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Old Oct 25, 2009, 06:22 AM
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Horten XVI experimental

Hi out there,

some of You may have read the Hortn IV thread. It drifted a bit away, that I believe it's time now to open a new building thread about a Horten wing. It's called Horten XVI Experimental, because the shape of the wing is the same as the Horten XVI "Colibri" which was designed in the 1950's by Reimar Horten.

I call it Experimental, because I build it without the cabine of the real plane. Instead of this I modified the center section, to insert a motor. So I am able to fly my plane as a "thermal-motor-glider" on "flat land" (The next slope is about 100 mile away from my home).

I still built and flew the plane, but I lost it because of a receiver fault. It's a proven plane for soaring, but not for aerobatics! I loved it and it was very effective. Reasons enaugh to build it again.

I will order the strips, Fibreglass pipes and other materials tomorrow. May be I can start building next weekend.

Span: 3,42 m (11 1/4 ft)

Regards

Lothar
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 12:23 PM
Herk
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Virginia USA
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Herr Lothar -- congratulations, this is a very attractive project.

From this photograph, I see that your model has been much more successful than the original Colibri. I am very sorry that it has now crashed.

To make all these parts with a router, I am sure that you have worked in a cloud of sawdust

Please keep this thread going. I will be very interested to follow this construction.
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 01:18 PM
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OK , Lothar, I'm watching this one now :>)
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 02:23 PM
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preparing the center section

Hey Bob,

don't watch, keep on running Your machine

And for Herk,

Ther wasn't to much dust, because we here in Bremen have a vacuum cleaner mounted at the router. I am sure, people in Virginia still found this usefull tool too

But back to the plane:

I did some necessary preparations for building the center section. First of all I glued the center template on an even peice of wood.

I drilled the front holes in the outer ribbs to a diameter of the head of a M4-Screw. This screw mounted to the first ribb of the wings will be a torsion locking device later.

I glued the two biggest ribbs from poplar on the center ribb. These parts were pressed between two even parts of wood. It's very important, that this center ribb keeps even.

Than I searched in my basement for some pipes for the plug in mount. In the pipes will be later a 12 mm (8 mm in the stern) carbon fibre rod.

May be for the people who live in countries with "imperial measurements" it could be easier to drill the wholes a little bigger for the diameters, which are available there. Please don't make it smaller!

Than I put the ribbs in the center template, insert the pipes and put the "combs" over all ribbs. Now it's time to fix the pipes with super glue.

By the way, for the rest I use only white wood glue.

If there is any question, fell free to ask.

Regards

Lothar
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 03:35 PM
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Battery Box

Hi,

after the pipes are fixed (super glue is very fast) I built the battery-box in the center part and fixed the "fender" in the bow of the section. I also found some rests of pine-strips (15x5 and 10x5) which fitted in the fins.

After all I put again the combs on the construction, that everything is in a correct angle while drying....

Hope You enjoy it.

Lothar
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 05:53 PM
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...and started to build the D-Box....

for this I recycled the combs. At the leading line I glued a strip of 1,5 mm plywood.

So I can start tomorrow grinding and closing this part with 0,6 mm plywood.

Lothar
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 06:03 PM
Herk
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Virginia USA
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With structure like this, when I use super glue, I later go back over the important joints with the wood glue. I try to apply a little to all sides of each joint. Actually, the glue I use here is more yellow than white. Technically it is aliphatic resin glue.

With this type of wood structure I will be very interested to see how you manage the complex Horten twist distribution.

Thank you for the detailed descriptions.
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 06:12 PM
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Hi Lothar,

like a phoenix from the ashes.

thumps up for this nice project.

Wolfgang
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Old Oct 25, 2009, 06:47 PM
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Quaxi : You were the one with the Wing Jig in IG-Horten forum !

Did you develop that technique yourself ?

Tigershark:
I have to wait for another 1/16" bit. I am going to try one more time with
small bit cutting !
I will try Special carbide Oval O single edge spiral upcut bit from Onsrud.
And I am adding some features to my cutting files. Like spiral out holes
and lead-in and lead-out.

I have all the 5 ply parts cut anyway using 1/8" bit !

