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Old Mar 02, 2015, 08:09 PM
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Tarot 450 Pro v2 FBL Build - 2015

I'm starting a new thread for the sake of accumulating current information about the Tarot 450 Pro v2 FBL and how to build it, and also to get information centralized in one place for this particular heli kit instead of scattered around. As I find nuggets of info in other threads and even elsewhere on the Internet, I will post that info here.

This will not be a build log per se, but an accumulation of information about this specific heli kit. It also will serve as a Tarot 450 FBL Q&A, I hope. As such, topics like component selection, general clone parts compatibility, upgrade parts, customizations, and similar build-related posts will not be considered thread hijacking or off point. If you need Tarot 450 Pro FBL info, please do not hesitate to post here. I hope there isn't too much talk of DFC, but I think it's inevitable. I did not select DFC, and I do not want DFC at this time, in part due to wanting to put it in scale fuselages where a low head might not be the best idea. Maybe later on another heli.

So, here we go.

My kit from Banggood arrived today. Yeah!

Banggood has conflicting information about the pinion gear. It does come with a 14 tooth pinion, and it even says it on the box, so Banggood needs to update their info. The teeth on the pinion and main gear are straight.

So far so good on the unboxing. The CF parts are flawless. All the bearings feel good with no slop and no crunching or grinding. I actually like that Tarot didn't even screw things together finger tight. It makes it perfectly obvious that we need to Loctite everything, and it makes it hard to forget when everything isn't even finger tight. Fit and finish on all the parts looks good.

I had to go to the auto parts store to get some new Loctite. Since when does a little tube of Loctite cost $6.99! That's robbery! Of course, I paid it.

I'm still waiting for other parts like servos, ESC, gold mini-KBAR, etc. I'll post a full parts list with links later. I'll start working on things like the head while I wait for the rest of the parts. It shouldn't be too much longer. Chinese New Year slowed everything down, but all of my parts have shipped now. Despite Chinese New Year, Banggood got the kit to me in only 3 weeks. That's a week longer than it usually takes to get things to me, but it's to be expected around Chinese New Year.

I'd like to put this heli into one of the two scale fuselages I have bought recently, but first, I need to get the kit together. Step 1: Build heli and make sure it flies correctly. Step 2: Consider how to mount it in a scale fuselage.

This will be my first build. Fortunately, CPO over on YouTube has done an awesome set of step-by-step videos for building this heli, in excruciating detail.

Here we go!

-Florida Heli-
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Old Mar 02, 2015, 08:40 PM
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Watching this thread!

I just ordered one of these helicopter kits today from Banggood. I've already made a good many of the equipment choices but I still had to pick up a few items. Some of the items I need I already ordered also from Banggood but as you recommend different orders.

I expect building this will be fun.
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Old Mar 02, 2015, 08:43 PM
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Parts list with correct Tarot part numbers will be added here later. Updated 6/14/2015 - a lot of part numbers will be added to the list of correct part numbers after a massive order of parts comes in mid July.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Correct Tarot part numbers will go here as they are verified.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Consolidating purchase discussions from other places for reference:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Heli View Post
OK, it's time to buy an economical but decent quality 450 motor for the scale build. I found this:

http://www.banggood.com/Tarot-450-PR...-p-927451.html

Other suggestions? Hurry because Chinese New Year is coming next week!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
Here are three options, from HK, all with 4mm bearings. Not saying the Tarot motor doesn't have 4mm bearings - it probably does, since it takes a 3.5mm pinion.

NTM 3400kv



and the SK3 2700kv



The Rotorstar 3600kv looks promising too.



tho like the SK3 it's not available from the US warehouses yet. All three already have the 3.5mm bullets fitted, which I like.

The Tarot motor is a bit hot, at 3800kv if you're going to use it for scale flying.

My JR Forza kit came with a 3500kv NTM, and it seems like a great motor so far.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Heli View Post
NTM 3400Kv sold! I had $1 of reward points, and with the sale it was only $21.50 delivered from the USA West warehouse.

