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Old May 10, 2012, 11:10 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=295

Let me know if it works for you, its an undocumented feature and as threads die searches dont work as well I guess. Thats why I humbly documented it here. It works, I've done it a few times. But please read carefully as it could potentially effect every model you have on that radio as far as once you change the stick firmware, mechanical setup gets changes slightly also..
Every time I've tried it I end up with almost the same little tick off center with my pitch. Its not very much, like 1 tick. This did fix my main TX's rudder being off by like 3 ticks though. That was the main purpose for going ahead and doing the calibration. To get calibrated did you just push the stick farther or shorter to adjust the center position on the ones that were off?
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Old May 11, 2012, 12:53 PM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
HeliFlyer711's Avatar
United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
2,220 Posts
It's been so long since I did the calibration that i dont remember specifics, I do remember it got things back on center with the radio after i did it a few times. The sticks have tolerances they move +/- in the range over, especially if your a stick slammer or the TX is old and pots are worn. My issue was on a TX that was 2 years old and the pots had worn, after i recalibrated i sold the TX and used the new v 2.3 firmware one that came with the V450. Didnt have to mess with this one.


Totally unrelated;
I have my V450 completely apart on the bench going to take some pics and maybe do a little tutorial or something because the expanded diagram does not cover 100% all the parts that have to come off. The pulley gear right after the boom aka the tail belt pulley which is basically in the center of the split frame (a PITA), in order to replace it its about a 70% teardown to get to the part, without it being a knuckle buster and chance cracking the frame.
This is the second rear pulley that went wobbly on me causing a tail wag and in doing that repair i found out on the main bearing block, the bearings have all but seized up on the main shaft. The main shaft was just spinning with no help from the bearings, and i noticed a lot more friction in the head spining up by hand recently. Maybe it was the Gov mode that finally did them in...... 18 bucks for a new set of bearing blocks and about 15 for the pulley and top bottom steering bearing blocks. Probably about 2 hrs labor to do it right

While i had the heli torn down i wanted to see what 3G mems gyros the 2702V uses, turns out they are just consumer grade Invensense IDG650 for the X & Y (Aile/Elev) and ISZ650 for the Z axis (tail). Nothing special really for as decent as it holds.

For those who like the technical stuff, here are the specs from the manufacturer on these chips;

IDG650 - http://invensense.com/mems/gyro/idg650.html
ISZ650 - http://invensense.com/mems/gyro/isz650.html

Same 3 axis mems chips used in the MCP-X and many other walkera 3G micros.

PS. Checking the power bus on the 2702V, it looks strong enough to handle high amp servos. Thos big globs of solder carry current down each side on the end + & - as the main power buss. They did a good job with the solder and the traces are thick for anyone who wants to run standard servos concerned about external power busses.
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Old May 11, 2012, 07:12 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
6,493 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
It's been so long since I did the calibration that i dont remember specifics, I do remember it got things back on center with the radio after i did it a few times. The sticks have tolerances they move +/- in the range over, especially if your a stick slammer or the TX is old and pots are worn. My issue was on a TX that was 2 years old and the pots had worn, after i recalibrated i sold the TX and used the new v 2.3 firmware one that came with the V450. Didnt have to mess with this one.


Totally unrelated;
I have my V450 completely apart on the bench going to take some pics and maybe do a little tutorial or something because the expanded diagram does not cover 100% all the parts that have to come off. The pulley gear right after the boom aka the tail belt pulley which is basically in the center of the split frame (a PITA), in order to replace it its about a 70% teardown to get to the part, without it being a knuckle buster and chance cracking the frame.
This is the second rear pulley that went wobbly on me causing a tail wag and in doing that repair i found out on the main bearing block, the bearings have all but seized up on the main shaft. The main shaft was just spinning with no help from the bearings, and i noticed a lot more friction in the head spining up by hand recently. Maybe it was the Gov mode that finally did them in...... 18 bucks for a new set of bearing blocks and about 15 for the pulley and top bottom steering bearing blocks. Probably about 2 hrs labor to do it right

While i had the heli torn down i wanted to see what 3G mems gyros the 2702V uses, turns out they are just consumer grade Invensense IDG650 for the X & Y (Aile/Elev) and ISZ650 for the Z axis (tail). Nothing special really for as decent as it holds.

