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Old Sep 09, 2013, 08:03 AM
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Congratulation!
What a beautiful sight.
w
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Old Sep 10, 2013, 09:44 AM
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**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
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Thanks Shotibf109, GLM, FoamDave,Triple W
Nice Avatar W.
**Neons** Bob
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Old Sep 18, 2013, 03:11 PM
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9-8-2013 5th John Nicolaci Float Fly - Martin Mars XPB2M-1

Here is another video of my Mars flight at our Annual John Nicolaci Float Fly. Notice that I also have my Kawanishi Emily on the grass nearby. Flew it also.
9- 8 -2013 5th Annual J. Nicolaci Flo Fly - Martin Mars Flight #2 (5 min 19 sec)

**neons** Bob
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Old Sep 18, 2013, 03:45 PM
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Beautiful ....

History revived.
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Old Sep 18, 2013, 04:06 PM
low and slow
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Norway, Bergen, Straumesvingen
Joined May 2010
82 Posts
Looks real nice Bob! Congratulations!

She is flying quite different from mine. I guess most of the difference is due to yours being heavier.
What flying weight did you end up on? Mine is 4100 grams with about 7200mAh 3cell power.

Arvid
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Old Sep 18, 2013, 04:54 PM
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**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Arvid and Tim Thank you,
Arvid, I saw your beauty fly and she floats nice like a feather. Stunning videos too. My planes are much heavier, I have not weighed them for a final weight. I would guesstimate the plane is in the 18ib or over 8000grams. I had to add more than enough weight to get the nose down. I has more tail weight with twin rudders. I lose the real slow speeds that you are fortunate to have. It makes up on the windy day end though. I usually fly mid days. The wind is usually up then. The plane weight handles nice in the wind.
**Neons** Bob
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Old Sep 22, 2013, 09:21 PM
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**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart83 View Post
Congrats Bob !! well done. I'll bed thats a load of your shoulderss Hope to see a video soon.
How did she handle ? are the twin vertical stab's enought to keep her stable ?
Wish you lots of good times wit this wonderfull model.

and now . . . a kawanishi Mavis ?


Cheers,

Bart
Hi Bart,
Been busy with 2 land shows and I could not answer your question right away.
Your model building is exemplary. Your CAD or 3D drawings are very also very nice. I looked over a few planes you have built and it is timeless building with great skill. I have a weakness for Japanese aircraft beauty and being an underdog for the unique.. The Kawanishi Mavis should handle fine taking in the consideration you are building light weight. I think if it was a heavy plane like mine I may make the elevator and rudder a little larger of scale. The balance would probably have to be right on with the small area in the tail. I like your new work on the Dornier. Very nice. Probably a more popular choice as more have been built as models. The Mavis is probably almost extinct as a model aircraft which makes it more appealing to me.

My Emily flew very nice this year. Maybe I am understanding the handling a little better. The Martin Mars has less power and most likely due to the span less wing loading. The plane was a dream to fly and tracks like on rails. Imagine 2 flights and I never had to touch the trims. The Emily has a higher wing loading and shorter span so it makes it a lot more harder to fly. I added another 5 oz of silly putty in the nose and I did not get any pitching this time. So much nicer. I also used flaps landing and that improved also.

The Mars can fly on 1/4 throttle easily if there is no wind and it looks nice cruising by and no stall at that range. Maybe the wing washout helps it. I only give it a boost in the turns. I fly mostly with wind due to the time of day I fly when it picks up. I fond the mistake I was doing was steep banking. I actually tried turning the plane for instance left and as I leaned I pushed in right aileron to keep it flat turning. It worked well for me when needed. Now I need more flight time and work on my landings.

Cheers,
**Neons** Bob
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Old Sep 23, 2013, 01:35 AM
Slip the surly bonds...
Sopwith Mike's Avatar
Christchurch,England
Joined Aug 2004
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The Mavis is a very tempting subject, but has a lot of complications in the struts and wing attachment, hasn't it? Like how to get all the power and servo wires from the wing to the fuselage via a couple of quite small supports.

Still, I don't expect that to put Bart off

The Mars videos are great to watch, and it's nice to see the man behind the sticks as well. And I liked the tip about scale turns, avoiding too much bank. It does look so much better.

Mike
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Old Sep 23, 2013, 03:32 AM
71% of the world is runway . .
Bart83's Avatar
Nederland, ZH, Oostvoorne
Joined Jun 2009
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Bob ,

A seaplane with a somewhat higher wing loading should be no troulble at all , it just takes a little more time to get used to it. It has the advantage of being capable to fly in less perfect conditions. The hull shape design is very important on a flying boat with a higher wing loading for a good water handling ( no bouncing etc ) Like you said flaps are a great addition , my Dornier 24 wont be as light as the empire so i can also fly when there is more wind ( i live near the coast so the wind is almost a constant factor ) , this plane will also have a functional flap.
I really like your Emily , it have that cool Jap look

For the mavis :

I think this is a very intresting subject for a large rc model , it hase some design features wich make it very suitable for a model.

