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Old Aug 02, 2012, 02:12 PM
That's so classic you.
Generic Member's Avatar
United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
347 Posts
Hey Doug. My dad lives in Trabuco Canyon. I might be out there for a visit. Where do people fly in that area. Back when I lived in OC (in the 70's-80's) Mile Square Park is where we used to fly.
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Old Aug 02, 2012, 04:04 PM
Raised on 80's Pattern
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Rancho Santa Margarita, CA
Joined May 2006
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Jeff,

I live right next to Trabuco Canyon.

Mile Square Park is now a golf course. More revenue for the County!!

Couple of choices out our way....

Trabuco Canyon Flyers have a field actually in Trabuco Canyon. Paved field. Lousy horizon. Telephone lines right where I would want to place my pattern plane.

Black Star - A number of clubs banded together and built this field about 15 mins from Trabuco. Nice facility. Everything is welcome there if you are a member of one of the clubs. Lousy horizon.

El Toro Marine Base (The Great Park) - Electrics only, cross wind landing, sun in your eyes in the afternoon, club rule following crazys.

Prado - 45 min from Trabuco but the best place to fly pattern. Except for the time when a member told me to "fly the pattern" when I was flying pattern, it is a good place.

Let me know if you visit again and we can meet and fly.

Doug
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Old Aug 02, 2012, 08:06 PM
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stuntflyr's Avatar
Los Angeles
Joined Jun 2010
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Thanks for the pictures of Mile Square, Doug. The R/C, F/F and C/L activity there was a 7 day a week deal.

Too many Warbird guys at Prado! But now that there is an IMAC event there, and there are a sizeable number of Pattern pilots as members and using the field for practice, it's useable and tolerable!
10 dollar day fee for non-members.

Chris...
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Old Sep 04, 2012, 08:17 AM
That's so classic you.
Generic Member's Avatar
United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
347 Posts
The little Skymaster has not been forgotten nor neglected. I have been slowly but persistantly working on it. The last little bits and pieces have been getting checked off the list and now I'm down to just the pipe mount and glass/Monokote. KlassKote sent me the replacement True Red matching paint and it's a pretty good match.
The wing and stab have been given a coat of Poly finishing resin and are ready for Monokote.

The only thing holding me up is the ~70deg bent exhaust extension that will travel through the fuse. Not sure what I'm going to use for that.
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Old Sep 04, 2012, 03:20 PM
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doxilia's Avatar
Montreal, Canada
Joined Mar 2008
1,842 Posts
Jeff,

I recall seeing that K&S at Tower had the correct OD alum tubing to couple to the stinger. Of course, it needs to be bent as needed. A single piece coupled in the deck area should avoid any potential exhaust leak into the fuse interior.

Looking forward to seeing her finished!

David
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 10:23 AM
That's so classic you.
Generic Member's Avatar
United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
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I'm in un-charted waters with the finishing of my Skymaster.
My orignial plan was to glass the fuse/fin with Z-poxy and .5oz glass cloth. Apply Monokote to the open structure wing and stab. The wing and stab have a coat of polyester finishing resin applied as a sealer.

I'm re-thinking the application of Monokote to the stab as I would rather finish the stab with the fuse so I can apply a nice fillet etc as opposed to covering the stab and glueing it in place.

Sooooo... I'd like to apply a paintable covering to the open framework of the stab, then glue it in place so I can finish it with the fuse (KlassKote epoxy paint).

Since I've already applied the poly finishing resin, is Silkspan and nitrate out of the question? I thought about Koverall, but I'm worried about the shrinkage warping the structure.

I've thought about thinning the stab structure and laminating 1/64" balsa top/bottom then glassing.

Thoughts?
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 10:43 AM
That's so classic you.
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United States, NC, Stokesdale
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The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of sheeting the stab. It's kinda flimsy anyway.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 11:34 AM
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Montreal, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Generic Member View Post
I'm in un-charted waters with the finishing of my Skymaster.

I've thought about thinning the stab structure and laminating 1/64" balsa top/bottom then glassing.

Thoughts?
Mmm... 1/64" balsa sounds paper thin and if memory serves the stab doesn't have a numerous rib structure. When I put the model into CAD I thought about that and decided to instead thin out the frame by using thinner wood and cover the top and bottom with 1/32" which should hold up better. Heck, even if the stab winds up a little thicker overall, it shouldn't be a big deal. I believe it is designed at the equivalent of 3/16" in metric which allows a 1/8" frame to be built and sheeted with 1/32" top and bottom.

Given that you've already built the stab you could go the 1/64" route but another option would be to cover with transparent MK, then cutout the area where it is to be glued to the fuse leaving an extra 3/16" of bare wood on either side of the fuse where you will create the fillet prior to lightly sanding the MK and priming the entire frame. I suspect this will be lighter than the sheeting and glassing process. At that point, covering the wing in transparent might seem like an attractive idea as well as you'd wind up with a completely painted model.

