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Old May 14, 2008, 07:00 AM
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Son, Norway
Joined Sep 2004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagle
Hi,

as to the monitor-issue (witch makes monitor mode quiet useless if you ask me) would it be possible, to simply connect output-GND to balancer-GND internally?

- Oliver
Maybe through a low amp fuse?
Externally it could be done by the use of some Y-harness. I use this for monitoring cell voltages with a Hyperion LBA10 under heavy loads (>10A). One of the main inputs has to be connected in addition to the balancing connector (+ terminal if I remember correct). I agree, it's not an optimal solution.

Fred
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Old May 14, 2008, 07:30 AM
Registered User
Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julez
Kits go for €8 here!
Where?

- Oliver
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Old May 14, 2008, 07:33 AM
Registered User
Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flarssen
Maybe through a low amp fuse?
VERY good Idea! I think, i will do this for my chargers. There should be no current "flowing", so the fuse could be very low.

- Oliver
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Old May 14, 2008, 07:54 AM
Proud to eat Kraut ;-)
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Germany
Joined Dec 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagle
Where?

- Oliver
Here:

http://cgi.ebay.de/DIGITAL-CONV-CMOS...QQcmdZViewItem

Quote:
I just tested forming charge for NiMh. I noticed, forming will STOP as soon, as the set capacity is reached! I entered "1,5Ah" and it stopped at 1,5Ah charged capacity.
This is indeed strange.
Let's have a look again:

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=237

Only phase 1 and phase 2 terminate when 100%C is charged in, but even if this happens, the charger still should switch to phase 3, where 25%C are charged in additionally.
Of course, the total capacity which is charged in, does not neccessarily have to match the pack's capacity. If it was fully charged, and then charged in the forming mode, the total charged in capacity will be lower, than if a depleted pack was charged in forming mode.

Does the charger show which phase it is in when a forming charge is running? This way cou could check in which phase it stopped in your case.

Cheers,

Julez
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Old May 14, 2008, 02:50 PM
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Roseville,CA
Joined May 2008
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junsi,

any chance of adding watt meter functionality to the charger ?

also oled instead of lcd seems very effective on a bright sunny day outside at the field. just a suggestion..

here is a pic of a triton lcd mod that I found on the forum.

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/attac...mentid=1182543

thx
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Old May 14, 2008, 11:37 PM
iCharger
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Joined Mar 2007
1,087 Posts
Hello Oliver,
We are so sorry to see this happened to your charger!

Quote:
I formed a NiMh-Battery. it was already in the "low current" phase, when I left. As I came back ~5 Hours later, the battery was ready. No error, nothing special happend (but forming is not very good, see other post). I removed it, connected another battery, changed to LiPo Balance Charge Mode and now the charger will not charge any more: Shows "Balance Port Voltage Error". But if I check voltages on the Balance port, everything is OK (3 cells are visible with correct voltage). If I try to charge without balancer it will not start, too. Seems it cannot measure voltage on the output port any more, shows 0,24V with or without connected battery. Display of balancer port is ok.
We wre wondering whether you had connect both the balance port and the main port at the same time? If yes,then we think it’s our charger’s own problem, we will handle it later!
Quote:
as to the monitor-issue (witch makes monitor mode quiet useless if you ask me) would it be possible, to simply connect output-GND to balancer-GND internally? When charging, it is always connected, anyways!? Or is the balancer port "fool proofed", could you really connect balancer cable in reverse without harming the circuit (I don't want to try this, hehehe)? That's the only condition I can think of, where a internal connection GND->GND would hurt, as there would be a short circuit, when balancer cable would be reversed. (It is possible, as the JST-EH system used often in Germany is connectable after cutting some "nose" off the connector - and has reverse polarity to JST-XH) So if the balancer port would not been hurt when entering reverse polarity, better keep it unconnected. But if the balancer port would be destroyed in that case, I see no reason, not to connect Balancer Port and Output Port internally?
Actually the balance port and the output port just connected when the charger is in the process of charging, which can avoid reversed plug. If you don’t connect both of them ,then the charger can’t detect the correct voltage!