2Doggs ... is the GV8000 better than the gold mini? I still haven't really found out if it is better, for twice the price. It's $86 at Banggood.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
I'm not even sure it's better, but it's definitely not that much better, when you can get the Gold (yellow) Kbar for $27 shipped. Just think, for the difference, you could almost buy yourself three KST115's.....!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Heli View Post
Done. Gold KBAR on order. Thanks again.

Cheap but good tail servo? Come up with that one and I think I'm finished.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Doggs View Post
I know you don't want to shell out for a 306g or a KST115, so the HK732MG would be a good choice. It's a Park size servo, so fits the 450 Pro mount without an adaptor, great torque. I have one on my 500 and it's been flawless.
-Florida Heli-
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Old Mar 03, 2015, 03:29 AM
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You will love this heli. I had the Tarot 450 pro for a number of years. Flew great, but I got the combo version. Everything was great.
If you need parts, eventully and you will, I got All my parts from Ebay dealer. GOGORC. Excellent service andn very fast shipping, still get all my Tarot 500 parts from there now.
Good luck will love to see pics. Enjoy
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Old Mar 03, 2015, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dteel View Post
FH, what pinion gear are you going to buy or did you buy for your Tarot 450?
OK you knowledgeable builders out there. Help me out with my pinion. I found this and I am wondering if it is accurate:

Quote:
Originally Posted by stone_axe View Post
You can hear the speed of your head and figure out where you need to be.

At 2,200 rpm the head is noisy and it takes a fair amount of pitch to hover. The head speed can bog down below critical stability speeds when you add pitch - no fun! Hovering is stable as long as you don't move the sticks much.

At 2,500 rpm the head begins to "sing" and smooth out. The head speed doesn't vary so much when you change pitch and the heli is docile. This is a good head speed for hovering and basic training.

At 3,000 rpm the head sounds serious and the heli jumps when you move the sticks. This is a good head speed for fast forward flight and aerobatics - but too touchy for hovering and close-in work.

At 3,300 rpm the head sounds angry and the heli changes direction quickly when you think about moving the sticks. This is a good head speed for 3D, scaring children draining your battery and heating your gear.
The Tarot 450 Pro FBL kit came with a 14T pinion in the box. I have a 3400Kv motor. I will be flying a large, heavy scale fuselage. Shouldn't I change pinions? How about an 11T pinion? Doing the math that would be 2750 head speed roughly?

I assume that dteel will not be flying a scale fuselage, and I think he has a 3800Kv motor. What pinion for him?

Update 6/14/2015: Went with Align hardened steel 12T pinion with very good results.

-Florida Heli-
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Old Mar 04, 2015, 02:52 AM
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I had the Tarot 3800kv motor which was a power house and my kit came with a 13T and that was pretty insane headpseed, If you going scale yes I would think 11T.
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Old Mar 07, 2015, 09:17 AM
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I chose the EMAX HL2215 3800KV for my Tarot 450 build and I intend to use a YEP 40A ESC.

Currently I'm planning on using EMAX ES09MD Digital Swash Servo for the cyclic and possibly the tail servo.

All these parts are on order but none arrived at this point so just dreaming.
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Old Mar 08, 2015, 06:16 PM
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Consider a set of the carbon fiber landing skids (tarot-rc-heli.com). Raises the tail just enough to cut down on tail strikes during landings.
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Old Mar 11, 2015, 01:18 PM
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I'm hearing some comments that indicate my idea to buy a 3800Kv motor for the Tarot 450 were not well thought out. Maybe I'll buy a set of motors and just change them out when I want to change head speed.

What motor would you suggest?
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Old Mar 11, 2015, 03:05 PM
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I wanted to use wood blades for a while, and I may still, but due to their fragility I would have to be careful with my speed so the head doesn't explode. I keep thinking of the guy with the Raptor 50 on YouTube running up the heli on the ground with negative pitch until the head quite literally explodes. I know some of these 3D guys run the head speed way up, probably way over the rated speed for their blades, but they seem to get away with it. Of course, you don't always hear about the failures. There are lots of exploding heli videos on YouTube.

