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Old Aug 15, 2014, 08:20 PM
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Joined Jun 2011
88 Posts
Help!
New Radian Crashed! Please help!

Hello Everyone. I crashed my brand new Radian into the ground immediately on it's maiden. I had to use lots of glue to say the least. I bought the 3 channel PNP version and a A400 receiver bound to my DX4e from my super cub. I made a huge mistake in not double checking that the throws were correct; turns out the controls were reversed which caused my crash.

I thought I fixed the issue when I used the individual switches on the bottom of the DX4e to reverse the servos for the rudder and aileron. ( the manual said it's typical to plug the rudder servo into the aileron channel; which I did)

So now all my throws work as they should. I got outside and give it a toss and for some reason the plane only seems to respond to up elevator, none of the other throws seemed to have any influence on the aircraft. Really it seemed like it just wanted to do loops over and over and that's it. I had very little control. No left, No Right, Maybe a little Down but mainly just Up control. I looked at all the control surfaces and they are functioning correctly. What could be going on here? I can fly my 3 channel super cub no issues; I just wanted to get into gliding. I'm wondering why I had to reverse the servos to begin with?
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Old Aug 15, 2014, 08:45 PM
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Guardian7's Avatar
Joined Sep 2012
140 Posts
I had the same problem, don’t fly the Radian until you fix the Decalage and Center of gravity, see Paul Naton’s video! And make sure the push rods move freely without any binding and the servos are not loose or moving when they push and pull. I also prefer more weight in the front so I run 2200mah batteries which helps keep the nose down when penetrating light winds, I use a carbon arrow inside the wing spar, I use the thin packing tape on fuselage, leading edges, and undersides of wings, I use flat carbon fiber along the bottom of the fuselage, I use round carbon fiber on the sides of the battery compartment. The Radian does not handle winds over 10mph well. When your pitch does not change between gliding and full throttle you have it dialed in pretty close. The stock spinner and prop are junk, replace with BB Aluminum Spinner and Aeronaut 11x6 Carbon CAM blades.

Paul Naton’s Parkzone Radian Decalage & CG fix

Parkzone RADIAN Modification Clinic.mp4 (31 min 53 sec)


Paul Naton’s Parkzone Radian Mods (full writeup)
http://glidefast.typepad.com/glidefa...d-set-ups.html

Spinner and Propeller upgrade (BB Folding Alum Spinner 50/4/8) and (Aeronaut CAM Folding Propeller 11x6)
http://www.espritmodel.com/sailplane...-spinners.aspx
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Old Aug 15, 2014, 09:32 PM
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Joined Jun 2011
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Thank you for your suggestions. I watched the video and wow - this all seems pretty in depth ; way more than I had planned. I was under the impression this was basically RTF. I guess I was expecting the same experience or close to as my super cub. I forgot to mention I'm using my 1300mah super cub battery as well. Surely all that isn't needed for very basic cruising around the sky???


I just want to be able to keep it airborne without it going nuts soon as it leaves my hand! I never dreamed a 3 channel plane would be such a pain. I thought 3 channels were meant for relaxing! I'm terrified to even give it another attempt! I have a UMX radian and it's a smooth relaxing blast I was hoping the experience would carry over to her bigger sister.
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Old Aug 15, 2014, 10:49 PM
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Joined Jun 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deathcharge View Post
Thank you for your suggestions. I watched the video and wow - this all seems pretty in depth ; way more than I had planned. I was under the impression this was basically RTF. I guess I was expecting the same experience or close to as my super cub. I forgot to mention I'm using my 1300mah super cub battery as well. Surely all that isn't needed for very basic cruising around the sky???


I just want to be able to keep it airborne without it going nuts soon as it leaves my hand! I never dreamed a 3 channel plane would be such a pain. I thought 3 channels were meant for relaxing! I'm terrified to even give it another attempt! I have a UMX radian and it's a smooth relaxing blast I was hoping the experience would carry over to her bigger sister.

The Radian is VERY relaxing to fly, but there are a few things that need fixing.

You dont need to do the decalage mod initially. Just make sure you replace the crappy hardware with Dubro . The little nurled nuts on the originals break.

