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Old Jan 02, 2014, 09:09 AM
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aerofundan's Avatar
Panama
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I have been flying Vox for many years now, they have been awesome! and they are beautiful too
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Old Jan 02, 2014, 10:04 AM
DFC~ We Do Flyin' Right
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USA, GA, Atlanta
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Vox are nice, and IMO equivalent to the Xoar. However I do not find Vox worth the bother since I can get Xoar or Falcon at my LHS.

I like the Ad-X most on the Xoar 14x7 and prefer it over the T40 Vox.
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Old Jan 02, 2014, 10:50 AM
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These last days, I have been trying quite a lot brands of props, especially in the size 15 x8 and 16 x 6 on my KMX.

I could test : APC, Falcon (Wood & Carbon), Xoar, Vox.

I my opinion, the biggest difference between Xoar and Vox is that Vox has a Center hole of 6 mm - the Xoar havin an 8 mm hole.
The falcon Wood is drawing less amps, has a better acceleration, but seems to Show less drag in the down hill passages.
The best of all is definitively the Falcon Carbon and I feel it is worth to spend the Money to get one in front of the plane. Very, very light, superb acceleration, enough drag when decending...etc...
APC was the way to go 15 years ago. Things Change.
Jonathan(France)
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Old Jan 03, 2014, 12:25 AM
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United States, FL, West Palm Beach
Joined Apr 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lecaidduvol View Post
These last days, I have been trying quite a lot brands of props, especially in the size 15 x8 and 16 x 6 on my KMX.

I could test : APC, Falcon (Wood & Carbon), Xoar, Vox.

I my opinion, the biggest difference between Xoar and Vox is that Vox has a Center hole of 6 mm - the Xoar havin an 8 mm hole.
The falcon Wood is drawing less amps, has a better acceleration, but seems to Show less drag in the down hill passages.
The best of all is definitively the Falcon Carbon and I feel it is worth to spend the Money to get one in front of the plane. Very, very light, superb acceleration, enough drag when decending...etc...
APC was the way to go 15 years ago. Things Change.
Jonathan(France)
Interesting Jonathan, is your KMX flying with the Thrust 50 that PA specs as part of their iPAs solution? Not having to adjust bore diameter is very nice and thats why for the PA planes I say its perfect. BUT..I've never flown a CF prop on my PA ships, have not needed to yet. I completely agree, fiddly adapter rings put me off
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Old Jan 03, 2014, 05:12 AM
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My understanding was that the Vox props are just Xoar s with different name printed on them. At least in the common sizes. The reason for the smaller centre hole is to suit the rubbish PA adaptor.
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Old Jan 03, 2014, 05:25 AM
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Originally Posted by luke352 View Post
My understanding was that the Vox props are just Xoar s with different name printed on them. At least in the common sizes. The reason for the smaller centre hole is to suit the rubbish PA adaptor.
I have many of both brands. There is a massive difference in the finish and the look of the wood itself. (although they are both supposed to be beech wood). The actual shape of the prop looks similar to my untrained eye.

Both great props!
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Old Jan 03, 2014, 07:27 AM
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I am with you aftica, definitely not the same props. Aside from size specs, there are several subtle differences between the two.

I still stick with Xoar and Falcon due to accessibility.
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Old Jan 05, 2014, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kohersh View Post
Interesting Jonathan, is your KMX flying with the Thrust 50 that PA specs as part of their iPAs solution? Not having to adjust bore diameter is very nice and thats why for the PA planes I say its perfect. BUT..I've never flown a CF prop on my PA ships, have not needed to yet. I completely agree, fiddly adapter rings put me off
naturally I do fly the original PA set-up (Thrust 50 with Quantum 70). But I am from nature curious and try a lot.
I must say, flying a Vox 15x8 or a Xoar (even a TGY works) on the KMX is more than enough, but the Falcon carbon did please me more. Compared to the two wooden props, there was no noise at all (and as far as I am informed...more noise = less Efficiency.
And by the way, the last Version of the prop Adapter from PA is the best (and lightest) I know.
Jonathan (France)
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Old Jan 05, 2014, 06:08 AM
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Lots of guys seem to like the falcon props... gonna have to give those a try! thanks lads!
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Old Jan 05, 2014, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by lecaidduvol View Post
...as far as I am informed...more noise = less efficiency...
Absolutely correct. The quieter, the better.
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Old Jan 05, 2014, 12:46 PM
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United States, CA, Redding
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I have not run Falcon but I do run Xoar and Vox. There is one Vox that has a weird whistle sound I believe it was the 15X6 or 15x7. The corresponding Xoar did not make that sound. And yes the flying the Addy X is a shame without the T-40
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Old Jan 05, 2014, 02:08 PM
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you see twith me between Xoar and Vox, it was absolutely reversed...iI suppose that perhaps sometimes wood changes shape with time (like Standard APC do).
But a 15 x 6 is way too small for the T50, and perhaps it did get in resonances.
Finally I feel that it is a the time to consider prop to ist just value..being the only connecting part between engine and the air. It doesn't in my opinion make sense to spend a lot of Money on the better engine, when finally its power is not trasnmitted in Motion the best possible way. We spend more than 500 Dollars on the plane, an are not willing to spend 30 Dollars for the best possible prop?!
Jonathan
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Old Jan 20, 2014, 02:07 PM
Altitude is my friend...
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My first Vox props arrived yesterday. I got two 15x8s and a 16x7.

