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Old Aug 06, 2015, 04:00 AM
andreas82 is offline
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What is the most effective strategy for getting out of a spin?

I have a FX-79. When I was flying it at 200 meter altitude the other day, I manage to get it into a stall and then an uncontrolled spin. It took 100 meter of drop before I managed to get it out of the spin. I do not know what I did to get it level out again. I have searched the forum for discissions about what's the best way of getting out of a spin (throttle up? throttle down? ailerons left/right?) but with no success.
Anyone has any good advices?
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Old Aug 06, 2015, 10:20 AM
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This is a tough one. A wing in a spin has several things to over come. The worst is control surface blanking, where there is no air flow over one side of the surface or both sides. Then is the rotating mass that is large, and control surfaces that are close to the center of mass with small leverage to effect or stop the spin. spin recovery can be done in two ways first is to fly out or hold down elevator while slowly adding aileron into the spin causing a roll out of the spin then recover. Second is to rock the elevator up and down untill the wing pitches out or falls out. this second way will cause more loss of altitude. so my first effort will be Down and hold and then slowly add aileron into the spin. In any case you have to respond quickly and it is best to start your recovery before the start of the second turn. The longer it spins the harder it is to recover.
Hope this help full
have a great next flying day
Nic
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Old Aug 06, 2015, 12:28 PM
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The most effective way for getting out of a spin is never get into it... This is especially the case for flying wings with no or very small vertical stabiliser(s)/fins because these planes don't have yaw stability.

In 1:1 scale flying the acronym 'PARE' is heard often when talking about spin recovery. PARE stands for: reduce Power, level Ailerons, opposite Rudder and neutral Elevator. Hold these until the rotation stops, then neutral rudder, pull elevator until level and power up. But this is only valid for planes with fin/rudder.

Since it is all about getting the airflow back again over the wing and control surfaces as fast as possible, I would suggest to cut the power immediately, then neutral elevator and indeed add a little aileron in the direction of the spin (and this is critical, opposite direction will keep the wing in the stall/spin, resulting in much more loss of altitude).

The only thing is that you won't get any clear feedback on when the spin has stopped and you're back in control. Because of aileron in the direction of the spin, the wing will spinning (actually rolling) in that same direction (but in a controlled way). In case of little aileron you might notice that the wing rolls less aggresively when your back in control.
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Old Aug 06, 2015, 11:30 PM
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Pare

Although I think the PARE works well I think the elevator should be pumped.
Meaning full back (up elev.) and then neutral and full back again. Repeat this process quickly until you get response. It's important to reverse the downward spiral. Only the elev will do that.
I believe the big ones is dropping your throttle and reversing your rudder.. Your driving it into the ground with full throttle. Don't do that.
I saved my EF P-51 and my Radian Pro from a death by doing the PARE. The P-51 even went over a bank of dirt out of sight and then appeared form the horizon. Best save ever.
This maneuver only works if you are high enough to recover.
That depends on how big and heavy your plane is and knowing your planes limits.
No crashes folks.
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Old Aug 07, 2015, 01:50 PM
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It depends. So many different scenarios. I hit a pylon and had a flat fast spin. once I had orientation, Full throttle full recovery.
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Old Aug 07, 2015, 09:56 PM
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On my flight simulator spin recoveries for flying wings are not
consistent enough for me to have a set procedure.

Edit, agree that flat spin with flying wing...power needed to
get wing back to flying speed...my wings stall about 14-16 mph.

A lot of altitude if you practice.

I got real lucky in this video...lost
in the Sun....

Luck is good.