Raptor 50 explosion (1 min 16 sec)


-Florida Heli-
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Old Mar 11, 2015, 04:31 PM
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I think I'm going to order this motor from HK. It seems like a good choice. There are several motors advertised as Tarot 450 Pro V2 motors and they range up to 3800Kv. Considering this motor is a whopping $18 I'll buy it and just use it elsewhere if it turns out to be a bad idea.
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Old Mar 12, 2015, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggiz View Post
I had the Tarot 3800kv motor which was a power house and my kit came with a 13T and that was pretty insane headpseed, If you going scale yes I would think 11T.
Do you have link for this motor ? i have a bird thinking about a stronger motor.
Thank you
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Old Mar 15, 2015, 07:32 PM
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I'm ready for my kit to arrive from BG!

I ordered on March 2nd so I suppose I have a bit to wait yet. I was tempted to click on the tracking button but managed to resist.
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Old Mar 15, 2015, 07:42 PM
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Oh, go ahead and click on tracking. I know you don't like it, but you have nothing to loose and something to gain. It should lead you to the 17Track site. Once it shows up in the US, the USPS will track it to your mail box. I got one order yesterday, I have one order that has arrived at the post office for delivery tomorrow, and another one that is in Chicago clearing customs. My tail servo is still on the slow boat from China. They sent it registered <sigh> and that always slows it way down.

Be glad I am slightly ahead on this one. It's going to have a few bumps along the ride. For example, the Jesus Bolt is unacceptable. This tiny problem resulted in a 6 hour search and research to find out what other people do in this case.

I posted this in a dedicated thread, and I will repost it here for reference.

Why is it that every time I Google search something the only useful results come from the "other" RC heli site, which is down, and has been up and down all week, and which will continue to be up and down for the forseeable future?

I used a Google cached page from the "other" web site to get my answer. I figured I was not the only person to have this problem. Most others seem to get a bolt that is longer and cut it off. Others resort to bolts with full threads. However, these bolts are weakened significantly by the reduced bolt diameter where the threads are cut. The ideal bolt would be a "collared" or "shouldered" bolt.

From what I can find, two manufacturers do, in fact, make a collared M2x14, and people seek them out. One manufacturer is Hirobo. The other is Super Tiger.

I ordered 20 of the Super Tiger bolts from Taiwan for $6.50, but I got the last set in stock. I also ordered the only pack of them I could find in the US. As far as I can tell, there is no more US stock left. These bolts work great!

Align has a shouldered 15 mm bolt that I tried, and it does not work. It is long enough, but it does not have enough thread.

I swear, a major portion of this hobby has become detective work because I'm a noob. Oh well, that can't last forever, right?

One thing I have learned in RC over the years is that you can never, ever have enough screws. At the flying field when I used to go out there on weekends, there was always someone walking around the pit area desperately trying to find someone with a particular size screw so he wouldn't be grounded for the rest of the day when one broke or fell out. I never discard any broken heli or part without stripping it of all screws first. I have two sets of 450 replacement screws on order right now. Adding these 14mm bolts to my parts bin will help build up my arsenal of screws so I don't have to go searching when a 12mm falls a bit short, like this one has, or when a collared bolt really would be best for strength.

[ENDSEARCH]

-Florida Heli-
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Old Mar 18, 2015, 01:07 AM
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You might consider the SK3 2700 kv motor that is "intended" for a 4S power system on a 450, but run it on 3S. This is what I have in my 450Pro guts inside a Hughes 500 fuse like in your photo.

Here is my maiden YT:
Hughes 500E scale (3 min 41 sec)


I'm using 12T pinion on a 150T straight cut gear, and using a 0, 90,90,90,90 curve have a tached 2200 HS using woodie 350mm blades without any issue on tail strikes, etc.

I'm also only using an old Align 35 amp ESC with a 3amp switching UBEC powering the HS65MG cyclic and Futaba tail.

On the 500 fuse you will have issues getting enough weight forward I think. I had to use a 2200 and 1300 3s pack to get it to balance.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dteel View Post
I'm hearing some comments that indicate my idea to buy a 3800Kv motor for the Tarot 450 were not well thought out. Maybe I'll buy a set of motors and just change them out when I want to change head speed.

What motor would you suggest?
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