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Old Jan 19, 2011, 05:48 AM
Registered User
Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jan 2011
7 Posts
Help!
Wasp V3 tail rotor neutral point?

Hi Guys,

I recently purchased a Wasp V3 direct from Taiwan.

I can't seem to set the correct neutral point for the tail boom to allow extra space between the pitch shifter slide bush (part 10) and the tail gear box plate (part 19) to turn right when pushing the rudder stick. There is lots of room to provide ample push to turn the nose left but not enough to turn it right.

Is there a way to have a neutral point that places the Tail pitch shifter push-pull loop (part 9) in the middle of the tail shaft?

Thanks,
Jason
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Old Jan 20, 2011, 10:45 PM
United States, MI, Auburn Hills
Joined Dec 2008
1,031 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkaxford View Post
Hi Guys,

I recently purchased a Wasp V3 direct from Taiwan.

I can't seem to set the correct neutral point for the tail boom to allow extra space between the pitch shifter slide bush (part 10) and the tail gear box plate (part 19) to turn right when pushing the rudder stick. There is lots of room to provide ample push to turn the nose left but not enough to turn it right.

Is there a way to have a neutral point that places the Tail pitch shifter push-pull loop (part 9) in the middle of the tail shaft?

Thanks,
Jason
After allowing the servo to center with the radio on then slide the servo itself forward or back on the tail boom.

Here is the issue; the setup was perfect when it left the factory. You might have a loose tail boom that has pushed into the frame; thus you lost the servo position (even 1 or 2 mm will do this) AND you have loosened the belt. IF the belt is taut behind the main gear AND the boom is not even slightly moveable in the frame then you have changed the geometry of the linkage/servo arm/position. DO NOT ADJUST the gyro. THIS just makes it less or MORE sensitive and is the worst mistake we see when we put a heli on the bench to fix them. ALso check for the servo getting hot because of jamming or broken gears in the servo.

Hope that helps

Max

BTW to ALL Posters in this forum; Please upgrade your profile so we know what your conuntry of residence is....Thanks
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 07:22 AM
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jan 2011
7 Posts
Quote:
the setup was perfect when it left the factory
Thanks for your quick reply. I am very new to this so please bear with me.

I understand your point regarding the physical placement of the servo along the boom to adjust the Tail pitch shifter push-pull loop into the center of the tail shaft however this makes the nose turn left. The neutral point (in my understanding this is where the boom doesn't rotate during a hover?) of the push-pull loop seems to be too far to the boom side of the tail shaft.

I don't understand how loosening or tightening the belt via the boom length changes the geometry of the linkage/servo arm/position when it is all connected to the boom so it all moves together. Increasing, but obviously not overdoing it, the belt tension allows the tail rotor to turn in sync, ie without slippage, with the main rotor and this provides some right turning motion of the nose. I should be able to set the neutral point with the trim at this point?

When you say "do not adjust the gyro" are you referring to the SKY705 settings under "gyro"? I have left this at the default settings of 25% (Normal) 20% (Reverse), both "Standard" and not "Locked"

I was aware that it should have been 'ready-to-fly' out of the box but two things bothered me. First the tail rotor wouldn't turn upon first test flight and I received training gear that doesn't fit the Wasp V3 properly. I had to tighten the belt to get the rotor to turn and the training gear keeps falling off. I apologize for adjusting components but I'd rather do that than sending it all the way back. The tail boom must have been knocked around during shipping.

Does the boom length affect where the neutral point is (not in relation to belt tension because this obviously affects it through slippage) in terms of the geometry?

How about the friction between the bearings and the main shaft which should cause more rotation? Is there anything else that would cause excessive boom rotation?
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Old Jan 21, 2011, 02:15 PM
United States, MI, Auburn Hills
Joined Dec 2008
1,031 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkaxford View Post
Thanks for your quick reply. I am very new to this so please bear with me.

I understand your point regarding the physical placement of the servo along the boom to adjust the Tail pitch shifter push-pull loop into the center of the tail shaft however this makes the nose turn left. The neutral point (in my understanding this is where the boom doesn't rotate during a hover?) of the push-pull loop seems to be too far to the boom side of the tail shaft.

I don't understand how loosening or tightening the belt via the boom length changes the geometry of the linkage/servo arm/position when it is all connected to the boom so it all moves together. Increasing, but obviously not overdoing it, the belt tension allows the tail rotor to turn in sync, ie without slippage, with the main rotor and this provides some right turning motion of the nose. I should be able to set the neutral point with the trim at this point?

When you say "do not adjust the gyro" are you referring to the SKY705 settings under "gyro"? I have left this at the default settings of 25% (Normal) 20% (Reverse), both "Standard" and not "Locked"

I was aware that it should have been 'ready-to-fly' out of the box but two things bothered me. First the tail rotor wouldn't turn upon first test flight and I received training gear that doesn't fit the Wasp V3 properly. I had to tighten the belt to get the rotor to turn and the training gear keeps falling off. I apologize for adjusting components but I'd rather do that than sending it all the way back. The tail boom must have been knocked around during shipping.

Does the boom length affect where the neutral point is (not in relation to belt tension because this obviously affects it through slippage) in terms of the geometry?

