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Old Aug 01, 2012, 12:03 PM
Perfect 3pt inverted landing!
teookie's Avatar
USA, AL, Huntsville
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Dale,

Just curious, are you still using Powerlab8's to charge the batteries? Or did you find a better solution?

I'm very impressed by your project. Thank you for sharing it with us.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 02:41 PM
homo ludens modellisticus
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Artikel d.d. July 19, 2012
Record-Setting Electric Airplane Breaks 200-MPH Barrier for First Time | Autopia | Wired.com


com
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 04:38 PM
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If you´re not reading http://blog.cafefoundation.org/ you should do it. They had an article about our eLazair-idol the 16:th of July. Other interesting stuff also.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 05:58 PM
Dale
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Originally Posted by GCrafte View Post
Do you see any economic importance of electric ultralights, except for their recreational value? Will a lot of people use them for personal transportation? Will people be travelling around long distances in electric ultralights in the future? Can they deliver goods unmanned?

Will it cost a lot of money to land at various airports to charge batteries? Do you foresee a future when there will be a lot of water based places for amphibian ultralights to stop for charging of batteries and some food and rest?
Ultralights are recreational and that should be enough, don't we spend most of our discretionary money on recreation? I do not see ultralights as transportation nor that they be used unmanned.

Charging batteries should not be an issue, most people will let you borrow electrons. As long as there are people living places there should be no need for special facilities.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 06:03 PM
Dale
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Originally Posted by teookie View Post
are you still using Powerlab8's to charge the batteries? Or did you find a better solution?
We are using modified Meanwell RSP2000 chargers that output an adjustable 1000 to 2000 watts. They are CC/CV chargers since balancing is done on the BMS.

They are 5 lbs each and are 2000 watts each. Last year 4300 watts of PL8's and power supplies weighed 65 lbs.

This year we can easily carry 2 aboard while flying. That would be 4000 watts of charging as 10 lbs of luggage.
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Old Aug 01, 2012, 06:05 PM
Dale
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Originally Posted by Ron van Sommeren View Post
Record-Setting Electric Airplane Breaks 200-MPH Barrier for First Time
Everything electric is good!
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Old Aug 02, 2012, 03:21 AM
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Charging batteries should not be an issue, most people will let you borrow electrons. As long as there are people living places there should be no need for special facilities.
I thought there could be landing and starting fees that costs much more than the electricity at airports. Is it not difficult to find other places on land where you are allowed to land? In case I go down on a lake will people living around approach me so I can ask them for electricity? In Sweden houses are often not very close to the shore, due to shore control laws. Should I carry a very long cord? Or primarily stay around my own air base? Or perhaps use marinas? Perhaps I can find charging stations for electric cars which are situated close to the water?

Perhaps we can create Google maps with all the places where you can get electricity for a good price or even for free. Or one could rely on more or less secret information from other e-pilots one meets. One might also have some use for a sign saying "electricity needed" so people know why one have landed close to their property. They may have to give away some electricity to get rid of the xxxxxxx pilot!

Yet another idea would be to start a lot of electric flight clubs, preferably close to water.
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Old Aug 02, 2012, 09:30 AM
Dale
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Sounds like you will have much more of a problem charging on a cross country flight than here in the US.

I just have to point out that you would have the same issue with a gas powered airplane. At least with electric you could put solar cells on the wing to recharge, albeit with a time penalty.

Dale
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Old Aug 02, 2012, 10:26 AM
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I guess you can fly around without much problem also here in Sweden if you don´t wait too long with finding a place for charging your batteries. Most people will be very interested in the airplane so you won´t have much problem getting in contact with the property owners. You can also drive the airplane really slowly along the shore, and thus have plenty of time to connect with people.

