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Old Mar 18, 2016, 04:45 AM
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New Product
Ares Fokker D V11

Has anyone seen this?

http://ares-rc.com/fokkerDVII/
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Old Mar 18, 2016, 05:13 AM
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Three channel, quite some dihedral, light and pretty. Must fly well indoors or in next to no wind conditions outdoors. I'm tempted.
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Old Mar 18, 2016, 12:47 PM
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I have their sopwith pup. Slightly smaller but flies great and nice scale looks.

Bill
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Old Mar 18, 2016, 08:04 PM
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Just from the Ares photos, this appears to be by far the most accurate looking foam D.VII produced in any scale. Put me down for several!!!

The dihedral is obviously a compromise, probably quite necessary for a single-surface wing, but the overall shape is excellent. A couple of quibbles: the lower wingtips lack the short straight trailing-edge overhangs so evident in photos of the real thing, and the starboard top cowl panel has an OAW type access door, whereas Fokker-built D.VIIs like this one, flown by Hugo Schaefer of Jasta 15, then by Max Kliefoth of Jasta 19, had the top panel completely plain, without a door.

A late type straight exhaust pipe and louvred rear side panels are featured, but the example modelled actually had louvres only on the forward panels and a double exhaust pipe emerging through the side panel, just behind the front centre-section strut. However, with Jasta 19 (nose repainted yellow) it may have received the later pipe, the hole for the original being patched over. This was done to many surviving early D.VIIs. The engine supplied is a beautiful model of a Mercedes D.IIIa, but Schaefer's aircraft had a BMW III engine, with correspondingly high-mounted guns...

The 5-colour (not 4-colour as stated) lozenge fabric looks very good, but the ailerons appear to be a continuation of the chordwise wing fabric, when in fact they were built separately and covered spanwise, often with a different camo pattern. Rib tapes are shown as light blue, but the Fokker product always used strips of lozenge fabric, and no D.VII had rib tapes on the ailerons anyway. Did I say the Fokker D.VII was a minefield for modellers?

Fuselage markings are gorgeous, but the crosses weren't grey as shown in the detail pix. Rather they were normal black and white crosses that showed through the thin blue overpaint. The in-flight pix show them correct! If they're grey, that's easily fixed with a lick of paint!

Ultimately, all the above doesn't matter to the modeller who wants a good basic D.VII to work on, and this looks very good indeed. If it flies as well as the Pup, it will bring a great deal of pleasure, and the possible colour schemes are legion. I'll probably try building scale wings for mine when they become available (can't wait!) Now, does anyone fancy producing a 1/23rd scale BMW III for the kitbashers?
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Old Mar 18, 2016, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welsh Dave View Post
... this appears to be by far the most accurate looking foam D.VII produced in any scale ... but ... but ... but ... but ...but ... but .....


When I get mine, I'll immediately straighten that folded-up top wing -- the dihedral on the bottom wing should be sufficient. Hopefully the Little Fokker will be available here in the States (still haven't seen the Pup).

Gene K
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Old Mar 18, 2016, 10:14 PM
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Don't straighten it too much; the real D.VII actually has appreciable underside dihedral. It's only the tops of the rear spars being straight from tip to tip that gives it that "straight-winged" appearance from some angles. It was really quite a stable design.
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Old Mar 19, 2016, 10:33 AM
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The model is already available in Australia, as two videos on YouTube show.

A point of interest: from the spare parts list, the brick appears to be the same as that in the Pup, which is too wide to fit flat in a D.VII to the same scale. Is the brick therefore mounted vertically on edge in the D.VII (there is room) or is the fuselage wider than scale? It's hard to see from pictures so far published.
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Old Mar 19, 2016, 11:58 AM
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Good find. If for nothing else other than parts the MG's, prop and fake Mercedes engine look real good. I don't see these things in the parts list though.
I agree with Gene way too much dihedral in the wings, mostly the top wing. I don't care for the scheme that much but that can be changed.

Pete
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Old Mar 19, 2016, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by mtflyr View Post
... the MG's, prop and fake Mercedes engine look real good.
Agree. I also like the front end as well ... but not the stubby gear legs or the profile pilot (I'll use one of your German busts).