Flying Wing Luck. Stall, Spin, Touch and Go, Recovery, Landing. (0 min 30 sec)
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Old Aug 16, 2015, 04:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingfrog50 View Post
This is a tough one. A wing in a spin has several things to over come. The worst is control surface blanking, where there is no air flow over one side of the surface or both sides. Then is the rotating mass that is large, and control surfaces that are close to the center of mass with small leverage to effect or stop the spin. spin recovery can be done in two ways first is to fly out or hold down elevator while slowly adding aileron into the spin causing a roll out of the spin then recover. Second is to rock the elevator up and down untill the wing pitches out or falls out. this second way will cause more loss of altitude. so my first effort will be Down and hold and then slowly add aileron into the spin. In any case you have to respond quickly and it is best to start your recovery before the start of the second turn. The longer it spins the harder it is to recover.
Hope this help full
have a great next flying day
Nic
If is a flying wing this the best advice (also apply to planks) without motor, if you has motor then put the throttle off.
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Old Aug 16, 2015, 06:26 PM
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Yes 1. cut power 2. nose down 3. slowly add roll into the spin, if you only have rudder still, rudder into spin with down elevator then fly out of the roll. I hope this helps clear sky and smooth air.
Nic
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 08:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingfrog50 View Post
Yes 1. cut power 2. nose down 3. slowly add roll into the spin, if you only have rudder still, rudder into spin with down elevator then fly out of the roll. I hope this helps clear sky and smooth air.
Nic
Your first post is the best advice for that I wrote, just added the throttle off if somebody are in the situation flying a powered wing. THANKS, for sure your posts help a lot.

Regards.-
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 09:09 AM
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Well... what I found most reliable is to open power to Max and let the model continue in a dive to a shallow dive. Once the speed is up... the model will be out of a stalled condition which is the primary cause of having entered a spin. Once out of the stall.... its easy to recover with some throttle and then easing back up the elevator.
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shobhit17 View Post
Well... what I found most reliable is to open power to Max and let the model continue in a dive to a shallow dive. Once the speed is up... the model will be out of a stalled condition which is the primary cause of having entered a spin. Once out of the stall.... its easy to recover with some throttle and then easing back up the elevator.
Yes, is possible but depends on the motor thrustline, torque and/or the propeller if is a pusher or tractor. If you has a motor with a pusher configurantion the torque goes to the left, then if the spin is to the left the situation can be worst. If you has a tractor configuration the torque goes to the right is the same situation if the spin is to the right. If go out from a spin in a motorized flying wing with the motor back when you gave max throttle the propeller was rotating counter the spin rotation and acted like a rudder for the torque. When a fliying wing enter in a spin we need to recover the controls more than the speed, almost all flying wings goes in spin actitud if you exceed 70 degrees of turn and pull strong elevator, you go with speed but need more and is not a recommend maneouver in low altitude. I like the flyingfrog50 advise, is less traumatic and more efficient. Many experiences are productive and your indication is valid if we take care about the motor/propeller configuration.

Thx.-
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 05:07 PM
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PA22
about 10 years ago i built a plank to do spin testing on. Yes I am a little crazy, but if you want to KNOW something hands will teach for sure. it had spoilers that were set up as roll control, as well as ailerons, rudder, elevator and mid cord lower flaps. and different sized engines. And a spin recovery parachute. the only time that adding power was use full was when the thrust to weight ratio was above 1.5 to 1. after more than 100test flights i cut the center section apart an swept the wing back 20deg. and re ran all the tests. and plank or swept the above is the safest way to recover for a flying wing. use other methoids for other types of aircraft. to date i have built more than 30 different flying wings, some did not fly well or were great high speed but no glide. most of my wings are thermal duration or self launch gliders. scratch building flying wings i think will teach you more about the aerodynamics of flight faster than anything can. have fun and have a great next flying day
nic
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 05:30 PM
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What is the most effective strategy for getting out of a spin?

Keep it simple, back to NEUT and FULL power get you out of any spin, subj. to height.
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Old Aug 17, 2015, 07:44 PM
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that takes a lot of power what if its a glider or very small motor? how much altitude do you need? my way can recover in 1/2 a turn and in less than 10feet if you catch it early.
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Old Aug 18, 2015, 02:56 AM
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As I said, KIS! An average flier would be in such a panic that he or she wouldn't know if they are "Arthur or the Marthur" by complicating things. Forget about the gliders, I'm talking about powered models.
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