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Old Dec 09, 2015, 08:33 PM
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Tim Lampe; Hobbico R&D
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Mini-Review
Rook F5D

For the category of this thread I clicked Mini-Review because a Rook was provided to me by Sasha Boiko who is the manufacturer. Full disclosure; in exchange, I was asked to show the Rook on the internet and share my opinions about it. I hope to show my gratitude by commenting on the Rook positively, but I also have a good reputation, so my comments will be objective. And now that I have a Rook in my hands, it looks pretty sweet, so I don’t anticipate any conflicts of interest!



I’ll be posting my progress and comments as I proceed, but first let me give you my perspective. Presently, nearly 100% of my modeling focus is on F5D in preparing new planes for the World Championships in Italy in August, 2016. At time of this writing I have five other models to build for practice this summer and the competition. Fortunately, the flying season has pretty much passed here in the Midwestern U.S., so I should have plenty of time to get most of my planes together by the time it’s warm enough to fly. (Yes, I’m a fair-weather flyer!) My Rook should fit right in as it appears it will lend itself well to either F5D or sport flying, so I’ll work it in with my other projects.

Typically, single-purpose F5D planes (like the Sergey Sobakin Avionik) are intended for one thing and one thing only; F5D pylon racing. Therefore, the fuselage size is kept to an absolute minimum to reduce weight and drag, but the result is extremely limited space for everything that has to go inside (servos, receiver, batteries, motor, ESC, Watt limiter, wires, etc.), so you must be skilled and creative to get everything to fit – especially if running a geared setup which displaces the motor further back into the cabin an additional 20 – 30mm! I’m not the world expert on F5D, but from the experience I do have and from what I’ve seen on the internet, I believe the Avionik has been the most popular plane on the international F5D circuit for a long time. But in its approximately two-year existence, I also believe the Big Bruce Racing EVO 5Dominator has closed in, if not equaled the Avionik in popularity.

When looking for a high-performance sport plane, or one that can do both (F5D and sport), it’s nice to have something a little more practical for every-day flying with a slightly larger fuselage to make it easier to fit the radio gear, motor and ESC during assembly, as well as make it easier to get the batteries in and out at the flying field. It’s also nice to be able to fit slightly larger batteries in the 2200mAh range instead of just 1800mAh or 1600mAh batteries typically used in F5D.

For example, my first F5D model was a StratAir Viper. I bought it for high-performance sport flying (after learning from a Rifle and a Sunracer), but in the back of my mind I knew the Viper was also designed for F5D. The Viper makes an excellent high-performance sport model and has enough room for 2200mah batteries (I’m talking 5S) and get them in and out of the fuselage relatively easily. For whatever reason, the Viper has fallen out of favor on the F5D circuit, but I absolutely love the way mine flies down around the course.

Incidentally, the T-tail (as on both the Viper and the Rook) is extremely convenient because the horizontal stabilizer can be unbolted for easy transport – especially if you plan to store it in a case for transportation on the air lines or a long drive.

I don’t see why the Rook wouldn’t be a capable F5D racer (I’ll know more when I get to fly it), but the combination of fuselage space and the price leads me to believe it should also be a great high-performance sport model.

On Sasha’s web site the Rook is listed for 410 Euros:

http://sinoi.net/

Today, that converts to about $450.00 USD (U.S. dollars).

UPDATE: Sasha informed me that shipping to the U.S. directly from him is about $50.00.


The Rook is also listed on the Hyperflight.co.uk web site for $429.00 USD:

http://www.hyperflight.co.uk/products.asp?code=ROOK

When I add the Rook to my basket on the Hyperflight site, then go to check-out, shipping (to the U.S.) is about $100.00. It also shows about $106.00 for VAT, but it says “VAT Deducted,” so I’m confused. But the total shows about $529.00 USD, so the VAT must not be a charge I actually pay. When I proceed all the way to the end right when I’m ready to actually finalize the transaction and click pay, the total is still only $529.00, so that must be the final price (to the U.S.) which is a great value when compared to other similar types of planes – especially when you remember that’s with shipping!