I've painted MK with good success although apparently UC is the better way to go - both for trim MK colors atop as well as for paint. One thing that doesn't happen is that you don't wind up with wrinkled MK under the paint - the paint prevents this from happening. Wrinkles can develop in MK elsewhere if not painted. I have never painted an entirely covered transparent MK structure so I don't know how it holds up in the long run but before the super lightweight coverings, transparent MK was often suggested as a way to finish warbirds. The HOB kits in particular used this approach and being 10-15 size birds or smaller, it must have been a viable approach in terms of weight. Transparent MK is a fair bit thinner than colored MK and correspondingly lighter.

I finished a Tipo last fall in a combination of MK surfaces and painted glass fuse/fin. I painted the base white/red and then covered the wing and stab in red/white prior to adding trim colors. I made the fillet between the glass fuse and the foam core sheeted stab prior to primer so that the fillet was painted entirely and the MK only had to extend up to the fillet. This requires a little fairing in of the paint into the wood prior to covering but nothing too complex. The CC was applied over the paint once everything was painted and covered overlapping the MK edge to seal it down. I think this is an often used approach.

Looking forward Jeff.

David
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 12:30 PM
That's so classic you.
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United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
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I appreciate your input David.

I am going to thin down the stab structure and add 1/32" sheeting top and bottom. The stab is quite flimsy as it sits and adding a shrinkable covering may warp the structure.
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Old Sep 06, 2012, 02:10 PM
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CSpaced's Avatar
Oak Ridge, NC
Joined Jun 2006
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I gotta say, Jeff has done a fantastic job building this kit, lots of attention to detail and beautifully finished curves and fillets. Hopefully I'll be able to grab some nice photos of it before he paints it.
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Old Sep 30, 2012, 01:26 PM
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Montreal, Canada
Joined Mar 2008
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Jeff,

The Fall is upon us and I was wondering how your SM build was coming along?

Paint?

David
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Old Oct 01, 2012, 08:44 AM
That's so classic you.
Generic Member's Avatar
United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
347 Posts
Hi David.

The weather is a lot nicer now. It wont be long before I start painting. I just need to finalize some last bits before glassing.
I've been obsessing over the exhaust routing. I was searching for a wye piece to make a "dual exhaust" out the cooling openings. I've come to the conclusion that it's going to be more hassle than it's worth and now I'll go back to my original plan of routing it down through the fuse and exit out the bottom.

I re-made a new stab out of solid 3/16" sheet stock as the original is quite flimsy. Now I can glass the fuse and tail all at once.
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Old Oct 01, 2012, 09:02 AM
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Montreal, Canada
Joined Mar 2008
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Jeff,

Quote:
Originally Posted by Generic Member View Post
Hi David.

The weather is a lot nicer now. It wont be long before I start painting. I just need to finalize some last bits before glassing.

I've been obsessing over the exhaust routing. I was searching for a wye piece to make a "dual exhaust" out the cooling openings. I've come to the conclusion that it's going to be more hassle than it's worth and now I'll go back to my original plan of routing it down through the fuse and exit out the bottom.
Good call, it will be much more elegant and stay cleaner too. With a pair of thin CF pushrods on either side, you should be able to get to the elevators without the exhaust routing being an issue. I started drawing pushrod guides in formers in a few different CAD jobs in order to accomplish the routing of the rods while allowing the diverter to be centered on the fuse - for what its worth...
Quote:
I re-made a new stab out of solid 3/16" sheet stock as the original is quite flimsy. Now I can glass the fuse and tail all at once.
That's good to know. I drew the CAD version to be sheeted with 1/16" which would result in 1/4" thick stab if one used a 1/8" core. Maybe it's not worth the trouble and a 3/16" sheet stab might be easier.

David
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 05:46 PM
That's so classic you.
Generic Member's Avatar
United States, NC, Stokesdale
Joined Jul 2006
347 Posts
David,
I think 3/16" solid stock for the stab is the best solution.

I finally got around to breaking in the OS. 25 VF DF. I must say, it is a VERY user friendly engine. Hand starts extreamly easy. I put about 48oz of fuel through it at a rich two stoke and an 8x4 prop for break in.
I switched to a 8x6 APC and tuned the pipe/header. I trimmed as much as I dare off the header to start then started on the pipe. I was able to get 18,800 peak. I dont think thats high enough for the DF version so I switched to the APC 8x5. I was able to get 20,150 peak with the header and pipe as short as I can get it (comfortably). I know the DF can spin higher, but I have some reservations about going to a 7" prop or a 4 pitch on this plane.
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Old Oct 02, 2012, 06:54 PM
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doxilia's Avatar
Montreal, Canada
Joined Mar 2008
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Jeff,

Excellent news!

It sounds like the 8x5 prop might be the best option. I seem to recall OS specs mentioning ~22K on their recommended props for the DF version. But I agree, a 7" prop likely not going to have a lot of vertical pull.

Looking forward to further progress.

David
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