hovering. After putting this tail motor on it has been a blast. I did some of my tightest flips ever & invert hovering & flip back to up right ever. It so cool to have a mini with out worrying about the tail not staying locked in. Once I get more confident my 3 V120D02's 3 axis will be put thru the enjoyment of more than just normal flying. Below are 3 pics of my MCP.
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 01:42 PM
Heli Crash Survivor
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United States, AR, North Little Rock
Joined Feb 2011
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I just bought 2 each on motor & motor mount to try on my GCP with a HP05S or my GCP with a CO5M & one for my friends MCP with a C05M.
http://astroid-designs.myshopify.com...ctions/walkera
Since I can't find any HM-V120D06-Z-09 or 4G3 tail motors in the States.
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 05:48 PM
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Austria
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What does MCP's firmware update in Walkera's website do?
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 08:19 PM
Heli Crash Survivor
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United States, AR, North Little Rock
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Originally Posted by helicopter_new View Post
What does MCP's firmware update in Walkera's website do?
Well Walkera remarks are: 1: It’s necessary to use the UP02 and UP02 adaptor for this upgrade steps.
2: This ugprade software optimized the programe,and improved the stability of the flight.
From what I read is don't waste your money on the UP02 and UP02 adaptor for this upgrade & most could tell no difference & also if you do upgrade it still says you are at version V1.0 not V1.1 so you can't even tell if you were already at the latest firmware or if there even was one.
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Old Nov 04, 2012, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Crash Survivor View Post
Well Walkera remarks are: 1: Itís necessary to use the UP02 and UP02 adaptor for this upgrade steps.
2: This ugprade software optimized the programe,and improved the stability of the flight.
From what I read is don't waste your money on the UP02 and UP02 adaptor for this upgrade & most could tell no difference & also if you do upgrade it still says you are at version V1.0 not V1.1 so you can't even tell if you were already at the latest firmware or if there even was one.
Some people reported they could do inverted funnels and such after the upgrade. I can't confirm since my skills aren't that good.

Version reported by upgrade tool is the hardware version, which obviously doesn't change.

BTW, you can can UP02 + UP02 adapter for around $12 + shipping from hobbyone.
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Old Nov 05, 2012, 01:19 PM
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San Jacinto, California
Joined Jan 2004
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Had to change my main frame out and after I did that the Aiel servos on the right side goes to full up when the throttle is applied. I cannot figure out whay this is happening. I change nothing in the transmitter. Everything is working as should, left aeil goes left, right aeil goes right (looking from the tail) forward and back pitch OK. But as soon as I apply throttle and try to take off the bird just want to go left and I do not have enough stick to correct.
Blade tracking seem to be good pitch curve and throttle curve are pretty much standard.
Anyone have any suggestions ???? I can take a video and post it, if you think that would help.
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