For those who like the technical stuff, here are the specs from the manufacturer on these chips;

IDG650 - http://invensense.com/mems/gyro/idg650.html
ISZ650 - http://invensense.com/mems/gyro/isz650.html

Same 3 axis mems chips used in the MCP-X and many other walkera 3G micros.

PS. Checking the power bus on the 2702V, it looks strong enough to handle high amp servos. Thos big globs of solder carry current down each side on the end + & - as the main power buss. They did a good job with the solder and the traces are thick for anyone who wants to run standard servos concerned about external power busses.

My Tx is brand new, and i am hardly a slammer. Its just made cheap and has been off center since i got it. It is 2.3 firmware.

Anyway, I fired up my 450 today after fiddling with all the digital and servo crap last night. I just wanted to do some test hovering to see how its working out. The one remaining version 1 09-9 servo is moving much slower than the 2 new version 2 09-9 servos. I have a 3rd on the way. I didn't plan on flying this till i have all 3, just doing stationary hover. Well guess what. I did 1 figure 8 and returned to a stationary hover, tail in, in front of me. I noticed a little twitch in the tail and said, "huh, that was weird" and i set it down. Well good thing i set it down then because the BRAND NEW Fusonic "upgrade" metal gear servo from wow hobbies stopped functioning properly. It's like it moves when it wants or if you help it along some. I think the circuit or the motor burned out. Since i hardly used the rudder at all and was hovering for 90% of this servo's flights and flight time, plus this is the second tail servo i've been though in 15 flights that died with the same symtoms. I'm begining to wonder if the RX is over powering them or something. I have gone over the tail MANY, MANY, MANY times looking for any binding or anything after the first servo went bad. I made sure this new one didn't come anywhere near the side hubs or bind anywhere. The tail steering and rod all move freely and very easily by hand. I suppose it's possible this cheap $20 servo just went bad, but it never even got hot after hover flights or anything. I suppose i could have damaged it when i shot my FS off the other day because i didn't wait long enough for the loc-tite to dry. But it was hovering 1 foot off the ground when it happed and the heli landed on it's skids. I'm just not having any luck with this helicopter at this point. I haven't even really crashed it yet, legitimately anyway and i've already had to replace 5 servos and the ESC. After i get this crap sorted out i better not have any more failures for awhile or i'm selling all my #%* and getting out of this hobby. Actually why sell it at this point, it would be more fun to stage a video explosion of all of them. At least someone would get some entertainment out of them then. Screw you walkera. I'm going to check the LHS i found the other day and see if they have an align DS520 like HeliFlyer711 suggested. I don't suppose you still have one for sale should I not be able to get one locally?
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Old May 11, 2012, 09:33 PM
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dgibbons's Avatar
United States, AZ, Phoenix
Joined Jul 2011
570 Posts
Try a hitec 5084 tail servo. I had one on my 450 fbl w/2702 rx. You can find one new for around $40.

http://heli-heli.com/items/electroni...rvo-detail.htm
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Old May 11, 2012, 10:40 PM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgibbons View Post
Try a hitec 5084 tail servo. I had one on my 450 fbl w/2702 rx. You can find one new for around $40.

http://heli-heli.com/items/electroni...rvo-detail.htm
Do those actually fit ok? Looks a bit slimmer and with only 2 mounting screws. Besides I'm sick of paying for shipping and waiting to get my parts. Now that i found a LHS 30 minutes away that carries Align and Savox and other brands i'm just going to give him a call and see what they got.

FYI, The Fusonic MG servos are the suck! After close examination the motor is too weak to throw the gears any longer! I seriously didn't even have 5 flights on it with this servo either. Maybe 3-4 MAX. Most of the flights with this servo on were in stationary hover, so the servo had no legitimate reason to just go bad like this. Fusonic metal gear "upgrades" my @$$. they are metal geared servos though. I personally have never stripped a tail servo, they always tend to go bad first. Plastic tail servo gears seem fine enough too me as long as replacement sets are available. The Align servo's should be fine, and have gear sets available at helidirect.com. Even though helidirect in combination with the USPS has been pissing me off lately with shipping. I placed an order Sunday night, it took Helidirect till Tue. to ship it and it's still not here.
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Old May 11, 2012, 10:51 PM
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United States, AZ, Phoenix
Joined Jul 2011
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Not all servos are compatible with Walkera electronics. Good luck.
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Old May 12, 2012, 01:32 AM
Making Stock Fly Like Modified
HeliFlyer711's Avatar
United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
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RX2702V's Tail gyro needs a digital servo @ 333hz, thats what the stock 2610H is. DS520 works good but is super sensitive which means the heli has to run tru with no vibes or else a wag will show up. The better option is Futaba S9257 mini out of the 2 but its 60 bux. I dont mess around with cheap servos anymore, not worth the trouble. Sometimes you get lucky sometimes you dont, but with servos you mostly get what you pay for just like anything else in this hobby. Usually its either really cheap or really expensive and no in betweens. But times are changing.

