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Old Mar 01, 2012, 10:39 AM
Kungsangen, Stockholm, Sweden
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Sweden, Upplands-Bro Municipality
Joined Dec 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edi.winter View Post
I did a little testing in Lostallo.
Nothing serious.

First: This is a impression of how a bike shouldnŽt drive. The 2012 Prototype was a shot to nothing. Sad but thats life.
Sad yo hear your prototype didn't work as planned.
Any thoughts of what went wrong? Was it a radical change somewhere that didn't work IRL or many things combined? Please eaborate.
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Old Mar 02, 2012, 05:46 AM
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Joined Feb 2009
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Hi Edi,

i found an missing Option at your Bike !

Please have a look here: Bottle opener

So you have an additional Use for your Bike between your Races....
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Old Mar 02, 2012, 06:39 AM
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Tirol
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Quote:
Originally Posted by z_dad View Post
Any thoughts of what went wrong?
It wasnt faster than last years bike so it isnt worth the hassle.
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Old Mar 02, 2012, 05:24 PM
DLAWW
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Socal
Joined Dec 2005
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Ed is that the first initial run, you probably need some time to figure out what you can do to get it up to speed. It would benefit you not to just put this in the rubbish bend, you need more time with it. As you know development is not just in the design. The Jabber looks like a great bike that you have meshed with over time. Every bike I've had in the initial runnings was nothing close to what I developed it into over time. Give it some time!
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 03:28 PM
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Espańa, CL, Ávila
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Sad to hear bad news about this proyect.

I donŽt know too much about your racing carreer but seems youŽll have to switch to cars for a while....



IŽll explain myself....

Previous Jabber bikes featured standard rear swingarms that made "roll center" move in a different way than your current dual link design.

Why am I talking about roll center?

Your new suspension system feature a chassis (as any car), dual links (as cars, one up and one down...) and an upright (the solid part of the swing arm, and the part that connects wheel shaft with suspension in any car...). The cars can be adjusted in just any way to get the proper roll center while cornering to get the ideal traction for any kind of track.

You need to tune the "roll center" of the rear suspension to get the best accelerating and braking, not in curves, so seems to need a different setting/reaction than any car would.

Drift cars can be set with high roll centers to make their suspension systems less sensible and lead to slide at corners...

While most cars need a roll center that moves down with suspension compression to get more traction but this will soften rear setting and cool down tyres in a bike.

To keep them on the right threshold of temperatures, while still having the benefits of an actuating suspension on wheelies, you may have to change upper link mounting position on chassis.

Can you move it?

(IŽll keep where for myself... )

I would need much more info about your design than I actually have to accurately point where to drill, but these are some ideas I had this afternoon while having lunch with my wife and daugther...

Both them think my case is hopeless...



Happy to help a world champ.... See you soon.

Cesar.
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Old Mar 03, 2012, 03:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trf_414_m2 View Post
Previous Jabber bikes featured standard rear swingarms that made "roll center" move in a different way than your current dual link design.
Why am I talking about roll center?
Your new suspension system feature a chassis (as any car), dual links (as cars, one up and one down...) and an upright (the solid part of the swing arm, and the part that connects wheel shaft with suspension in any car...). The cars can be adjusted in just any way to get the proper roll center while cornering to get the ideal traction for any kind of track.
You need to tune the "roll center" of the rear suspension to get the best accelerating and braking, not in curves, so seems to need a different setting/reaction than any car would.
Drift cars can be set with high roll centers to make their suspension systems less sensible and lead to slide at corners...
While most cars need a roll center that moves down with suspension compression to get more traction but this will soften rear setting and cool down tyres in a bike.
To keep them on the right threshold of temperatures, while still having the benefits of an actuating suspension on wheelies, you may have to change upper link mounting position on chassis.
Can you move it?
Thanks for the info.
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Old Mar 08, 2012, 08:59 AM
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This is a Picture of my Bike running in Lostallo at the Worlds.
Here you see how much the suspension of a Bike compresses in a turn.
At the front there are just about 5mm left. Looking at the rear only I can see
that there are max. 8mm of travel left for the rear swingarm.
Considering the springs I used in Lostallo and the amount of compression, it is "pulling" over2Gs through that turn.
Leaning angle is 19° with those Crashbars mounted. Crazy somehow that a
bike still stays on its wheels in such a situation.

Picture is courtesy of Bernhard Renner, thanks.
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Old Mar 08, 2012, 09:04 AM
mp-
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Bending the laws of physics! May I repost the picture, Bernhard, Edi?

mp-
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Old Mar 08, 2012, 09:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mp- View Post
Bending the laws of physics! May I repost the picture, Bernhard, Edi?

mp-
ask " Gartenzwerg " thats him.
Here is the most spectacular picture he sent me. I myself cant believe the bike was really driving. But I surly never posed a picture like that. Try to follow the trajectory back to the curb. How close can you go
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Old Mar 08, 2012, 09:30 AM
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South Korea
Joined Dec 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edi.winter View Post
This is a Picture of my Bike running in Lostallo at the Worlds.
Here you see how much the suspension of a Bike compresses in a turn.
At the front there are just about 5mm left. Looking at the rear only I can see
that there are max. 8mm of travel left for the rear swingarm.
Considering the springs I used in Lostallo and the amount of compression, it is "pulling" over2Gs through that turn.
Leaning angle is 19° with those Crashbars mounted. Crazy somehow that a
bike still stays on its wheels in such a situation.

Picture is courtesy of Bernhard Renner, thanks.
Simply amazing!!!
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Old Mar 08, 2012, 10:18 AM
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Guilford, Ct.
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Lord that's low....great job. I was watching some of the edi vids last night, it sure does handle well.
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Old Mar 09, 2012, 01:52 AM
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@edi,

your calculation about the g-force ist correct. we have done tests with a gps and g-force datalogger in a large scale f1 car on my track in dormagen.

the fast corner at the end of the straight was drive though with close to 2g and i suppose the speed of a car and bike are about the same at that part of the track.

unfortunatly this system we used would be too heavy and too large to be used in a bike.
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Old Mar 09, 2012, 02:23 AM
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Austria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mp- View Post
May I repost the picture, Bernhard, Edi?
mp-
Sure, no problem!
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Old Mar 09, 2012, 02:30 AM
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Austria
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..this is my favorite Pic of the Worlds in Lostallo.

Austrian Nitro Driver Rudi entering the Corner after the Straight, with Edi following closely
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Old Mar 09, 2012, 02:42 AM
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@gartenzwerg,

you should do a fotoshopwork and add a bouble like they use in comics and fill it with the text "MY CORNER"

if you then copy and paste a picture of edi with a smiling face into the helmlet, it would be perfect
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