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Old Mar 06, 2014, 06:36 AM
Wingbreaker
Italy, Lazio, Albano Laziale
Joined Oct 2008
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Turnigy Aerodrive DST series - anybody rewound them?

I've seen the DST series at HK. They are in 700, 1000, 1100, 1200 Kv flavor.
As they are sold they don't seem very attractive but, to me, they look quite promising as a cheap base to rewind.
Has anybody tried that?
In this case what are the results?

Best

Al
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Old Mar 06, 2014, 10:15 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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I don't think there have been any details of rewinds or even much discussion on those motor here yet. But there is almost no better motor to start with for a rewind than an open back or CD-ROM style motor like that. The visibility and quick and easy access to the windings really makes things easier.

Getting one apart and seeing the details as to whether or not the windings are heavily epoxy coated (i.e., not as easily removed) and and what the clearance between the dome and the windings at at the dome top are the kind of details that will emerge from the first rewind.

It is a 65g motor rated at 170W or 2.6W per gram so it has some room for improvement. The larger bearing tube indicates that the bearing may be of a decent size. And bearings are easily improved too.

It would surprise me to find that those motor could not be gotten up into the 4W or maybe even 5W per gram range with a good single strand rewind.

If you get one apart, share the details with us please.

Jack
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 08:47 AM
Registered User
Arkansas
Joined Dec 2004
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I am glad to see someone else is looking at rewing the DST moors as well. I just finished up my first try on a DST1200 and while it was successful I did get different results from what I had hoped to. I stripped the winding off of a pole on both sides of the pole that I unwound to get the turn count. The windings is 3 parallel 32AWG windings, and I came up with 13 turns. After I was done rewinding it, it chucked both this motor and a stock motor into a drill to get a look at the KV output voltages. Based on the difference between the voltages, I apparently should have used 14 turns instead of 13 turns to get it back to near to the stock KV rating.

By the way on the DST1200 they us a Delta termination configuration!
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 09:14 AM
Registered User
Arkansas
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Based on my results, I ran this information in the Motor Turn Calculator 5. The screen shot is the information the Motor Turn Calculator 5 gave me. I am sure since this was my first try at the DST 1200 rewind, I am sure that there is room to refine these numbers.
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 09:25 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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Is the 1300 Kv what you need? This is your chance to get a Kv that is a perfect match to the prop you'll use on it. Tell you the prop and cell count and I'll show you how to crunch the numbers for the Kv.

Once you know the Kv needed, look for the wind that has the lowest turn count at that Kv, that will be the wind that will allow the largest wire size/highest current capacity.

Jack
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 09:35 AM
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Arkansas
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I was actually in this case just trying to do an OEM rewind for the 1200 KV. Even with me missing my goal, I still have something to use now for a rewind baseline. It looks like if your aiming to do a rewind for 1000KV or less one will need to switch from Delta to a Wye termination.
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 10:05 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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If you didn't measure the Kv before you stripped it, you might be right on the money for what it was to begin with. I used the drill press/voltage measurements method for measuring Kv once or twice.

But as soon as I found out how much quicker and easier it was to just take a "raw" Kv, and how close that would be the the once gotten the hard way, I quit doing it any other way. I spin it up to full throttle for 3-5 seconds, let the eLogger record the details, and then take the average RPM for the full throttle time and divide it by the average voltage for the same time and that's it. A raw Kv will be within a few percent of the "real" Kv at the worst.

Don't be afraid to try a Wye termination. The theory is that, for Delta to Wye with the same turns, the current and Kv will drop a factor of 0.58 and the torque will increase by the same factor. I think it is the increase in torque that makes me just as happy with a Wye term as I was with the original Delta term. And with the lower current the battery lasts longer.

Jack
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 11:45 AM
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Arkansas
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The one I was comparing the drill driven voltages to is a factory wound Turnigy DST1200. Also when I stripped the original windings off I was not able to determine the winding configuration (ABC, DLRK, LRK, etc) so I just wound it DLRK. I did miss my target KV, but now by comapring that to a factory motor I know what to change to make this not only back to OEM KV, but can customize the KV to suite my application.
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 03:45 PM
Jack
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Joined May 2008
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HK is seldom if ever smart enough to tell us what the stator and poles configuration is on their motors. They probably don't have anyone there smart enough to know why we like to know that kind of stuff.

But the 700 Kv motor has an image with a little back angle perspective and I can tell it has a 12 arm stator. And if is a 12N14P motor and was not wound dLRK-Delta it would be about the first 12N14P they have ever sold that was not wound dLRK-D. As least since the TP 24xx motors faded away anyway.

If you could tell if two side by side arms were wound in sequence and then a transit was made to two opposing arms, it would indicate it was dLRK. And no Wye bundle says Delta.

Jack
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Old Mar 07, 2014, 08:50 PM
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The motor is a 12N14P motor, and after looking at an OEM motor I am unable to determine if the used DLRK or not.
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Old Mar 11, 2014, 10:37 AM
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Arkansas
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I just wanted to do an update to what I have been up to with the DST motors. I have been trying changes in the number of parallel strands of wire, various changes in the trun numbers, and I have even tried winding with a single strand of 26 AWG. From what I am seeing for results, the DST frame is responding very close to the same as the old Tower Pro 24xx series did. Based on measurements it looks like the stator has the same measurments to it that the 24xx series had. I have a Slow Stick with a TP2410-09 that I rewound with the 26 AWG, 9 turns, Wye termination, DLRK scheme, and I love it. I am going to try the same configuration on the DST and see if it mimics the 24xx in results.
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Old Mar 11, 2014, 11:15 AM
Jack
USA, ME, Ellsworth
Joined May 2008
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That is interesting, I had not noted the similarity to the 24xx motors.

Looks like the major changes are:

- Larger bearing tube and larger bearings

- Two part magnet housing (aluminum cap and steel flux ring replaces all steel 24xx housing)

- Revised motor mounts with notch for ESCs leads and grub screw locations changed for better clamping forces.

All in all, those would all be good changes.

It also looks like the may have added a DJI style prop drive hub, can you measure the O.D. on the round and across the flats on that? It may be the HK is trying to let folks use the DJI style props too maybe.

In another thread someone using these motors on a tricopter commented that the holes in the mount were not large enough to all the use of Zip ties for attaching the motor to the arms. So they worked out a different way (blocks of wood and wood screws basically). But the holes could be drilled out I think.

Jack
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Old Mar 11, 2014, 01:18 PM
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They have made some changes from the 24xx series, and I guess the magnet bells on the one I have must have been one of the first versions of the DST's because it is not a two piece bell. That kind of surprised me to! What I am finding is this motor appears to produce very simular results to the 24xx series based on simular rewind configuration. Structurally they do appear different.
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