Due to the shore control laws water front properties are very expensive in most parts of Sweden, even as we have extremely much shores. It might be a good idea if owners of amphibian electric ultralights rent places in marinas where batteries can be charged. They could help other pilots to get a battery charge. If they also have boats with cabins and beds pilots could help each other with some "couch surfing". Wouldn´t that be splendid?!
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Old Aug 06, 2012, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by GCrafte View Post
Do you see any economic importance of electric ultralights, except for their recreational value? Will a lot of people use them for personal transportation? Will people be travelling around long distances in electric ultralights in the future? Can they deliver goods unmanned?
The problem with current technologies is that batteries store very little energy for a given amount of weight compared to fossil fuels.

So while a battery can put out a lot of power for a given weight. Power = energy/time. The range of EVs are severely limited.

You can optimize for electric power. There's a lot less cooling required, so there's less cooling drag. Electric motors are more easily configured to use slow turning, large efficient props.



Dale - dumb question, but why haven't you used larger props on the eLazair?

Don

p.s. the cafe stuff is great reading. Google the name Klaus Savier. He got a vairEZ to go something like 260 mph on an O-235.
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Old Aug 06, 2012, 12:19 PM
KK4NOP
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United States, VA, Virginia Beach
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KiloOne View Post
We are using modified Meanwell RSP2000 chargers that output an adjustable 1000 to 2000 watts. They are CC/CV chargers since balancing is done on the BMS.

They are 5 lbs each and are 2000 watts each. Last year 4300 watts of PL8's and power supplies weighed 65 lbs.

This year we can easily carry 2 aboard while flying. That would be 4000 watts of charging as 10 lbs of luggage.
Did you sell all the PL8's?
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Old Aug 06, 2012, 12:21 PM
KK4NOP
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United States, VA, Virginia Beach
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donmei View Post
The problem with current technologies is that batteries store very little energy for a given amount of weight compared to fossil fuels.

So while a battery can put out a lot of power for a given weight. Power = energy/time. The range of EVs are severely limited.

You can optimize for electric power. There's a lot less cooling required, so there's less cooling drag. Electric motors are more easily configured to use slow turning, large efficient props.



Dale - dumb question, but why haven't you used larger props on the eLazair?

Don

p.s. the cafe stuff is great reading. Google the name Klaus Savier. He got a vairEZ to go something like 260 mph on an O-235.
I'm going to assume the prop size was selected to provide the best performance while keeping the Amp draw in check.
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Old Aug 06, 2012, 11:47 PM
1 test beats 10 guru opinions
ridgebackred's Avatar
Central Florida, USA
Joined Jan 2011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KiloOne View Post

Yes, I have a specific config in mind to make any fiberglass sailplane into a motorglider, patience.

Dale

A very inspiring project watching your success Dale!

I was inspired enough to do some research.
If your solution to make any fiberglass sailplane into a motorglider is similar to this, I would be interested.

The LZ design FES system is currently in production for the Italian line of Silent gliders.
http://www.front-electric-sustainer.com/


An early innovator of one-off manned electric gliders with solar cells built into the wings should also be mentioned.
http://solar-flight.com/sunseekerII/index.html

Pioneers all! Your efforts and accumulated flight hours are paving the way for the future!
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Old Aug 07, 2012, 04:42 AM
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United Kingdom, England, Stratford-upon-Avon
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Originally Posted by Mike Freas View Post
I'm going to assume the prop size was selected to provide the best performance while keeping the Amp draw in check.
Not really. A slightly heavier lower Kv motor turning a bigger prop will have a higher propulsive efficiency than a similarly efficient higher Kv motor turning a smaller prop. As the electric motor weight is a small proportion of the total aircraft weight there will generally be a duration/range increase, at the expense of a cost and weight (and structural load) increase.

Neil.
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Old Aug 07, 2012, 05:13 AM
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#580

I have a vision of being able to fly all over Europe (and also other continents) in an electric airplane. It will not save you any money if you have to pay landing fees every 100th kilometer, but might do so if you can land on rivers and lakes. There just have to be decent possibilities to recharge the batteries and also some decent solutions for sleep, food and water.

It might work right now if you´re not in a hurry and it might work even better in ten years time if the infrastructure for charging of batteries etc has improved.
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