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Old Nov 17, 2012, 01:41 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
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Originally Posted by MrMention View Post
If you can start with a 4 ch plane. You'll save yourself some re-learning time later
Hey guys! Another one!

There is no re-learning.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 02:11 PM
An itch?. Scratch build.
eflightray's Avatar
South Wales U.K.
Joined Mar 2003
13,397 Posts
Obviously time for someone to come up with a 4 channel plane that has adjustable dihedral.

Dial some in for the added self recovery whilst learning to fly, and dial it out when you get to improving your aerobatics.
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Old Nov 17, 2012, 08:37 PM
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alibongo's Avatar
United Kingdom, England, Dorset
Joined Apr 2010
969 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins View Post
Hey guys! Another one!

There is no re-learning.
To my mind, learning to fly rc is like learning to drive a car-whether you learn on auto or manual, the switch over is easier than if you have never driven before.I'll bet I could switch to Mode 1 easier than a newbie could learn from scratch.I wouldn't want to, but I'll bet my right hand thumb skills could transfer to left hand thumb skills without a crash!It is learning the skills in the first place that is the problem.
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Old Nov 18, 2012, 11:39 PM
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Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Feb 2010
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Originally Posted by alibongo View Post
I'll bet my right hand thumb skills could transfer to left hand thumb skills without a crash!It is learning the skills in the first place that is the problem.
Dont bet on it, much of your skills are muscle memory and that does not transfer from one hand to the other.

I'd bet the instant you stopped really concentrating on what you are doing with your fingers you would get into trouble.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:52 AM
Rocket Programmer
jasmine2501's Avatar
United States, AZ, Mesa
Joined Jul 2007
25,419 Posts
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Originally Posted by desertstalker View Post
Dont bet on it, much of your skills are muscle memory and that does not transfer from one hand to the other.

I'd bet the instant you stopped really concentrating on what you are doing with your fingers you would get into trouble.
I know a guy... he's one of the best pattern pilots in the club - he flies mode 1 on his planes, but he can fly your plane in mode 2 just fine. I don't know how he does it, but muscle memory is easily overcome - it's not even a real thing...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_memory
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 08:57 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,400 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by eflightray View Post
Obviously time for someone to come up with a 4 channel plane that has adjustable dihedral.

Dial some in for the added self recovery whilst learning to fly, and dial it out when you get to improving your aerobatics.
It would just take a couple of interchangeable wings. I think it would be cool to fly 3 channel, aileron, elevator, throttle too just to show that it's no different from rudder, elevator, throttle in a plane with dihedral. Lots of people fly their 4-channel planes that way anyway!

But 2 wings for one plane would work really well.
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Old Nov 20, 2012, 10:14 AM
Registered User
United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
4,960 Posts
Hobbytown sells a flatter, aileron equipped wing for their Ares Gamma 370. They now have the Gamma 370 Pro Rx-R which comes equipped with the aileron wing and brushless power system for the whopping price of $99.99. It's on my Christmas list.
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 10:30 AM
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E-Challenged's Avatar
United States, CA, Garden Grove
Joined Oct 2000
12,070 Posts
I think that it is best to start off with a 3-channel model like a Bixler or Easy Star with rudder, elevator and throttle, to get you started. As soon as you can make the powered glider go where you want it to, transition to high wing Cub-like trainer with ailerons, rudder and elevator controls plus throttle (4 channels). Have either type of model set up with rudder and elevator, or ailerons and elevator ,on the right stick to make transition to use of ailerons easiest. learn to use the rudder seperately for takeoffs, knife edged flight, and to level wings during landings. Learn to use ailerons with rudder to make graceful and level turns. Try using aileron and rudder mix if available on your transmitter. You can switch aileron/rudder mix off or over-ride it giving extra rudder when desired. I use aileron/rudder mix a lot for more relaxed scale model flying . Don't develop fear of using ailerons or fly without use of rudder.
You need to use rudder for scale-like flying and aerobatics and to help get you out of problems in flight such as countering "adverse yaw" with high wing scale models. Adverse yaw means that the down-going aileron has a lot of drag resisting the turn in the desired direction. Use of "differential ailerons" setups means that ailerons go up, but not down as much. Used with rudder to eliminate adverse yaw effects.
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 10:31 AM
Low'n Slow is safest, right?
KaiWE's Avatar
Norge, Østfold, Fredrikstad
Joined Jun 2011
553 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasmine2501 View Post
I know a guy... he's one of the best pattern pilots in the club - he flies mode 1 on his planes, but he can fly your plane in mode 2 just fine. I don't know how he does it, but muscle memory is easily overcome - it's not even a real thing...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscle_memory
Impressing - I have problems just swapping between my DX8 and DX10t, just because the difference in length of the sticks confuses me, and I get my reference points/muscle memory set off...