Thanks for your swift feedback!

Regards,
Junsi
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Old May 15, 2008, 12:03 AM
iCharger
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Quote:
Problem when forming NiMh:
I just tested forming charge for NiMh. I noticed, forming will STOP as soon, as the set capacity is reached! I entered "1,5Ah" and it stopped at 1,5Ah charged capacity.

That is wrong! The whole point of forming NiXX is, to "overcharge" the battery pack with low current (which will not damage the cells) to really fill up all cells! You should at least charge up to 150% of the capacity entered! It is no option to set a higher capacity, as the charging current should be at 1/10C or slightly lower.
Hello Oliver,
Could you tell me the detail information about you setting when forming NiMh and its end charge current? Thanks!
Now we quote the post given by Julez
Quote:
Only phase 1 and phase 2 terminate when 100%C is charged in, but even if this happens, the charger still should switch to phase 3, where 25%C are charged in additionally.
Of course, the total capacity which is charged in, does not neccessarily have to match the pack's capacity. If it was fully charged, and then charged in the forming mode, the total charged in capacity will be lower, than if a depleted pack was charged in forming mode.

Does the charger show which phase it is in when a forming charge is running? This way cou could check in which phase it stopped in your case.
Thanks for your kindly offer! Julez!
Actually, we have the same questions, and Oliver did you set the charging package number align with the actually charge packs!
Thanks! Any of your feedbacks will be highly appreciated!

Regards,
Junsi
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Old May 15, 2008, 04:02 AM
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Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julez
Only phase 1 and phase 2 terminate when 100%C is charged in, but even if this happens, the charger still should switch to phase 3, where 25%C are charged in additionally.
Hi,

I was not watching. All I can say is, as I came back _exactly_ 1500mAh was display and "Over" was show. But as I told, after that the charger was/is dead.... Maybe it broke at that moment, I have no idea.

- Oliver
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Old May 15, 2008, 04:12 AM
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Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
We wre wondering whether you had connect both the balance port and the main port at the same time?
I'm not sure, I understand?
- when I was Forming the NiMh, I had nothing connected to the Balance Port.
- after that, as I was trying to balance charge the LiPo, I connected both, output and balance port. As always.

Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
Actually the balance port and the output port just connected when the charger is in the process of charging, which can avoid reversed plug.
I understand, so an internal connection would "kill" a safety feature. Not good. What do you think about adding a fuse (maybe self-reseting) to be able to monitor without output-connection

Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
If you don’t connect both of them ,then the charger can’t detect the correct voltage!
This is very clear. Maybe you misunderstood me? I was thinking about adding a permanent connection between output gnd and balance-port gnd, to be able to monitor cell voltages without connection the battery to the output-port.

Broken Charger:

Do you have an idea, what could be defective in my charger? I rechecked last evening and now it shows 0,17V on the output port all the time. Monitoring still works and no charge programm will start. Would it be possible to get spare parts and repair myself? (I'm able to solder)

Shipping back to you would be quite expensive, combined shipping cost to you and back to me would cost more than the charger...

Thanks,

- Oliver
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Old May 15, 2008, 04:30 AM
Registered User
Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
511 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
Could you tell me the detail information about you setting when forming NiMh and its end charge current? Thanks!
All user settings for NiXX are at default. Only thing I changed was turn off the time-limit, as I expected the forming to take a lot more than 2 hours. And I set Trickle for NiMh to 20mAh (if that makes any difference). If you need all the settings, I can look them up in the evening.

I have no idea, at which phase it was etc. As I came back, the charger had charged exactly the set capacity (1500mAh) and showing "OVER".

Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
Oliver did you set the charging package number align with the actually charge packs!
Yes, I'm very sure.
It was a 6-cell-pack of GP 1500mAH NiMh AA cells.

