HobbyKing.com New Products Flash Sale
Reply
Thread Tools
Old Nov 30, 2014, 08:25 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2014
67 Posts
Replaced shaft after last wreck, and took care of the rudder servo rod binding issues while setting up the gyro. The rudder has full movement both directions.

This is my first collective pitch helicopter; though I started on airplanes years ago, and wanted something a bit challenging to fly. The CX 250 has been a great learning tool, though I should have probably started with a 450.

This helicopter started life as one of Ehirobo's RTF kits, and over the past year has been greatly modified. The only original components are receiver, transmitter (CX-CT6C), frame, and a second CopterX 20A ESC. I'm running with a Tarot rotor head and main gear, Hyperion 2206-3900kv motor, Align tail boom, Align bottom plate and skids.

I'm kind of wondering if the last wreck knocked the gyro senseless...The gyro is very sensitive to vibration. It's possible I knocked loose internally. If that's the case I might just invest in a slightly more robust fbl controller.

What would be the next best fairly cheap fbl controller that can be fitted without modification?

I'm going to let it rest for a few days, I'll start playing around again next Saturday.
Bad Pilot is offline Find More Posts by Bad Pilot
Reply With Quote
Sign up now
to remove ads between posts
Old Dec 01, 2014, 05:24 AM
AMA 1046820
Powerdyne's Avatar
United States, IN, Muncie
Joined Mar 2013
1,155 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Pilot View Post
Replaced shaft after last wreck, and took care of the rudder servo rod binding issues while setting up the gyro. The rudder has full movement both directions.

This is my first collective pitch helicopter; though I started on airplanes years ago, and wanted something a bit challenging to fly. The CX 250 has been a great learning tool, though I should have probably started with a 450.

This helicopter started life as one of Ehirobo's RTF kits, and over the past year has been greatly modified. The only original components are receiver, transmitter (CX-CT6C), frame, and a second CopterX 20A ESC. I'm running with a Tarot rotor head and main gear, Hyperion 2206-3900kv motor, Align tail boom, Align bottom plate and skids.

I'm kind of wondering if the last wreck knocked the gyro senseless...The gyro is very sensitive to vibration. It's possible I knocked loose internally. If that's the case I might just invest in a slightly more robust fbl controller.

What would be the next best fairly cheap fbl controller that can be fitted without modification?

I'm going to let it rest for a few days, I'll start playing around again next Saturday.
It's a possibility that the crash could have affected the gyro. Though I had one that was crashed pretty hard a few times, and it never showed that kind of problem. Still it's a possibility, as each crash is different, and the possibility does arise that the gyro could be damaged.

If I am understanding correctly. Once you get it airborne, it begins a right (Clockwise) piro . Is it instantly or after a few seconds?

If it's after a few seconds, it may be that there is a parameter that is off in the programming. Either that or something is amiss in the condition switching. This FBL unit has been known to change conditions on its own in flight if the condition banks aren't the same.

For posterity's sake, can you Copy paste the .ini file from your save?

As far as recommendations for a different controller:

Lower price but still useable:
Tarot ZYX series
KBAR,
I would recommend Robird G31, but Robird is no longer in business. You might be able to locate a used or NIP Robird in the classified section for around $50-$60)
The Turnigy 3D-H was a decent one but they are not coming back in stock... AVOID the Cyclone...


A bit higher price:
For $149 ($119 if they are still on sale) you can pick up the Spartan Vortex Vx1e. (Sold out most places now it seems)
http://www.helidirect.com/spartan-vo...it-p-37115.hdx

There's also Microbeast. You can pick up new for around $179 and used ones for around $100 give or take.
http://www.helidirect.com/beastx-mic...it-p-37927.hdx

Ikon/MSH brain - These were on sale for Black Friday sales for around $179. Might still be able to catch one for Cyber Monday. Normally they would be under the Top Shelf category at $224 but are on sale right now. Sometimes you can pick them up used for around $150
http://www.helidirect.com/ikon-flyba...re-p-27668.hdx

Top shelf (Expensive)
Skookum
http://www.helidirect.com/flybarless...9_2122_625.hdx

DJI Naza-H (GPS unit sold separately)
http://www.experiencerc.com/store/na...h-p-13290.html

V-Bar
http://www.experiencerc.com/store/mi...s-p-16901.html

Mini V-Bar
http://www.experiencerc.com/store/mi...s-p-16900.html

Spartan Vx1N or VX1
http://www.helidirect.com/spartan-vo...em-p-29757.hdx

Bavarian Demon
http://www.helidirect.com/flybarless...9_2122_579.hdx


Currently, I am running Robird G31. It really is a great little FBL unit with governor mode capability if you are using SBus or Spektrum satellite Rx. The bad part is getting one now that Robird has gone under. There is some support in the form of the Hobbyist community, but official support is gone for the most part.

