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Old May 22, 2014, 12:19 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Scoring ALES

The AMA rule state:
(X).4 Scoring
1. Time will be recorded by the timekeeper/helper and will be truncated for scoring purposes,

Pretty simple, the timer looks at the watch, ignores tenths of a second and just writes down the whole minute and whole second, a landing score and that's that.

With a raw scores there are no tenths introduced to the scoring, but once normalization takes place tenths are introduced. So are the tenths rounded up or down, or truncated to the whole number? In other words are the tenths ignored and only the whole number used?

Thanks

Curtis
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Old May 22, 2014, 12:50 PM
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Truncating only applies to the time so it is standardized. Calculated (normalized) scores can go to as many decimal places as desired/needed, I'm not aware of a standard for calculating. In fact, the ALES league calculated scores go to two decimal places, so perhaps that should be the target.

JT
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Old May 22, 2014, 02:28 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Here is an example of my spreadsheet.
I do not wish to use tenths but I rolled out the tenths just to show what is going on with rounding and truncating.
So should I use normal rounding rules or truncate like I am currently doing?


Thanks
Curtis
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Old May 22, 2014, 04:20 PM
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http://www.physics.uoguelph.ca/tutor...ig/SIG_dig.htm

Kevin
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Old May 22, 2014, 04:26 PM
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The last three entries (leghorn, bunny, coyote) calculated wrong. I'm not sure what you're trying to show by adding the 10ths of a point.

JT
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Old May 22, 2014, 04:26 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcaldwel View Post
I am not well educated in math would you please explain?
If this has nothing to do with then AMA rules please start your own thread. I appreciate the help though, well once you explain how....
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Old May 22, 2014, 04:29 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtlsf5 View Post
The last three entries (leghorn, bunny, coyote) calculated wrong. I'm not sure what you're trying to show by adding the 10ths of a point.

JT
How so? One is .4 and rounded down, the other is .7 and also rounded down; truncated the other one is 1000.0. How can that be wrong?
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Last edited by Curtis Suter; May 22, 2014 at 04:44 PM.
Old May 22, 2014, 04:57 PM
Duane
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177/239*1000 = 740.6
235/239*1000=983.3
238/239*1000 = 995.8

You must be truncating the result of the division. Only the reported flight time should be truncated to whole seconds.
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Old May 22, 2014, 05:28 PM
Red Merle ALES
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So what you are saying is no truncating in the scoresheet is required? The truncating is done from viewing the stopwatch to what the timer writes on the paper.

So te timer would ignore any tenths of a second and only write down the whole number.
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Old May 22, 2014, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curtis Suter View Post
I am not well educated in math would you please explain?
If this has nothing to do with then AMA rules please start your own thread. I appreciate the help though, well once you explain how....
You can not have more more significant digits in the result than in the inputs - any more digits are meanuingless. The landing scores have two significant digits, well actually 1 1/2 since they are in 5's. The time has 3 significant digits.

Any calculation cannot have more digits with any meaning than the inputs. In this case there really should be only two significant digits in the results, since the landing scores have a maximum of two significant digits. That means there should not be numbers like 956, only 960. Tenths certainly are meaningless.

Kevin
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Old May 22, 2014, 05:56 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Kevin,
Thanks but I have to admit I have no clue at all what that means.

Curtis
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Old May 22, 2014, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curtis Suter View Post
So what you are saying is no truncating in the scoresheet is required? The truncating is done from viewing the stopwatch to what the timer writes on the paper.

So the timer would ignore any tenths of a second and only write down the whole number.
Correct. But, the numbers after the decimal place in the normalized score are really not significant (per Kevin's post above), since you only have three digits in the raw score (600 seconds + 50 point landing). I would just round those to whole numbers.
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Old May 22, 2014, 06:05 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Wazoo you have been a lot of help. From one Virginian to another Thanks!

What I am doing is taking the normalized score and truncating that. There are no tenths in a flight score until the normalization process. So that is what I was normalizing. I think I misunderstood truncating "time" vs "scores". So my spreadsheet is wrong. I will fix it tonight or in the morning,

Thanks to a long time SSJSS friend for finding that!

Curtis
Harrisonburg 1962-1981
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Old May 22, 2014, 06:07 PM
Red Merle ALES
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wazmo View Post
Correct. But, the numbers after the decimal place in the normalized score are really not significant (per Kevin's post above), since you only have three digits in the raw score (600 seconds + 50 point landing). I would just round those to whole numbers.
So you are saying after normalization to use "rounding" rules. <5 round down and >5 round up?

Thanks
Curtis
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Old May 22, 2014, 06:15 PM
Duane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Curtis Suter View Post
So you are saying after normalization to use "rounding" rules. <5 round down and >5 round up?

Thanks
Curtis
Yes, because rounding should tend to accumulate less error than truncating when summing multiple rounds.

For example:
1.1 + 1.3 + 1.5 + 1.7 + 1.9 = 7.5
1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 = 5 (truncating)
1 + 1 + 2 + 2 + 2 = 8 (rounding)
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