How about the friction between the bearings and the main shaft which should cause more rotation? Is there anything else that would cause excessive boom rotation?
Nope that just about covers it. As far as the training gear falling off, have you seen the diagram of how to use nylon wraps to hold the training gear? The black clips only work on the V1 or V2 Skyartec Heli
Here is a link to the diagram: Proper setup of Skyartec Training Gear

Yes many things can happen during shipping from the factory to put the helicopter out of adjustment; not to mention you could have a bad transmitter on the rudder stick circuit; bad receiver on the rudder channel; broken or malfunction of the servo and not likely but possible a broken gyro. These are only a few of the dozens of things that we see eveyday on our tech bench. For this reason we spend about 2-3 hours bench testig each Skyartec Helicopter or Cessna before they are shipped to the customer; we reject an average of 1 per carton of 6 pieces as not suitable for sale, for all the above reasons and more. Without the helicopter on the bench, in our hands we cannot give you anymore then we have already;
My suggestion; if it acted this way from the beginning of the purchase, is to return it to the dealer for repair or replacement; THAT is what I expect MY customers to do and I would think your dealer feels the same way.

Max
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Old Jan 25, 2011, 06:01 AM
Registered User
Melbourne, Australia
Joined Jan 2011
7 Posts
Cool, thanks for your help. It's very much appreciated.

I contacted the seller who provided the diagram you referred to. Surely this sort of modification should come with instructions instead of letting us try to figure it out for ourselves (not hard in hindsight). I mean at least they could have kept the black brackets so that I didn't think I had to use them.

The tail rotor problem seems to be the setup/geometry so I'll just keep at it till I get it right.
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Old Jan 26, 2011, 02:09 AM
United States, MI, Auburn Hills
Joined Dec 2008
1,031 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkaxford View Post
Cool, thanks for your help. It's very much appreciated.

I contacted the seller who provided the diagram you referred to. Surely this sort of modification should come with instructions instead of letting us try to figure it out for ourselves (not hard in hindsight). I mean at least they could have kept the black brackets so that I didn't think I had to use them.

The tail rotor problem seems to be the setup/geometry so I'll just keep at it till I get it right.
The Training Kit is a universal kit for many verisons of Skyartec Helicopters. As THE Authorized Factory Distributor, we are the influence that caused the factory to include some nylon wraps to attach the Training kit for the newer version of the landing gear, now common on many of their products; seeing this lack of instruction, WE have been including for years and of course is available in detail, on our website

Max
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Old Feb 27, 2011, 08:45 PM
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UK, Mid Devon
Joined Feb 2011
3 Posts
tail rotor adjustment

i too own a wasp v3 {in fact two of them } and they both seem to suffer from the same problem i.e..as another poster says .....I can't seem to set the correct neutral point for the tail boom to allow extra space between the pitch shifter slide bush (part 10) and the tail gear box plate (part 19) to turn right when pushing the rudder stick. There is lots of room to provide ample push to turn the nose left but not enough to turn it right.
i have checked everything is as it should be in the setup of the tail and it is. there is no damage to the servos the geometry of the linkages is correct the belt is tight etc....
as this problem is exactly the same on both helicopters i find it highly unlikley that they are both damaged in shipping and would therefore sugest that there is some fault in manufacture
i would hope that i am wrong in this assumption and would hope that there is someone out there that can come up with some way of fixing this problem
apart from this problem both copters are quite nice to fly but this realy IS A PROBLEM
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Old Feb 28, 2011, 08:28 AM
United States, MI, Auburn Hills
Joined Dec 2008
1,031 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by fenrisswolfe View Post
i too own a wasp v3 {in fact two of them } and they both seem to suffer from the same problem i.e..as another poster says .....I can't seem to set the correct neutral point for the tail boom to allow extra space between the pitch shifter slide bush (part 10) and the tail gear box plate (part 19) to turn right when pushing the rudder stick. There is lots of room to provide ample push to turn the nose left but not enough to turn it right.
i have checked everything is as it should be in the setup of the tail and it is. there is no damage to the servos the geometry of the linkages is correct the belt is tight etc....
as this problem is exactly the same on both helicopters i find it highly unlikley that they are both damaged in shipping and would therefore sugest that there is some fault in manufacture
i would hope that i am wrong in this assumption and would hope that there is someone out there that can come up with some way of fixing this problem
apart from this problem both copters are quite nice to fly but this realy IS A PROBLEM
If no changes have been made to the gyro settings or the transmitter settings and the tail servo is not damaged (gives throw in equal directions from center) then you should be able to locate the pitch slider on transmission shaft at the correct center position by adjusting a combination of the servo arm on the servo spindle and moving the servo position on the boom fore and aft. I find the center or neutral position for the servo arm first and make sure that the servo arm is properly positioned at center. Then I loosen the servo holders on the boom and move the complete tail servo fore and aft until I find the desired position for the pitch slider. It does take some trial and error time; but this method has always worked for me.