The part prices (if final) are somewhat on the high side compared to the very reasonable cost of the complete kit!

Sure hope it makes it's way to HobbyTown USA!

Gene K
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Old Mar 19, 2016, 07:45 PM
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Stubby legs, yes, a bit short, and the rudder chord is a touch over scale too, but this is described as a semi-scale model, so you can't diss Ares for a few concessions to easier flying. It certainly has all the presence of a D.VII, and provides a basis for a very accurate scale job.

The fuselage does look a bit wide, which shows in the semi-circular top of the radiator finishing slightly low and the distance separating the undercarriage struts, contributing to their stubby appearance. A good almost head-on high angle picture in YouTube video
Ares Fokker D.VII: Quick Start Guide (2 min 33 sec)
shows the fuselage to be just over 2.5 wing rib spaces wide, whereas on the real thing it's about 2.25 spaces. It therefore looks as if Ares has widened the fuselage slightly to take the Pup brick lying flat. My apologies if that's not the case! It's only noticeable if you're really familiar with the niceties of D.VII proportions. Still highly recommended.

My local model shop (in the UK) tells me the D.VII is on order from JP, and they will let me know when it arrives.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 08:30 AM
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Here's a drawing of the BMW donk. The only differences between the Mercedes and this as seen from above in a D.VII are the absence of a forward-mounted air pump, the straight inlet manifold, and the height of the cylinder heads. The whole thing is 2mm higher at the Ares model scale, and the guns will need to be jacked up by the same amount.

Most D.VIIs had the Mercedes D.IIIau, which differed from the D.IIIa supplied in having a flat 2-cylinder air pump and water-jacketed inlet manifolds. Simple mods if you're interested. D.VIIs built (as opposed to re-engined) with the D.IIIau had the guns mounted about 1 mm in scale higher, to make sure the blast cleared the manifolds adequately.
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Welsh Dave View Post
... but this is described as a semi-scale model, so you can't diss Ares for a few concessions to easier flying.
Dave,

Sorry you interpret my observations as "dissing".

Is the following also a diss?:

I was perplexed how an acknowledged Fokker expert like yourself would/could so quickly make this proclamation, " ...this appears to be by far the most accurate looking foam D.VII produced in any scale." I like the Aires form, but feel its accuracy is not quite up to your (initial) assessment ... even considering your "semi-scale" qualifiers.

Gene K
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Old Mar 20, 2016, 01:55 PM
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Speedy,
I was not interpreting your comments as "dissing", considering that I was about to make similar comments. It was not addressed to you personally, but to reviewers in general, including myself. Please accept my apology if it seemed otherwise.

Ares set out to produce a recognisable model D.VII with reasonably accurate markings, and yes, they have done better than E-Flite and Hangar 9, whose ARTF models are both based on an inaccurate drawing with angular radiator and cowling, and both have u/c legs at the ends of the axle wing, rather than inset. Ares have taken pains to get this right, insetting the legs by about the correct amount.

They also started with the right radiator shape, but it suffered a little from the widening of the fuselage. It is still much better than anything else produced, and before you tell me, I know the Hangar 9 kit wasn't a foamie!

There is a difference between modifying an accurate shape to get a model out and flying at a reasonable price, and starting with a shape that is, and always will be, wrong. That speaks of lack of basic research, not even looking at photographs of the real thing. With a bit of work, all the Ares "faults" can be corrected quite easily.

Expert? Oh, I wish... No, I'm just a long-term student and collector of information, and like everyone else, I still get things wrong occasionally.
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Old Mar 21, 2016, 07:25 PM
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For those interested in reducing the dihedral on the Ares model, the real D.VII has 2 degrees on the underside of the upper wing, and 1 degree 20 minutes on the lower wings. That's actually quite generous for a German type.

Yes, the rear spar on each wing is straight on top, but ahead and astern of the spars it quickly transforms into dihedral at the leading and trailing edges. The front spars have slight anhedral on top!
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Old Mar 22, 2016, 09:27 AM
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On sale in UK about mid-April.
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