I'll personally be switching to Spartan Vx1e as I have read some really good things about them.
Powerdyne is offline Find More Posts by Powerdyne
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by Powerdyne; Dec 01, 2014 at 06:05 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 01, 2014, 03:52 PM
Registered User
Paderborn DE
Joined Oct 2004
1,233 Posts
Hi Buddy,

things like this suck. If I were you if you have ANY doubts I would NOT fly with a suspect unit, just not worth the risk and potentially dangerous.

My STRONG recommendation at the moment would be without a doubt a mini KBAR. Several threads with hundreds of users and very, very few (if any) problems. Around $ 40 shipped off Amazon.

I only follow this thread because I flew the older 3X1000 for nearly 2 years and was totally happy with it, however, the mini KBAR is a drastic improvement over that Unit.

Good luck,

Paul
PaulB is online now Find More Posts by PaulB
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 01, 2014, 11:35 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2014
67 Posts
(counterclockwise), Left piro.

Yep been thinking about a Mini K-bar or BeastX clone....I don't think the K-bar will mount properly in the 250 without some frame mods.
I was thinking about the Robird G31 but oh-well.
Bad Pilot is offline Find More Posts by Bad Pilot
Last edited by Bad Pilot; Dec 02, 2014 at 12:14 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2014, 08:45 AM
AMA 1046820
Powerdyne's Avatar
United States, IN, Muncie
Joined Mar 2013
1,155 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Pilot View Post
(counterclockwise), Left piro.

Yep been thinking about a Mini K-bar or BeastX clone....I don't think the K-bar will mount properly in the 250 without some frame mods.
I was thinking about the Robird G31 but oh-well.
Robird is still a viable option. Just harder to get ahold of now.

Software and firmware can be obtained, in fact Robird put the software package back up on the server.
Powerdyne is offline Find More Posts by Powerdyne
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Alees Rush 750 Evo Build log.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2014, 08:50 AM
AMA 1046820
Powerdyne's Avatar
United States, IN, Muncie
Joined Mar 2013
1,155 Posts
I stopped using the CX-3X2000 after the second one I purchased was worse than the original first run one I bought. No matter what I did, I could not get it tuned properly. That cost me two airframes. I'm the first person to admit a dumb thumb. But when the gyro wigs out, and throws the heli to the ground in a ball faster than the throttle hold can be activated; then does the same thing on the second flight after tuning the rekit, there is a problem.

KY-Model doesn't respond to emails to the support line, and Resellers are just more concerned with selling them for around $60 now. No support, no updates, regressing firmware "update" that took away functionality, then no other support whatsoever. Very typical of CopterX.

Between this Gyro, and the low quality of their kits, I will never purchase another CopterX product. Lesson learned... and to think I was at one point considering becoming a U.S. distributor for them.
Powerdyne is offline Find More Posts by Powerdyne
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Alees Rush 750 Evo Build log.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2014, 10:52 AM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2014
67 Posts
I think you're right about the Robird..I found one in the classifieds last night, but haven't heard back.
Bad Pilot is offline Find More Posts by Bad Pilot
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2014, 06:59 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2014
67 Posts
Here's the .ini file.

[section1]
PitchAgility=30
PitchGain=40
RollAgility=30
RollGain=40
YawAgility=30
YawRight=30
YawGain=70
[section2]
FixMode=1
ServoType=0
SwashPlateType=2
ServoDirCH1=1
ServoDirCH2=-1
ServoDirCH3=1
ServoDirCH4=1
ServoAdjustCH1=42
ServoAdjustCH2=-47
ServoAdjustCH3=43
AileronLimit=50
ElevatorLimit=45
TotalCoefficient=-75
PitchDir=-1
RollDir=1
YawDir=1
TailPoint=46
TailLimitA=25
TailLimitB=47
OptimizationDir=1
[section3]
Acc1=125
Acc2=40
Acc3=125
Acc4=125
Acc5=20
Acc6=20
DeadBand1=40
DeadBand2=4
DeadBand3=80
DeadBand4=4
PitchGainD=0
PitchGainI=120
PitchGainP=80
RollGainD=0
RollGainI=120
RollGainP=80
SpinSpeed1=30
SpinSpeed2=30
SpinSpeed3=30
SpinSpeed4=30
TailCompsate1=0
TailCompsate2=0
TailGainD=25
TailGainI=25
TailGainP=80
receiver type=0
Bad Pilot is offline Find More Posts by Bad Pilot
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 02, 2014, 11:11 PM
Registered User
Atomic Skull's Avatar
Joined Dec 2011
3,416 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Powerdyne View Post


Currently, I am running Robird G31. It really is a great little FBL unit with governor mode capability if you are using SBus or Spektrum satellite Rx. The bad part is getting one now that Robird has gone under. There is some support in the form of the Hobbyist community, but official support is gone for the most part.
What actually happened was that the developer in china decided they wanted to get out of RC helicopter gyros and do something else and abandoned it. There is a rumor that Tarot bought the IP and will drop the problem plagued ZYX-S2 and introduce their own unit based on the Robird's FBL code.
Atomic Skull is offline Find More Posts by Atomic Skull
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 03, 2014, 02:35 AM
AMA 1046820
Powerdyne's Avatar
United States, IN, Muncie
Joined Mar 2013
1,155 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Pilot View Post
Here's the .ini file.