Here are a few pictures of my Rook out-of-the-box. In my next post, I’ll talk a little more about some of the details of the bare airframe and the specifications before I begin assembly.

Tim
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Old Dec 09, 2015, 08:57 PM
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Nice, Tim - looking forward to reading your review
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Old Dec 09, 2015, 10:56 PM
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Tim Lampe; Hobbico R&D
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Gordon McWilliams, right? Thanks!

Before I turn in for the evening, here are a few specs. Most of the usual figures are available on the web site, but to calculate the maximum F5D weight I got the total surface area from Sasha. He quoted 16.4 dm2. @ 65 g/dm2 for maximum FAI weight, that works out to 1066g. Of course, that's irrelevant if you're shooting for minimum weight which is 1000g.

For comparison, the maximum FAI weight for the Avionik is 1007.5g, 1051g for the Viper and 1030g for the EVO 5Dominator.

I also measured the nose of the Rook and it is 32mm for a 32mm spinner. As far as I know, most F5D models are designed for 30mm spinner, but 1mm isn't going to make much of a difference I don't think.

The wing is fastened to the fuselage with two 4mm screws. The Dominator uses three 3mm screws and the Viper and Avionik use two 3mm screws with a tab in the middle of the wing TE that is fastened to the fuselage with a couple of wraps of tape. At first the tape method seemed objectionable to me, but it's actually quite easy and fast (not as fast as a screw of course!). But the tape method with the tab also opens up the back of the wing saddle a little more for increased access to the inside.

With no third method on the Rook to secure the back of the wing to the fuse to keep it from shifting, instead, the wing sits relatively deep into the fuselage and the fairings on the top of the wing fit snugly into the fuse thus doing the job of centering the wing and keeping it from shifting. I suppose the 4mm bolts also help in this capacity.

The horizontal stab is secured to the saddle on top of the T-tail with only one screw. The Viper T-tail used two screws so the stab cannot rotate. I suppose Sasha intends some sort of removable adhesive or other method to keep the stab from rotating about the screw. He's going to email me some images and instructions, then I'll get it figured out and reveal it here.

I tentatively plan on installing my Neu 1112/2D (3250kV) inrunner with Neu P29 5.2:1 gear box and Georgi Mirov 10 x 23 folding propeller powered by a 5S LiPo for F5D performance.

Well, that's all I can think of at the moment until I get into the build.

Tim
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Old Dec 09, 2015, 11:14 PM
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yep, that's me!
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Old Dec 10, 2015, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KRProton View Post
The horizontal stab is secured to the saddle on top of the T-tail with only one screw. The Viper T-tail used two screws so the stab cannot rotate. I suppose Sasha intends some sort of removable adhesive or other method to keep the stab from rotating about the screw. ...
I'll bet Velcro would work. Life's a whole lot easier when you don't have an engine piston hammering everything at 28,000 rpm.

This looks like a cool thread, thanks for posting!

Cheers,
Duane
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Old Dec 13, 2015, 04:08 PM
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Tim Lampe; Hobbico R&D
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Hi Duane!

Nice to see you over here in the High Performance forum!

I don't think Velcro would be a great idea. The saddle part where the horizontal stabilizer sits is only about 4mm in width. And obviously the incidence of the stab is critical. For these two reasons I don't see Velcro as an answer to keep the stab from rotating. A layer of Velcro would be way too instable. Think I'll use a thin film of "removable" adhesive such as Zap Goo. Zap Goo combined with the 3mm screw will lock the stab down nicely, but if ever I need to remove the stab for transport in a box, I'll be able to take out the screw and carefully pop off the stab and peel off any residual Zap Goo.

Anyway, warm weather here in the Midewest means MORE yard work! Yesterday it was taking care of more leaves, but finally today I'm back in the work shop! I have several F5D projects going on at the same time, so the shop is rather a mess, but after my work this afternoon I put everything in its place and even got out the vacuum cleaner!

Okay, proceeding slowly, but I think I have it figured out how I want to do the radio installation and elevator servo and the elevator pushrod.

Experience with a wire-in-tube setup in my Vipers and images from Sasha set me on this path...