- Long wing ( like the mars )
- Nose hase enouch lenght so no need for excesive ballance weight
- 4 engine ( blown airfoil , so good low speed preformance )
- Relative simple hull shape ( flat side's )
- VERY UNIQUE , have not seen any rc model of it before ( maybe just because i lack the knowledge in Japanese to google it )

As mike says the struts can be a bit of a challenge , for the dornier wich has a simulair wing attachment i will make it like this :
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Description:

The dornier is in 1/10 scale and the struts provide more than enouch room for the wire's. The reciever will be in the wing so the only wire's going trough the struts are the battery wire's and the rudder and elevator servo wire's.
I agree with you that increasing the tail's size would be nessecary as it seems rather small , but if you want it 100% scale maybe a gyro would be needed

one more thing that i like on Japanese aircraft is that you can go all the way in wheatering

Cheers,

Bart
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Old Sep 23, 2013, 08:45 AM
Slip the surly bonds...
Sopwith Mike's Avatar
Christchurch,England
Joined Aug 2004
2,600 Posts
Sorry to trespass even further on the Mars thread Bob, but is Bart going to model the Frieze ailerons on the Mavis, do you think? The huge flap area is probably not needed!

Mike
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Old Sep 23, 2013, 09:22 AM
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Wilfor's Avatar
Canada, BC, Williams Lake
Joined Jan 2010
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You can always do as others are doing and run 2 receivers. Seems to work quite well and then leaves fewer wires to worry about. Mr Morgan just used that approach on his Tigercat after someone mentioned it and it worked well .
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Old Sep 23, 2013, 10:01 AM
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**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Bart & Mike
You guys have some great input on the Mavis. I would like to see one built. The wing is quite large and it should make a nice low wing load plane. The slim fuselage will also be light weight too. Adding flaps is always a plus too. They still give you another option in flight whether used or not. The 4 center struts should easily handle all the wires.

I Make my own servo wires to the length needed. They can have the tips crimped on and passed through the tube struts easily and then add the plastic ends. The ailerons have a detached hinge setup that show some gap similar to some German planes of the 30's designs like Ju52 transport and Ju87s. Of course, I would also make the Frieze ailerons as that is the detail that brings the plane out into the class of it's own. This plane is dripping with classic lines.

Nice photos shown here for details. I wish I read the Jap language on the first picture. When I made my Mars rudders and elevator I used side and top views of pictures sized up in my IsoPlot and Poster programs to size the photo to match Ivan's plans. It gave me relatively the correct match I needed to fit my Mars.

Mike, On turning and banking the heavier planes. I experimented mixing rudder and aileron on my old Twinstar. I fly windy weather normally. As I bank using the ailerons I mixed in opposite rudder percentages as a trim. It worked well on that model. It can be done with the rudder as master and the ailerons as slave in the transmitter. This is the way I like it a little better. You over ride it by using the joystick if needed on the aileron.

I have been messing with Multicopters this year also. A lot of fun. The new HK multi board is marvelous. I use the KK2 board. It is 3 axis gyro in it, It has Self Level and Stabilization modes for aircraft built in also. This application on a plane prevents wind fluctuations in stabilization mode by switch on the transmitter. Self level flys auto pilot level also. Move the joystick as usual and le it go and it goes back to level. Toggle on and off. Look it up in the Groups- KK2 board. $30 USA. I love this board..

Wilfor , I just got your note while I was typing this reply. I agree also in a plane like this with struts that a dual receiver is a great idea. It would also eliminate much wiring. Great thought. If it was not for my mentor " Master Builder- John Morgan" I could not build the way I do with a mixture of modern ideas. I follow everything he does in the RC Groups. His latest ongoing build of the F7F TigerCat is tops.
**Neons** Bob
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Old Sep 30, 2013, 02:58 PM
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P_J_Glor's Avatar
Valencia, CA
Joined Oct 2002
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Just saw the videos. Truly a most elegant and impressive model! That applause on take off was well deserved and echoed here.

Well done!

Pete G.
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Old Sep 30, 2013, 05:57 PM
5,200 Led Lighted Bike-Bob P.
**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Pete,
It was a pleasant surprise everything went well with the maiden and Nicolaci Event. have flown many maidens but not like this one. Imagine doing it without not so much as a trim click either of the 2 flights at two days apart. A tribute also to Ivan the plan designer before some mods. I feel so much better now that it is all over for this year. My Kawanishi Emily flew well also this year with 2 flights. Both great aircraft from about the same early years in the WWII.
Thanks,
**Neons** Bob
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Old Feb 19, 2014, 06:36 PM
5,200 Led Lighted Bike-Bob P.
**neons**'s Avatar
USA, MA, Swansea
Joined Mar 2003
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Just found a nice link with more very early Martin Mars XPB2M-1 photos and the JRM at almost the end of the war delivery.
http://www.axis-and-allies-paintwork...topic.php?7871
**Neons** Bob
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