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Old Oct 04, 2012, 07:36 AM
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Does this look like a good set up?

Hi, I'm new to RC planes and thought I will build myself this plane http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=407323

The thing is I was thinking of going with a different motor. The setup I chose for this plane would be:
The motor:
http://www.hobbypartz.com/98p-mars-b...20a-combo.html
It draws 18 amp and it is matched with a 20amps esc
The battery that I would get for it would be:
http://www.hobbypartz.com/77p-sl1300-3s1p-20c-3333.html
It's a 1300Mha 3s 20C that gives me 26amp

Did I match it correctly?
Also my plane will most likely be a bit heavier than the one in the original build due to the fact I would be using EPP from homedepot
I would appreciate any tips and sugestions
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 08:22 AM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,178 Posts
That plane in a beginner's hands is a five second flight. This is for an advanced flier.

You need to begin to fly RC with a plane you can succeed with. You need to plan for the fact that you will crash. You would be best served by purchasing a three channel trainer aircraft, totally ready to fly, slow enough to give you a chance to react rather than anticipate flight characteristics, with a full inventory of spare parts available for a decent price, and with a record of teaching hundreds of unassisted people how to fly, with a dedicated thread here or another internet RC forum for and by fellow beginners flying this plane.

About the only planes that qualify are
  • Hobby Zone Champ RTF
  • Hobby Zone Super Cub
  • Multiplex Easy Star II
  • Parkzone Radian (if you are interested in sailplanes)
Unless you come to the party with extensive free flight building experience the RTF route is much more able to produce success in learning to fly. If you have the knowledge and experience to build, your chosen plane is totally unsuitable to a new pilot.

Please see this post: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...30&postcount=6
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 09:24 AM
An itch?. Scratch build.
eflightray's Avatar
South Wales U.K.
Joined Mar 2003
13,199 Posts
I agree with RR. Going the RTF route is probably the best way to start with as a very first RC plane.

But if cost is a major factor for wanting to build your own, (though it's not likely to work out much cheaper as you still have to buy everything, and unless there is a hobby shop near, that will also add postage), then there are some trainers listed in the Foamies(Scratchbuilt) forum, this is one that is well recommended -

Blu-Baby Primary Trainer ** Plans, Pics and Fun! It's not for EPP but probably could be built using EPP, BUT with a lot of help from that forum and the guys there, someone may even have done it in that thread.

In your, 'good set-up ?', you missed the most important thing..... the prop. Pick the wrong one and the motor and or ESC could smoke. It's the props load on the motor that determines the current. The amps quoted on motors and ESC's is just a reference that shouldn't really be exceeded, but you can easily,.......until the smoke escapes.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 10:28 AM
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dedStik's Avatar
United States, VA, Virginia Beach
Joined Feb 2012
5,419 Posts
I agree with both responses you've gotten. The plane you have selected would not be suitable for someone with little to no flight experience, that's not even touching on your build experience.

As eflightray has said if you are intent on building the Blu-baby is your best bet, otherwise as RR has said RTF is the route to go.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 10:35 AM
Hot glue held together by foam
United States, WA, Vancouver
Joined Aug 2010
2,596 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by filek View Post
Hi, I'm new to RC planes and thought I will build myself this plane http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=407323

The thing is I was thinking of going with a different motor. The setup I chose for this plane would be:
The motor:
http://www.hobbypartz.com/98p-mars-b...20a-combo.html
It draws 18 amp and it is matched with a 20amps esc
The battery that I would get for it would be:
http://www.hobbypartz.com/77p-sl1300-3s1p-20c-3333.html
It's a 1300Mha 3s 20C that gives me 26amp

Did I match it correctly?
Also my plane will most likely be a bit heavier than the one in the original build due to the fact I would be using EPP from homedepot
I would appreciate any tips and sugestions
That plane would not be a good choice for learning to fly with . A good plane to learn on is one with a high wing and dihedral for self righting , and can fly slowly so you have time to react .

Here is a foamy that's kind of a disposable trainer . It's called SUPER EASY because it is very easy ( and inexpensive ) to make , and also very easy to fly . If you do crash , it protects your electronics ( especially the motor/prop ) , and it is easy to repair/replace the airframe . It's weird looking , but once you learn to fly on it you could make a nicer plane to put the electronics on .

SUPER EASY thread http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1685988

Step by step build instructions http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1702077

A few happy builders http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...6#post22286363
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post22356382
praymond's video http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...4#post22398114
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...2#post22381464
A total beginner http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...1#post22878506

Al
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 01:04 PM
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United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
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Good advice all.............walk before you run son.
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Old Oct 04, 2012, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eflightray View Post
In your, 'good set-up ?', you missed the most important thing..... the prop. Pick the wrong one and the motor and or ESC could smoke. It's the props load on the motor that determines the current. The amps quoted on motors and ESC's is just a reference that shouldn't really be exceeded, but you can easily,.......until the smoke escapes.
Yeah for the prop I'm already working on, with the nice tool from this forum WebOcalc. Most likely I will go with 10x4.6 like the WebOcalc sugest since it will be most efficient.