Max
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Old Feb 28, 2011, 01:35 PM
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UK, Mid Devon
Joined Feb 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parkflying View Post
If no changes have been made to the gyro settings or the transmitter settings and the tail servo is not damaged (gives throw in equal directions from center) then you should be able to locate the pitch slider on transmission shaft at the correct center position by adjusting a combination of the servo arm on the servo spindle and moving the servo position on the boom fore and aft. I find the center or neutral position for the servo arm first and make sure that the servo arm is properly positioned at center. Then I loosen the servo holders on the boom and move the complete tail servo fore and aft until I find the desired position for the pitch slider. It does take some trial and error time; but this method has always worked for me.

Max
hi max
thanks for your swift reply
however i have already tried this fix
once the slider is centered then the helicopter nose spins to the left uncontrollably unless you dial in full right sub trim which then takes the pitch slider nearly all the way to the left and thus against the tail box{viewing from the rear of the helicopter} again
it seems that the tail rotor does not produce quite enough thrust to keep the nose from rotating {to the left}
any ideas?
Fenriss
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Old Mar 01, 2011, 01:36 AM
United States, MI, Auburn Hills
Joined Dec 2008
1,031 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by fenrisswolfe View Post
hi max
thanks for your swift reply
however i have already tried this fix
once the slider is centered then the helicopter nose spins to the left uncontrollably unless you dial in full right sub trim which then takes the pitch slider nearly all the way to the left and thus against the tail box{viewing from the rear of the helicopter} again
it seems that the tail rotor does not produce quite enough thrust to keep the nose from rotating {to the left}
any ideas?
Fenriss
This is not normal behavior on a factory setup with default settings; look for broken teeth on main gear; bad one way bearing - belt slipping on the pulley at the main gear and on the transmission shaft; a broken or worn pulley on the transmission shaft; tail rotor holder slipping on the transmission shaft. TRY Causing friction with the fingers on one hand on the motor drum and then try to spin the main gear in the correct rotation with the other hand and see if it "slips" past any of the teeth on the pinion gear on the motor.

thousand sold; each bench tested; rarely do we get this complaint and when we do it is usually one of the above can solve the tail spinning problem. Sometimes the servo but rarely the gyro. Often user "forgot" they changed gyro settings; also you did not mention the version of radio - Sky 701, 702, 703 or sky 705;

I can assure you it is something simple; for example I had a customer that said they checked everything; couldn't fix the tail spinning problem. Paid 2 way shipping and bench time. All that was wrong was the boom was loose in the main frame so that while the belt appeared fairly taut at the main pulley, under stress the boom would slide into the frame, ever so slightly, enough to loosen the tension and allow the belt to be less taut.

PLEASE also take a moment to update your profile to show your country and location.

We have full tech bench service; after all we are able to "fund" our product support because of the sales we make of helicopters and parts and from fees on the bench. Let us know; otherwise maybe you can contact the dealer who sold it to you to see about upgrade/repair/exchange/checkup. Often people buy the skyartec from a "discount" HK dealer and then find they need support from a real dealer who actually supports what THEY sell and is willing to spend countless hours writing on the forum to help all buyers of Skyartec Products.

That is why we try to offer our service here, as I would be professionally embarrassed if one of my customers needed to go to another dealer for support; but of course they still got the revenue from the purchase, so maybe they are the smart ones and not me?

We just hope some of you will think of us when you need parts and upgrades etc.

Max
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Old Mar 01, 2011, 04:40 AM
Registered User
Australia, VIC, Melbourne
Joined Jan 2011
21 Posts
One more thing to check..... The flybar paddles need to be horizontal. I have also had this problem and found that this was the cause of the problem in my case. A crash can potentially offset these things causing the issue.

Regards,
Mark
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Old Mar 02, 2011, 07:39 AM
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UK, Mid Devon
Joined Feb 2011
3 Posts
once again thanks

hi max
thanks for your input as i said i have two of these little beasties one of them i have not touched its settings at all the other one i have experimented with
the settings in the software setup on the radio {sky 703}
the one that i have worked on is slightly better than the other one since i took the gyro sensitivity up to 28 rather than the stock setting of 25 the gyro is locked
i took the head speed{and thus the tail rotor speed} up by puting a fifteen tooth drive pinion on the motor raising the throttle curve by three increments and dropping the pitch curve by the same this has allowed me to bring the rudder sub trim three notches to the left of the stop rather than all the way right
apart from that the radio software is running on the stock.ini file
i have checked the belt tension and found that it was in fact too tight {binding the bearing on the main shaft}and losening it helped a little
there are no glitches in the gears though the main gear does have a large amount of play on the shaft {you can rock it about four mill up and down on its bearing }
i bought them both from an online dealer called nitrotek here in the uk but they offer no service apart from spare parts and a rubbish attitude from customer dis service
i realy do apreciate your help as i realise there is nothing in it for you and it must take up loads of your time answering every post that appears on this forum
{real shame you are half a world away or i would send them both to you to fix}
mark
thanks for your thought on the flybar i checked them too after reading what you said and found it was slightly out of line on both
{odd seeing one is still exactly as it was when i got it and has never been crashed }also there seems to be excesive side to side movement in the see saw {keeping the main shaft still nearly fifteen degrees of rotational movement }
thanks for the help guys
fenriss
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