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Dec 29, 2009, 09:18 PM
launch height can't fix stupid
United States, FL, Indialantic
Joined Jun 2005
1,653 Posts
Quote:
 Originally Posted by L-Spatz Corsha, interesting task that 1.5 km O&R. Starting from a center point,go right 375 meter's(walk aroung the marker and fly past it),return to center continuing on to the left point 375 meter's(walk around the marker and fly past it)return to center for the 1.5 km flight. Or do you see differantly?
That technically would meet the requirement but I think you made it harder doing that. Slope is already at least 750 meters long so you could have just started on one end, flew to the other, and came back to start. Only 2 legs needed to complete task.

I didn't think of it the way you described but don't have a problem with it. I was envisioning a scenario where you had to punch out away from the slope for a certain distance and then try to come back to the start. Not necessarily punch out at a right angle to the slope but definately away from the slope. Probably need to put a minimum distance requirement for a leg if you choose to use 3 waypoints, maybe 25% of the total goal length which in this case would be the 375 meters in your scenario.

By the way, for these shorter distances I can easily see the pilot staying in one place while they fly out to the waypoints and wait for a signal from the helpers. Granted 750 meters can be pretty far out there for a small slope plane though. How big is a 48" combat wing when it is 750 meters away? Love mixing units!!
Cory
Last edited by corsha99; Dec 29, 2009 at 09:26 PM.
Dec 29, 2009, 09:23 PM
launch height can't fix stupid
United States, FL, Indialantic
Joined Jun 2005
1,653 Posts
Quote:
 Originally Posted by rdwoebke That is a good idea. I'm not a slope flyer, but what about a task that involves a vertical climb? Say something like a timed 2-3second vertical climb or something. Ryan
I would consider this to be a basic task for copper level, bronze at the most. Could be included as part of the aerobatic portion, do a certain number of pumps that are vertical for ZZ seconds before turning over at the top and coming back down.
Dec 29, 2009, 10:09 PM
Registered User
Redcliff Alberta
Joined Jul 2008
580 Posts
I routinely fly my 4.22 mtr Ventus out to the point 1.25 km and back with a run of 1 km+ the other way on the Face(main local slope) for a 4.5 km O&R.

Tho by using a small (1.5m?) hand launch(Fling,etc)and light wind's many low hight location's can be used.