[section1]
PitchAgility=30
PitchGain=40
RollAgility=30
RollGain=40
YawAgility=30
YawRight=30
YawGain=70
[section2]
FixMode=1
ServoType=0
SwashPlateType=2
ServoDirCH1=1
ServoDirCH2=-1
ServoDirCH3=1
ServoDirCH4=1
ServoAdjustCH1=42
ServoAdjustCH2=-47
ServoAdjustCH3=43
AileronLimit=50
ElevatorLimit=45
TotalCoefficient=-75
PitchDir=-1
RollDir=1
YawDir=1
TailPoint=46
TailLimitA=25
TailLimitB=47
OptimizationDir=1
[section3]
Acc1=125
Acc2=40
Acc3=125
Acc4=125
Acc5=20
Acc6=20
DeadBand1=40
DeadBand2=4
DeadBand3=80
DeadBand4=4
PitchGainD=0
PitchGainI=120
PitchGainP=80
RollGainD=0
RollGainI=120
RollGainP=80
SpinSpeed1=30
SpinSpeed2=30
SpinSpeed3=30
SpinSpeed4=30
TailCompsate1=0
TailCompsate2=0
TailGainD=25
TailGainI=25
TailGainP=80
receiver type=0
Your deadband3 setting is really high at 80. that's 80% expo... You might want to drop that down. Are you using expo in your Tx? if so that might be your problem.
Powerdyne is offline Find More Posts by Powerdyne
RCG Plus Member
Latest blog entry: Alees Rush 750 Evo Build log.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 03, 2014, 11:23 PM
Registered User
Joined Jan 2014
67 Posts
Where should I set the RC Deadband; 80 seems really high, but I've actually never touched the advanced setting and the CX-CT6C transmitter doesn't have expo settings though it does have dual rates.
Bad Pilot is offline Find More Posts by Bad Pilot
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 04, 2014, 04:09 AM
AMA 1046820
Powerdyne's Avatar
United States, IN, Muncie
Joined Mar 2013
1,155 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bad Pilot View Post
Where should I set the RC Deadband; 80 seems really high, but I've actually never touched the advanced setting and the CX-CT6C transmitter doesn't have expo settings though it does have dual rates.
The deadband settings are in the advanced tab under RC deadband. I would set the DB1 to around 30, and the DB3 to 10

In the CT6C, I believe the Expo is handled in the DR settings somehow, at least that's how it looks to me in the manual.

In all honesty, I would not own a Tx that does not have an expo feature.
Powerdyne is offline Find More Posts by Powerdyne
RCG Plus Member
Last edited by Powerdyne; Dec 04, 2014 at 04:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 06, 2014, 10:44 PM
Registered User
Joined Dec 2014
1 Posts
found out the sat. receiver doesn't work on dsm2-1 - dsm2-4 and only kind of works on
dsmx-1 / dsmrx-2 but works prefect on dsmj. I didn't see that anyone had this working yet so I thought I'd post it up for everyone.
Hedrick2319 is offline Find More Posts by Hedrick2319
Reply With Quote
Old Dec 08, 2014, 01:11 AM
Registered User
Atomic Skull's Avatar
Joined Dec 2011
3,416 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulB View Post

My STRONG recommendation at the moment would be without a doubt a mini KBAR. Several threads with hundreds of users and very, very few (if any) problems. Around $ 40 shipped off Amazon.

l
There are a few different versions of the Kbar around. The yellow units have no governor, the blue ones do. You can get the blue unit from Gartt's ebay store for $36 with free shipping.

The yellow units are interesting because they replaced the gyro chips that the real Vbar uses with a single 3 axis chip. The Vbar gyro chips have an analog signal output that goes to ADC's on the Vbar's microcontroller. What they did was use a 3 axis chip with a digital signal output and use a microcontroller to generate the 3 analog signals that the vbar MPU expects.

The blue units are a copy of the real Vbar hardware but use a lower specced single axis chip that can "only" sense 500 degrees rotation per second instead of 2000 degrees rotation (the 2 axis chip is the same one as on the vbar). Apparently it doesn't make a difference because people say it flies just the same (interestingly people also say the yellow units have a slightly different feel than the real Vbar, probably due to the different gyro chip used)
Atomic Skull is offline Find More Posts by Atomic Skull
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Category Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cool Copterx Model CX-3X1000 RC Helicopter 3 Axis Flybarless Gyro szewang2805 Product Announcements 0 Nov 01, 2012 12:01 AM
Cool Only USD36.9 Copterx Model CX-3X1000 RC Helicopter 3 Axis Flybarless Gyro szewang2805 Hot Online Deals 0 Oct 28, 2012 11:01 PM
Sold CopterX CX-3X1000 Flybarless unit Like New! HD Hucker Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 3 Apr 11, 2012 07:21 AM
Sold Copterx CX-3X1000 flybarless gyro with USB cable jgpncll Aircraft - Electric - Helis (FS/W) 0 Mar 25, 2012 01:37 PM