The charge-cable used was quiet long and thin, may this be a problem? I was forming a NiMh in my transmitter. I don't think, this should be a provlem with forming. An i have charged the transmitter over this cable with 1A fixed several times before without problems.

BTW, I don't like it, that in forming-program the charger will start with 1C = 1,5A, this is exactly the maximum permitted by the transmitter... I would have preferred to form with a lower start-current.

Thanks,

- Oliver
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Old May 15, 2008, 04:34 AM
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Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Julez
I just ordered it, thank you!

- Oliver
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Old May 15, 2008, 05:47 AM
iCharger
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Joined Mar 2007
1,087 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smeagle
I'm not sure, I understand?
- when I was Forming the NiMh, I had nothing connected to the Balance Port.
- after that, as I was trying to balance charge the LiPo, I connected both, output and balance port. As always.


I understand, so an internal connection would "kill" a safety feature. Not good. What do you think about adding a fuse (maybe self-reseting) to be able to monitor without output-connection


This is very clear. Maybe you misunderstood me? I was thinking about adding a permanent connection between output gnd and balance-port gnd, to be able to monitor cell voltages without connection the battery to the output-port.

Broken Charger:

Do you have an idea, what could be defective in my charger? I rechecked last evening and now it shows 0,17V on the output port all the time. Monitoring still works and no charge programm will start. Would it be possible to get spare parts and repair myself? (I'm able to solder)

Shipping back to you would be quite expensive, combined shipping cost to you and back to me would cost more than the charger...

Thanks,

- Oliver
Hello Oliver,
About this charger, there may be some damages! I will send you a Email to settle this problem.
Thanks for your understanding!

Regards,
Junsi
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Old May 15, 2008, 07:43 AM
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Munich, Germany
Joined Nov 2003
511 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by junsi
Hello Oliver,
Here we attached a PDF.file of “Steps of hardware upgrading”.
You can solve the “Bug” problem just carefully following the instruction. Please upgrade your hardware carefully.
Thanks, very good. BTW: I think it would be ok/enough, if you offered an external Serial connection for upgrading. USB is a nice feature, but no show stoppper. As long as there IS a way to upgrade, that should be ok.

I wonder: Don't I need to recalibrate the balancer port after upgrading?

I will wait a while, before I update this way, I don't want to brick my chargers Please tell, when you got it thoroughly tested and an english version is available!

Thanks,

- Oliver
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Last edited by Smeagle; May 15, 2008 at 08:01 AM.
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Old May 15, 2008, 09:00 AM
Registered User
Melbourne, Australia
Joined May 2006
6,407 Posts
Here is an alternative that I suspect might work just fine: hexTronik USB Key for HXT BESC Picture is attached for Junsi or anyone else who cannot access that site. Retail price is USD$9.95 plus shipping. Since this is used to configure an ESC you can bet the CPU on the ESC has an identical style of 3-wire serial port to the CPU in the charger, it is a very common interface on almost all embedded CPUs.

If you download and install the software from www.hextronik.com it will install the USB-to-serial device driver.

Now I think you will find that if the Junsi program allows you to select the COM port you should be able to use this device to communicate with the charger for the upgrade.

I have not tested any of this myself yet.

Junsi it would be great if you could get one and try it out as it. Then all you would need to do is provide a three-pin header accessible to the user and a servo lead that can be plugged in between the two devices. I am sure customers would be happy to pay for the programming lead/adapter as they do for all other chargers, ESCs, gyros etc. that have this kind of feature.
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Old May 15, 2008, 09:04 AM
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Melbourne, Australia
Joined May 2006
6,407 Posts
How to connect two packs in series

I have answered a lot of questions on several different RC forums about how to connect two packs in series to chargers. On another thread here there was a user of a 1010B who shorted his packs out which is a definite risk if you connect them incorrectly.

So attached is a diagram that illustrates the proper connection for a 1010B via the balance adapter board and a series Deans Y-cable.
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