Ken
SSP #6

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 Dec 30, 2009, 06:58 AM founder of the SSP Walkerton, Indiana Joined Jul 2004 1,511 Posts Here's another suggestion I've had: An aerobatic schedule to be completed in sequence (simple turn around program) with a time limit. The difficulty factor will depend on the time allowed.
Dec 30, 2009, 09:28 AM
launch height can't fix stupid
United States, FL, Indialantic
Joined Jun 2005
1,653 Posts
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Steve Boone Here's another suggestion I've had: An aerobatic schedule to be completed in sequence (simple turn around program) with a time limit. The difficulty factor will depend on the time allowed.
Instead of a G&R. Not at all fair to the thermal guys.
 Dec 30, 2009, 11:39 AM founder of the SSP Walkerton, Indiana Joined Jul 2004 1,511 Posts There is one other solution. Remove G&R from the basic program all together and not have it until advanced. Which I would hate to do.
 Dec 30, 2009, 01:29 PM launch height can't fix stupid United States, FL, Indialantic Joined Jun 2005 1,653 Posts With your new plan of 3 lower levels and then the advanced, it might work OK. At least for the Bronze level. Goal and return should be something that gets done soon though. What is the real concern with the G&R task? Is it that it is too limiting? I honestly don't know how many people are flying on super small slopes. I just know that the slopes I have flown in CA, CO, SD, KS, MT, ND could support these shorter G&R tasks, especially if 3 waypoints were allowed. Eventually the program should reach a point that not everyone can complete all tasks for some reason or another. I do feel that the Bronze level is probably too early for that to happen though.
 Dec 30, 2009, 07:03 PM Registered User Redcliff Alberta Joined Jul 2008 580 Posts With those of us with inland slope's , stretching up wind to use thermal lift to reach an outward waypoint is ok , but I can see where it will be an issue with those that have costal slope's. I wonder how much lift there is at Torry Pine's when you get out 1/4 of a mile(400 meter's)? Maybe for the first level a 1 km O&R is used with both plane and pilot required to travel the 500 meter distance,as is used with the thermal task's? Ken SSP #6
 Dec 30, 2009, 09:31 PM launch height can't fix stupid United States, FL, Indialantic Joined Jun 2005 1,653 Posts Coastal sites should not have the distance problem. I can't think of any small coastal slopes that don't have a much bigger one nearby. Of course I am probably wrong. Last edited by corsha99; Jan 01, 2010 at 09:37 AM.
Jan 01, 2010, 05:39 AM
Registered User
Mapleton, Australia
Joined May 2003
21 Posts
Quote:
 Originally Posted by corsha99 Instead of a G&R. Not at all fair to the thermal guys.
Steve did not put the whole suggestion in. Suggestion is for slope bronze only. Last item currently is G&R.
Suggest leave G&R in but also have an option to do aerobatic schedule in place of G&R
Charles
 Jan 01, 2010, 07:15 AM founder of the SSP Walkerton, Indiana Joined Jul 2004 1,511 Posts HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!! Are you any closer to a solution for the slope task? We need to get a decision made on what to do. My wife goes back to work next week after her holiday shut down. I plan to get all over this program and have TD through advanced completed in short order. I really don't want to have to decide on the solution to the slope issue but I do need a solution soon. Last edited by Steve Boone; Jan 01, 2010 at 07:21 AM.
 Jan 01, 2010, 09:36 AM launch height can't fix stupid United States, FL, Indialantic Joined Jun 2005 1,653 Posts Elcoba, are you the one that doesn't have a big enough slope for these short G&R tasks? If so, what is the slope like? What could you do for a distance type task? When I read the G&R task as written in the latest Bronze tasks, it says the G&R can be done via thermal or slope. Is this correct still? If not, I can see why a slope person would not want to do a thermal G&R if I am mistaken about the task. Otherwise I don't see the issues with a slope G&R, especially with the shorter distances.
Jan 01, 2010, 06:48 PM
founder of the SSP
Walkerton, Indiana
Joined Jul 2004
1,511 Posts
Quote:
 Originally Posted by corsha99 When I read the G&R task as written in the latest Bronze tasks, it says the G&R can be done via thermal or slope. Is this correct still? If not, I can see why a slope person would not want to do a thermal G&R if I am mistaken about the task. Otherwise I don't see the issues with a slope G&R, especially with the shorter distances.
You are correct, it can be done either Thermal Duration or slope. We're just looking for an alternative in case it's not possible in a certain area. Laps on a course F3F style is what keeps coming up most. Ahh, but once again I haven't a clue what that entails or what would be a challenge. Can someone enlighten me please? How long of lap distance, time and number of laps in that time. Thanks.
 Jan 01, 2010, 09:56 PM launch height can't fix stupid United States, FL, Indialantic Joined Jun 2005 1,653 Posts 9 turns on a 100 meter F3F course (1km total distance) can happen super fast. Posted earlier that world record is under 30 seconds to cover the total distance. Times depend on the conditions. The better the conditions, the faster the times assuming that you can fly the course correctly without any cuts at the turns. As an alternate task for the bronze level, you need to figure out how much distance that you want people cover in total and then what the minimum distance between the poles. Then figuring out a time for it to be completed in will be a real trick. A certain slope may not be able to support the time portion of the task just because the conditions are not good enough while other slopes would have no problem generating the needed conditions. Again if I was SB and had to pick something that was comparable, a good starting would be 2 to 3 times the TD G&R, course greater than 100 meters between the poles. Time for the task...., good luck with that. I was thinking that a good task for the next level was an F3F type task. 9 turns on a 100 meter course, just like F3F, with a time under 75 seconds, repeated a few times. 75 seconds is quite slow for a typical F3F comp but should be doable for the average Joe that doesn't have a beeper system (may have to use flags at the poles) to allow them to fly the course the faster. One issue with picking a time is that slower slope planes will have a hard time meeting the time and is limiting in that respect. For more info on F3F check out below: http://www.sloperacing.com/ http://www.socalsloperacing.com/faq.htm Last edited by corsha99; Jan 01, 2010 at 10:07 PM.
 Jan 01, 2010, 10:09 PM launch height can't fix stupid United States, FL, Indialantic Joined Jun 2005 1,653 Posts So how is this alternate really going to work? Seems like you should either put in the slope G&R or alternate task, not list both and let them pick one. TD doesn't get the same either/or options but could using an F3B type task instead of the G&R.