Although I am hearing really good things abou the hobby partz Solar servos and they seem reasonable, center well etc. Fusonic, Power HD are hit or miss. Wow Hobbies....no comment. Another thing that kills this heli is if you keep it on the bench too long running test and dialing it in, seems to overwork the servos and stress electronics....Bind and Fly. It seems the guys who fly them more than work on them have less problems, or maybe they dont notice the problems and just get it in
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Old May 12, 2012, 08:08 AM
IHW Heli Division
IntegrityHndywrk's Avatar
United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeliFlyer711 View Post
RX2702V's Tail gyro needs a digital servo @ 333hz, thats what the stock 2610H is. DS520 works good but is super sensitive which means the heli has to run tru with no vibes or else a wag will show up. The better option is Futaba S9257 mini out of the 2 but its 60 bux. I dont mess around with cheap servos anymore, not worth the trouble. Sometimes you get lucky sometimes you dont, but with servos you mostly get what you pay for just like anything else in this hobby. Usually its either really cheap or really expensive and no in betweens. But times are changing.

Although I am hearing really good things abou the hobby partz Solar servos and they seem reasonable, center well etc. Fusonic, Power HD are hit or miss. Wow Hobbies....no comment. Another thing that kills this heli is if you keep it on the bench too long running test and dialing it in, seems to overwork the servos and stress electronics....Bind and Fly. It seems the guys who fly them more than work on them have less problems, or maybe they dont notice the problems and just get it in
Well I'm not going to drop $70 after shipping on a Futaba servo just to have my POS v450 burn out it's motor and electronics too. If that happens i will most certainly blow my helicopters up with loading powder or something.

I hardly ever supply the heli with power while it's on the bench. Almost all work is done with power down. Testing is done in actual flight. Other than when setting digital RX settings with the servos. No matter what any body says on these helicopters a "Perfect mechanical setup" will not always fly level and true. Flight testing is always needed. I never let the battery stay powered on when strap down testing or on the bench for more than 30 seconds. Its just how i work. For one thing i hate having to recharge a battery just because I'm testing.

No, this particular Fusonic servo is just a total piece. It's hardly had 20 minutes of actual powered up time, and like i said almost all of that time was spent at neutral point with the helicopter at an idle hover.

I was looking at these till i realized the price is the same as the futaba but these are metal geared, a titanium geared version is also available. Savox is looking like a really good servo lately: http://www.savoxusa.com/Savox_SH1257...avsh1257mg.htm

If i have to drop $60 on a servo, and my LHS actually has these in stock i will get one and let you know. I should go look for more work to pay for my habits.
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Old May 12, 2012, 12:46 PM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
2,087 Posts
Hey guys , i finally got a chance to fly with my new moves....rolls..
She held up fine but needs a faster roll rate, how can i get these??

walkera v450d01 3d rolls slow.MP4 (5 min 4 sec)


I found a flying club 5 minutes from house , they were holding a fun fly. So i pack my helis up and head to the fun fly. I then was told no helis today and fixed wing only..... So f them ...not my kinda club....
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Old May 12, 2012, 01:34 PM
IHW Heli Division
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heli Biggie View Post
Hey guys , i finally got a chance to fly with my new moves....rolls..
She held up fine but needs a faster roll rate, how can i get these??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2zU5...e_gdata_player