Also I forgot to mention I got some training from this lil thing
Flite Test - FT FLYER - SCRATCH BUILD (16 min 47 sec)


I know the one I want to build is for Intermediate and Advance flyers and I know I will crash it, but I like to learn from my mistakes.

Thanks for the advice
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 09:59 AM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,178 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by filek View Post
I know the one I want to build is for Intermediate and Advance flyers and I know I will crash it, but I like to learn from my mistakes.

Thanks for the advice
Here's the deal. You do not learn a thing about flying from crashing (except how to repair). Repeat that. You learn nothing from crashing that will help you successfully fly.

You learn from that interval of successful flight before you crash. The shorter that interval is and the less frequently it is repeated the less you will learn. With an intermediate to advanced plane, all your learning will take place if five seconds. Your crash will probably not allow repeat attempts soon enough to benefit from repetition, where learning is aided by precise memory of frequent attempts. Two five second flights a week apart will have no accumulative teaching effect.

Frustration, however, IS gained from crashing. If repeated crashes are interrupted by major rebuilds, their effect on your frustration will be accumulative, growing very quickly. Frustration is a negative factor in learning, having possibly a good effect at low levels, but quickly killing your motivation at higher levels.

Also, be aware that using WebOcalc to come to the conclusions you are is certainly not a good way to go. There is a tremendous difference between different propellers of the same diameter and pitch. They can and do differ from an efficiency coefficient of .28 to nearly .65. Yes, that means that two identical props can be as different from each other as the worst one is from no prop at all. Your battery life would be half as long with one compared to the other. Your airspeed would be different, your thrust would be different. Your power draw could be double for one compared to the other. The basic idea behind WebOcalc is decent but it leaves out the most important parameters of propellers: manufacturer and model number of propeller. Without those the results are dead wrong and the program is not useful.

I think you have to seriously reexamine your plan of action. Either that or begin planning your next hobby now.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 10:01 AM
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United States, CA, Oceanside
Joined Apr 2011
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I admire your persistence in wanting to learn by building and flying your own handiwork, but you have to ask yourself, "What will I learn if I destroy the first plane I try to fly?" Yes, you will learn the build, but will you learn it correctly, and that certainly doesn't help in learning to fly. Anyway, good luck.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 10:40 AM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
4,178 Posts
Also the plans for the Park Bipe are not plans at all. They leave out everything that will doom your attempts to build the thing, being written for those with enough experience that explanation is not necessary.

You have put yourself in a no win situation. When your five second flight terminates with a one-point landing with great prejudice, you'll be left with whatever survives and two questions:
  1. Was my lack of flying skill responsible for the crash? You cannot know because the answer is masked by your lack of building and trimming skills.
  2. Was it a defect in the way the plane was built or trimmed? You cannot know because the answer is masked by your lack of flying skill.
So the flow chart just shows two questions begging each other for answers that you cannot have. No solution is possible.
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Old Oct 05, 2012, 12:28 PM
Hot glue held together by foam
United States, WA, Vancouver
Joined Aug 2010
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" one point landing "

Guess what the " one point " is on the plane you want to make - your motor ....
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 12:33 AM
Registered User
United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Mar 2012
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Hi! I'm a beginner and learned to fly from scratch built, and yes I almost gave up. I did a lot of "one point landing". Finally I built a plane the right way, with airfoil and cool looking fuselage. I now enjoy flying. Every morning I get up early and fly before I go to work.
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Old Oct 07, 2012, 06:21 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
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VERY nice looking design! You should make up plans and post them!
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Old Oct 08, 2012, 08:34 AM
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United States, CA, Santa Barbara
Joined Mar 2012
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Thank you RR! I better figure out how to put it on paper. I think it is a good idea to keep a set of plans for this.
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Old Oct 08, 2012, 01:13 PM
buyer of the farm
United States, FL, DeLand
Joined Mar 2009
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Hey Filek, watch this spot. If you want to build something appropriate your wish is about to be granted. Now this does have ailerons and a flat wing. But the plane will still benefit from dihedral and pendulum effect from the high wing.

You could also fly this plane 3-channel by just leaving off the rudder. Fly it aileron-elevator-throttle. That will give you the same advantages as flying rudder-elevator-throttle. You may want to make sure the aileron throws are mild. And nobody says you can't play with the rudder while you're up there.

Cyar, please provide details of how all the equipment is mounted and wing position of the CG so a builder has complete instruction. It's so hard for an experienced builder to make a good set of plans because he's forgotten what beginners don't know yet.

Filek, I'd match up an 18A motor with a 25 or 30A ESC, not a 20A one. Always leave your equipment lots of headroom so when you're a bit wrong it doesn't self-destruct!
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