Plus I have lots of work to do on my big 120" spanweite Porter Tug ! see pic
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Old Oct 26, 2009, 11:35 AM
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Last evening I ordered ...
14mm OD x 12 mm ID x 1M CF tube
12mm OD x 8mm ID x 1M CF tube
8mm ID x 1M CF solid rod.

They were OUT OF STOCK on the 12 mm solid rod
So I plan to "MAKE" 12 mm solid by slipping 8 mm solid rod inside the 12 mm tube :-)

I am hoping ( but not expecting ) that the pieces will Telescope easily !
It will arrive in about a week.

While I was at it I also ordered Kevlar cloth for reinforcing the Nose of the Pilatus.
Kevlar INSIDE and Kevlar over the outside.
I am quite concerned about the 3W 100cc twin that I have to mount.

Later today I will be ordering more 1/16" bits for the final cuttings of Ribs !
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Old Oct 26, 2009, 03:55 PM
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Hey Bob,

we are not in hurry.... I show, You build and ask, when it's time for. I used 1,5 mm bits for milling the parts. That's today my standard tool on the machine.

I am waiting for material too. My pine strips will not be sent before monday....

So I started to cover the Center-sektion with 0,6 mm birch plywood. To connect two pieces of plywoog, I make a scarf-joint. First I grind one piece bevelled and glue it on the plane, and than I grind the other piece. It's very easy, because You see the angle via the different colours of wood (white) and red phenolic resin. Try it, it's much easier, than it sounds and looks like.....

I'll keep the bottom side surface open, until the Motor is mounted.

By the way, I am working on the drawings for an easy "Motor-cabin" for a motor with long shaft.

Regards

Lothar

PS: Yeah Wolfgang, I need this plane again. It was handy and effective and it looked great in the air.
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Old Oct 26, 2009, 04:22 PM
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Hi Bob,

the Wing Jig of the Horten XII and the most other is developed by Lothar.


@Lothar, I am looking forward of your new semi scale middle section


regards Wolfgang
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 05:32 PM
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Wolfgang,

that's nothing about scale, that's the "justforfunifyoudonthaveaslopenearby" center section

I started the "Motor-Cabin". In this case it's made for a motor with long shaft, because I know, when the plane is built, we need som lead in the nose to get the right CG.

The normal way -with the motor mounted on the stern- is easier to build, but not this effective. For my version there are two ball bearings needed and two parts from the lathe..... I still have these Materials and tools from my submarinemodelling time. May be it's better for other people to do it the usual way.

Before I forget, the battery box is designed for A123-cells. I will use 5 of them together with a turnigy 4250/600. The combination worked great in the first HXVI.

Regards

Lothar
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Old Oct 27, 2009, 08:37 PM
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I Like your Motor & shaft enclosure ! good work.
I SEE your photo in Aufwind today too !

TODAY I tried using my last 1/16" bit and made TWO passes 1.5 hrs
to get the Poplar cut for good ribs.

It worked Very Well, thank you :-)))

I guess you just have to WAIT for the good stuff ,eh ? :-)

I will now order more bit "just in case" and get some more ply too.

When the CF tube and rods arrive next week we will get started here on this end.

I LIKE A123 cells and have 33 of them :-)

I use 4 cells in the NOSE my Foam covered flying wing.
It worked out OK for balance.

I already HAVE some Turnigy motors about the right size too :-)
I have 4250-700 on my Pegasus Electric Tug using 6 A123 cells,
and some 3536 in Cularis and EZGliderPro using Lipos in them.

Paul and I have a 350' msl Hill overlooking the Columbia River for Slopen !
And we are only 40 miles from the Pacific so it's really 350' :-)
Pic here -
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=2042177

Today I received my Kevlar and CF cloth for reinforcing the Porter Nose.
A couple pix of progress.
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Old Oct 29, 2009, 06:09 PM
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wow,

this slopes are a dream. Wished I had this over here Makes me happy, that it worked with the bits. But while waiting for my material, I completed the cabin and fixed the rest of the parts in the center section. The receiver will be mounted in one of the wings. So it's easy to exchange the center section with motor with the scale section. By the way its a good way to have the antennae in the nose of a wing without a connector anywhere. So I will close the bottom surface over the weekend end clean the shop. A little grinding is included.....

I believe, we can start the wings by positioning the ribbs on the building slip.

Regards

Lothar
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