They're beautiful, of course, but I knew they would be. After using a Great Planes 5-step prop reamer to bore them out to 8mm, I checked the balance, and was delighted to find that two of them were in absolutely perfect balance, and the third needed only the slightest bit of sanding to get it just right.

I'm really impressed. I'll leave the APC on my new EF Laser EXP 60 for a few more flights until I get it dialed in, then install a Vox 15x8. I'll do it at the field, putting in one flight with the APC, then switching, so I can get as accurate a feel for the difference as possible.
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Old Jan 25, 2014, 06:21 PM
Not as Good as The Kid
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South Pasadena, FL
Joined Sep 2009
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Originally Posted by stgdz View Post
Apc's are more efficient

Xoars produce the most thrust but at a higher amp load than the APC.


Check out the power systems for extreme flight fanatics as there is loads of information in there.
Nothing from the test result data we have suggests that APCe props are more efficient than the wood props. Just the opposite.

Efficiency is a measure of "Work" which is how much actual physical motion is produced from relative energy going into the system. You can push against a big truck all day an exert a lot of energy, but if the truck doesn't more, no work was done, and therefore an inefficient expenditure of energy.

Here are some results with the same 15x8 size props on the same motor in the same motor stand, with the same ESC and the same battery: Each prop was tested three time in the same manner.

The Xoar PJN produced 1532 Watts-in and 5.11 Kg of thrust, which means the PJN needed 300W per every Kg of thrust.

The APCe produced 1430W and 4.66 Kg of thrust, which means it needed 307W per every Kg of thrust.

The Vox electric produced 1661W and 5.18 Kg of thrust, which means it needed 321W per every Kg of thrust.

The testing with the 16x8 props produced similar efficiency results.

The only time I use an APC prop is when I put the Xoar or Falcon on my plane in the size that I want (usually 27-28 percent of the wingspan for 3D), and if I'm getting a bit more Amps than I was hoping for, I usually try the APC in the same size first before dropping to a lower pitch or diameter with the wood prop. By going to the APC, I'll generally be able to lower the Amps a bit, but I still take a hit on power and thrust.

APCe props are also much heavier, but the bulk of the weight is closer to the hub so there's not much more angular momentum or rotational kinetic energy as there would be if the weight was distributed the same way it is on the beechwood props.

Although heavier, the APC was thinner at the hub, thinner at its widest point, and thinner at its narrowest point, compared to the PJN. As far as propeller absorption power, putting more blade on the air means more efficiency, so this could begin to explain the difference.

I find the PJN and Falcon to be very similar in performance, and I'm flying with both now in the 20, 21, and 22 inch electric versions. I'm not crazy about the fact that the Falcon shaft hole comes in 10mm on these sizes. None of my Hacker or Motrolfly motors have a 10mm shaft until I get up to the Q80 Hackers, and by that time, I'm using 24x10 props. That means I'm buying and using spacers on the Falcon props.
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Old Jan 25, 2014, 09:43 PM
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South Pasadena, FL
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Here is a side-by-side pic of some of the props we tested:

The Falcon and Vess (Sport) were both gas props and we used them to get an understanding of how the heavier gas props with thicker hubs compare.

The Vess produced 1639W and 5.26Kg of thrust, so about 312 Watts per Kg, and the Falcon.... 1733W and 5.25Kg, so 330 Watts per Kg.

Remember these two are gas props and spun the slowest on the same motor (more load), and drew the most current. The curious result was that the Vox electric RPMs and Amps were not far behind the gas props in spite of physically looking just like the PJN. So the Vox produced a lot of power and thrust in comparison but required more current, which will affect flight time and heat.
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