Need more practice, I guess

On the other hand, I'm perfectly OK swapping between my BSA GoldStar with the gear lever on the right and brake pedal on the left, and my MotoGuzzi with gear on the left/brake on the right - guess I have to start flying with my feets
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 11:11 AM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,400 Posts
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Originally Posted by ChinoDiablo View Post
And one of the best of examples of not following convention is Jimi Hendrix.
Right handed Fender Stratacastor strung left handed and upside down. But then again, Jimi was a guitar genius unlike the rest of us hackers.
Bluesman Albert King also played right handed guitars upside down.
Jimi, Albert and Albert Collins (another one. He used non-standard tunings on his guitar to play things nobody could duplicate) didn't get out of shape and have to hand their guitar over to someone who knew how to play to save the song.

If you decide to reassign control sticks in an arbitrary way you are in effect speaking a different language that nobody else can understand. You can't ask where the bathroom is. Well, you can but it will be useless. And when you find where the bathroom is you can't tell anyone else. You are recommending the exact same thing as a reasonable practice in flying RC planes. I'm calling bullschnitzel on this one!

@chuck: Holy Cow! If Hobbytown isn't careful, their Ares Gamma 370 will end up replacing the Champ and Super Cub as top two learner planes for the unassisted newbie! They have a winning formula there if they market it right.
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 11:21 AM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,400 Posts
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Originally Posted by KaiWE View Post
On the other hand, I'm perfectly OK swapping between my BSA GoldStar with the gear lever on the right and brake pedal on the left, and my MotoGuzzi with gear on the left/brake on the right - guess I have to start flying with my feets
You know, that's a brilliant observation. I can do the same thing with no problem. I can drive a standard transmission and automatic equally well, and I am a two-footed auto transmission driver, so I use my right foot on the brake for standard and left for auto. I can switch back and forth all day and not even realize which I'm driving half the time. And I drove a Honda and Bultaco motorcycle at the same time, switching back and forth with no problems.

My wife can speak Spanglish. When she spends a couple weeks with her Spanish speaking family and comes home, she speaks an unholy mixture of the two languages for awhile, without even realizing it.

I think the same thing would happen switching from Mode 1 to Mode 2. After an initial situation of having to think about what you were doing, very quickly what you already know would transfer to the other thumb. Then you would be ambithumbrious.
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 11:26 AM
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United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
4,960 Posts
I agree completely RR. The only weak spot on the Ares line of high wing trainers is their use of Molex/Tamiya connectors for the ESC and native battery. I have changed mine to EC3 and use the batteries I use to fly my FB Stratos. Other than that, the Gamma 370 is a very durable, high quality plane. With the Pro coming out at $99.99 the thing might very well be the successor to the Champ and Super Cub. I get an automatic 10% discount at my local Hobby Town (Lord knows I spend enough money there.) so my price would be exactly the same as the Champ except for the Gamma Pro being Rx-R. Sweet.

RR, you are dating yourself. Was your Bultaco a street or dirt bike? I raced Moto-Cross in the amateur class when I was in my 20's and 30's for my local Team Kawasaki back in the late 1970's. I haven't seen a Bultaco motorcycle in at least 25 years!!!
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 11:45 AM
Space power
cfircav8r's Avatar
United States, IA, Hampton
Joined May 2012
307 Posts
Would that be the San Marcos Hobby Town?
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 11:53 AM
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United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
4,960 Posts
Unfortunately, the San Marcos Hobby Town doesn't stock the Ares line of products. However, the manager, John, can order anything in the Ares line for you. I plan to do that since they are about 15 minutes from my house. Other wise the Temecula, CA Hobby Town plans to stock the plane. The arrival date for the plane to be in the stores is early December according to the website.
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Old Nov 21, 2012, 01:50 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,400 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by chucksolo69 View Post
RR, you are dating yourself. Was your Bultaco a street or dirt bike? I raced Moto-Cross in the amateur class when I was in my 20's and 30's for my local Team Kawasaki back in the late 1970's. I haven't seen a Bultaco motorcycle in at least 25 years!!!
I had a 1968 Bultaco Matador ISDT replica trials bike. I was a lousy rider but it made me look like a genius. I ran the thing off the top of a 10' seawall that I didn't see because of the high sun angle. The bike was going about 10 mph, dropped off front wheel down. My only thought was "this is gonna hurt" but the front shocks compressed, the bike set the rear wheel down just like I planned it that way and it sneered at me "hit the gas already, why's your jaw dragging on the ground?" It was a truly amazing bike when bikes weren't too amazing as a whole.

Folks, check out this webpage for the Ares Gamma 370. Steerable tail wheel, larger than a Champ, lighter than a Super Cub, optional use prop saver included, Pro aileron wing available separately to convert to 4-channel when you are ready.......unless they TOTALLY blow the marketing angle, here's your new #1 unassisted newbie trainer plane.
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