You must, however make sure your CG is at least in the stock position. Make up the device I alluded to in my other post in the Radian group. Launch power off, slowly throttle up. Don't climb past 45 degree angle and always climb with her flying a path that is90 degrees to your position. You don't want her climbing directly away or toward you.

After you have about a dozen flights, start moving your CG back slowly. Get used to each change with several flights at each new position. When you get to about 3 inches, you begin to feel the magic.

Also, mod your wings with velcro or magnets to keep them from separating in flight. When that happens you end up with a hopelessly wrecked bird. It is a wretched feeling.

Read ALL the posts in the Radian group. It will be well worth your efforts.

Cliff

PS. On a good thermalling day I get 90 minute flights using a 1300 nanotech. Only land because my back and neck cant take it.
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Old Aug 16, 2014, 12:47 AM
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Guardian7's Avatar
Joined Sep 2012
140 Posts
Depending on when the plane was purchased it may already have upgraded push rod hardware, Parkzone has started shipping new Radians with upgraded hardware. The Radian is an incredible Plane and much more than a basic cruiser, it has won competitions and set records for thermal duration. Don't feel you need to do everything we listed, my mods were done over the course of the first year I owned the Radian. I watch beginners fly Radian's every weekend and the new planes try to loop over when power is applied, the Decalage & CG mod cures this problem, most beginners are not able to push the nose down and keep a 45 degree climb angle so the mod really helps. I highly recommend you have an experienced Pilot maiden and trim your Radian, especially now that it has been crashed and repaired. While teaching new Pilot's to fly the Radian's I will perform initial testing & trimming for them so the plane flies straight and level, I also perform the Decalage mod and give beginners a 2200mah battery to learn with. Hobby People makes a 2200mah 30C for $10 which works great for learning because the battery moves the CG forward making the plane easier to fly and gives you over an hour of stick time! The Radian is sensitive to CG and Air Density changes which may require elevator trim when these items change to keep the plane flying perfectly for hands off free flight. After a crash your Radian will usually need to be re-trimmed and thoroughly checked out for issues.

Thermal and slope soaring records.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2200025
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Old Aug 16, 2014, 07:11 AM
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War is Peace's Avatar
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Joined Mar 2012
424 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by deathcharge View Post
Hello Everyone. I crashed my brand new Radian into the ground immediately on it's maiden. I had to use lots of glue to say the least. I bought the 3 channel PNP version and a A400 receiver bound to my DX4e from my super cub. I made a huge mistake in not double checking that the throws were correct; turns out the controls were reversed which caused my crash.

I thought I fixed the issue when I used the individual switches on the bottom of the DX4e to reverse the servos for the rudder and aileron. ( the manual said it's typical to plug the rudder servo into the aileron channel; which I did)

So now all my throws work as they should. I got outside and give it a toss and for some reason the plane only seems to respond to up elevator, none of the other throws seemed to have any influence on the aircraft. Really it seemed like it just wanted to do loops over and over and that's it. I had very little control. No left, No Right, Maybe a little Down but mainly just Up control. I looked at all the control surfaces and they are functioning correctly. What could be going on here? I can fly my 3 channel super cub no issues; I just wanted to get into gliding. I'm wondering why I had to reverse the servos to begin with?
I've helped 4 people learn to fly with stock Radians. The only AND 100% CONSISTENT PROBLEM has been the cheap thumb screw connectors at the rudder and elevator control horns. They easily allow the pushrod to slip (causing no movement of the control surface) and when tightened sufficiently, they break.
2 Solutions:
1. replace them with some good DuBro hardware.... or
2. (what I do) carefully mark the pushrod at the control horns and make a Z-bend. (eliminating any hardware) Of course, you must be accurate and will probably have to adjust your trims.
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Last edited by War is Peace; Aug 16, 2014 at 07:23 AM.
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Old Aug 16, 2014, 05:23 PM
Fair Winds to all
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United States, MN, Faribault
Joined Jun 2001
322 Posts
Deathcharge, it's unfortunate that you had the issues at all, Radian's when properly setup, even with the original hardware, fly all right. I'm still using the original hardware on my 3 yr old Radian and it's flown slope, thermal, ALES and just fun flying without any major issues.