I found a flying club 5 minutes from house , they were holding a fun fly. So i pack my helis up and head to the fun fly. I then was told no helis today and fixed wing only..... So f them ...not my kinda club....
Unfortunately this is how a lot of "Clubs" are, and events they throw. I avoid the bureaucracy of it all and fly anywhere else i can. Clubs usually expect you to do dumb things like work their special event for free because your a member paying your dues so that the club can exist. I'lll cut the grass if you give me a mower, but i'm not going to stand around just to hand out drinks and break up fights between nerds who can't agree weather helis or fixed wing are better.
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Old May 12, 2012, 09:53 PM
They call me plan B
Heli Biggie's Avatar
United States, GA, Covington
Joined Mar 2011
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So if my swash mixing was 70 70 70. Does going to 80 make it flip faster?
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Old May 12, 2012, 11:37 PM
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United States, PA, Philadelphia
Joined Oct 2009
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Go 80 80 80, thats max 12/12 on pitch, 9 degrees cyclic, the head cant do more than that, 9' o clock on aile and eleve and 11'0 clock on bal del, then go neg expo - 25/30 and run out all your travels to 100%. I posted my setup line by line direct from my 2801 back a few pages, DK's setup is in this thread somewhere too for max and best settings on the V450. Twitchy and stable that way but watch the bogging of the stock motor on full pitch punchouts. Nice flights by the way
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Old May 13, 2012, 02:20 AM
IHW Heli Division
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wowhobbies View Post
This is correct. The receiver firmware was updated and Walkera engineers did an excellent job on this with the help of the DKfuji report. The tail servo has some over heat problem but now it runs like a champ at .08 speed. The hardware failure report was generated by a Taiwanese Pro who has also greatly contributed.

Jonathan
wowHobbies.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by wowhobbies View Post
This is the difference between this receiver and the RX2610S/V. The receiver must be setup specifically for the WK2801pro you are going to be using. The same settings are no good when exported to another radio. The set button is used to identify the mode under which it's been set and to memorize the end points of the sticks. The flashing sequence is confusing because some of the mistakes in the original manual.

Jonathan
WowHobbies.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by nycheli View Post
Hey Jonathan... My heli is in that 1/5 batch and I'm really looking forward to it. I just want to clarify... The latest batch with the new firmware corrects the tail servo failure issues? That seems to be a really common complaint among owners of the first couple generations of this heli.
So, after looking at these posts in the beginning of this thread I am beginning to think i have one of these "earlier" versions of the RX with firmware issues that cause tail rudders to burn out. Or is the above mentioned 2610S/V Rx the original version and the 2702V is the updated? For how much Walkera wants for a 2702V it's easier to sell this thing than buy a new RX for it and maybe even still have the issue. I doubt I'll be able to have it replaced or anything even though there is a known issue with it. It would be nice to hear from wowhobbies on this.

Does anyone have more info on indicators of firmware versions for the 2702V? I'm assuming newly purchased RX from wowhobbies would be the newest version, assuming that the 2610 wasn't the original version and there are multiple versions of the 2702V. But is that going to stop my tail servos from burning out after 4-5 flights.
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Old May 13, 2012, 02:57 AM
Team WarpSquad
Japan, Tokyo
Joined Jun 2011
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No chance you can go back to the seller and ask him when he bought it new? It might give you a better idea if you have a V1.0 or not.
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Old May 13, 2012, 03:17 AM
IHW Heli Division
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United States, FL, Palm Coast
Joined Mar 2012
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Originally Posted by thwaitm View Post
No chance you can go back to the seller and ask him when he bought it new? It might give you a better idea if you have a V1.0 or not.
It is a wow hobbies upgraded MGS-PRO version with the Turbo ace motor. Box still has their green sticker for approval or whatever. No clue how old it is though.

Also keep in mind i'm only on my second servo on the tail at the moment. The first one was the stock with who knows how many flights. The second is the Fusonic "upgrade" from wow hobbies. I only got about 10 flights or so on the stock Servo, that could have been replaced before it was sold to me and was brand new, or it could have had many flights already. I didn't even get 5 flights on the Fusonic, but i'm reading around and hearing this could be expected from Fusonic sometimes. I'm going to order another stock Walkera servo and see what happens this time. Probably throwing $30 out the window that could have been better spent on a new 2702. But at the moment there is no other way to know i guess. Not to mention a tail servo blowing out in flight is probably going to cost me more at some point in a crash.

Considering these things, i'm scared to drop $60 on a futaba or anything else at this point. It might be easier, cheaper, and more reliable just to stock up on $20 Fusonic's and replace them every 3 flights.
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