All of the above recommendations will improve it, but if you check the connections and check the surface deflection throws you might find the answer to your current setup issue. Are you getting enough surface deflection when you move your TX sticks.

Another modeller posted these measurements for his Radian,
"The rudder has the pushrod in the second hole from the outer end of the control horn. On low rates I get 18mm of throw.
On high rate I get 23mm of throw.

The elevater pushrod is on the last outer hole(furthest from fuselage)
Low rate throw is 10mm.
High rate throw is 15mm. Hope this helps."

If that's close to what you already have then it may be your CG, which Paul Naton's article mentions how much he's adjusted his to fly proper.
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Old Aug 16, 2014, 09:39 PM
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John Gallagher's Avatar
Lindenwold, NJ, USA
Joined Dec 2000
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If you bought the Radian recently the cheap thumb screw connectors at the rudder and elevator control horns are no longer there. Parkzone has replaced them with the connectors shown here:
new connector photos

Parkzone also changed the fuse molds to correct the decalage about a year ago.

Most of the modifications in Paul Naton’s video are not necessary for the initial flights. When you get experience flying the Radian, you can decide if you want to enhance the Radian.

Have you checked the CG?
Did you do a test glide before the first powered flight? This would be running with the glider and then throwing the glider Into The Wind, aiming at the horizon and adjusting the elevator setting until the Radian glides well hands-off.
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Last edited by John Gallagher; Aug 17, 2014 at 12:15 AM.
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Old Aug 16, 2014, 10:11 PM
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Joined Apr 2012
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I'll second the suggestion of test gliding but I prefer a standing throw. The trick is to keep the plane level and throw it more like a dart than a baseball. Especially if there's a slight breeze or you can find a small hill, a firm push is all that a light glider like a Radian will need.

You didn't say whether the motor was running on your second attempt. If the motor was running then it's possible that you were pulled up into a stall so the controls lost their effectiveness.

Cheers!
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Old Aug 17, 2014, 12:12 AM
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Joined Dec 2000
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Should have mentioned that you should test glide the plane into the wind.
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Old Aug 18, 2014, 04:36 PM
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Joined Sep 2012
140 Posts
Deathcharge, sometimes it's a challenging hobby but don't give up, I crashed my Radian three weeks in a row and just kept getting back on the horse! It was worth every bit of struggle when I finally got her to fly the victory was sweet, six months later I replaced the fuselage and made her pretty again. Then my brother bought the Radian and I watched the plane loop over and crash the first time he tried to fly and now it's hanging in his basement, I repaired his plane but he has given up on the hobby after a discouraging first flight. I wish I had done the Paul Naton mod for him prior to his first flight but crashing is part of the learning curve we all go through. This hobby really gets fun once you get through the crashing stage which usually take 6 to 12 months depending on the person.
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Last edited by Guardian7; Aug 18, 2014 at 04:44 PM.
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Old Aug 24, 2014, 08:34 AM
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Joined Aug 2014
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deathcharge View Post
Hello Everyone. I crashed my brand new Radian into the ground immediately on it's maiden. I had to use lots of glue to say the least. I bought the 3 channel PNP version and a A400 receiver bound to my DX4e from my super cub. I made a huge mistake in not double checking that the throws were correct; turns out the controls were reversed which caused my crash.

I thought I fixed the issue when I used the individual switches on the bottom of the DX4e to reverse the servos for the rudder and aileron. ( the manual said it's typical to plug the rudder servo into the aileron channel; which I did)

. I'm wondering why I had to reverse the servos to begin with?

I guess you are pretty new to RC. It is a basic rule of RC that you Never, Never, Never fly without doing a preflight check. That includes, among other things, checking the control surfaces for proper direction movement and throws.

Did you even open the manual? Page 8 gives detailed diagrams of the "Control Direction Test" . You are lucky that you didn't injure anyone and end up facing a lawsuit for negligence .
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Old Sep 05, 2014, 12:27 AM
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140 Posts
New Radian's shipping with upgraded push rods. Also if you order a replacement fuselage you should get the upgraded version of the fuselage, the rods look like Radian Pro push rods.
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