First I drew and laser-cut a 1st attempt at a radio tray from 1/8" lite-ply. Eventually, it will be secured with #2 button-head screws through the sides of the fuselage, but I'll get to that later.

The tube is cut to approximate length, then glued to a 1/4" balsa "wedge" that later, will be glued to the bottom of the fuselage. The pushrod is guided through the back of the fuse, then the guide tube is installed over the wire and out the back.

I had to sand the sides of the servo tray to fit precisely where I want it. When I get back to work I'll re draw the tray to the new dimensions and move the servo over a bit so the hole in the arm will be centered over the pushrod wire which will be glued to the center of the bottom of the fuselage later.

The tray has plenty of room to mount the receiver and a 200mAh 2S LiFe for Rx power.

I consider this the hardest part because of all the "figuring out," but when I'm done I'll have templates and AutoCAD drawings available.

Tim
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Old Dec 16, 2015, 11:57 PM
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Well, this is disappointing...

I got out of bed today with full intentions of going to work, but I haven't been able to devote enough time to my Rook, so I decided to take the day off. I worked from morning until night to get the fuselage all done - radio installed, motor/ESC installed, propeller mounted. I even ran the motor! I then downloaded about 80 images from my phone, ordered and resized them, and now they're gone! The files are there, but there is no image, so I don't know how the heck to recover them.

Well, here's what I have now...

Next will be the wing. Guess I'll go back and take some images of the innards, but I don't have the construction images.

Crap!

Tim
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Old Dec 17, 2015, 07:37 AM
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If it's on an android phone sometimes you can recover the sd card to collect the images.
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Old Dec 17, 2015, 09:05 AM
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I had cut and pasted the images from my phone to my pc. I then renamed and reduced all the images in Microsoft Office. As I have done hundreds of times before, I went to save the changes and that's when I lost the images. They are still all in the folder with their names and everything, there's just no image.

If I can't recover the images, I'll have to go back and take new images as much as I can, but now the fuse is already together, so there won't be any assembly process images.

Tim
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Old Dec 17, 2015, 08:33 PM
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Well I came home tonight to just to take a few new images of yesterday's work where I lost all my images last night. The Rook has plenty of space for easy installation of the radio and motor - even with a gear drive. I have templates for the screw holes in the side of the fuse for fastening the radio tray and for the motor mount screw holes.

For F5D you want to run 5S. I've been using 1800mAh in my direct drive setups, but may go down to like 1600mAh for geared to save weight. We pull never more than 1200mAh out of a race anyway.

Over the weekend I'll remove the radio tray so you can get a look at that with the battery and receiver. I even decided to mount an on/off switch which is unusual for an F5D plane because there is never room.

MAYBE, just MAYBE I can get it airborne this weekend.

Tim
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Old Dec 18, 2015, 11:31 AM
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Please, what esc are you using?
And what have you put around it?
Is the propeller a carbon prop?
And, sorry, last question, is the lipo a 3S plus 2S?
Thanks a lot.
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Old Dec 18, 2015, 06:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sescot_ View Post
Please, what esc are you using?
And what have you put around it?
Is the propeller a carbon prop?
And, sorry, last question, is the lipo a 3S plus 2S?
Thanks a lot.
Hello sescot.

The ESC is Castle Creations Edge Lite 75:
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&I=LXDBBL&P=ML

The heat sink has been removed.

The material over the ESC and wires is Abrasion-Resistant Fabric Heat-Shrink Tubing. 1.18" I.D. before shrinking:

http://www.mcmaster.com/#heat-shrink-tubing/=10aq28s

The propeller is Georgi Mirov 10 x 23 carbon fiber folding propeller for 6mm shaft, 30mm spinner from Soaring USA:

http://www.soaringusa.com/GM-10x23-30mm-6.html

Yes, the LiPo is Dinogy brand 2S + 3S 1800mAh 65C:

http://dinogylipos.com/3-cell-65c/45-1800mah-3s-65c
http://dinogylipos.com/2-cell-65c/24-1800mah-2s-65c

I use Castle Creations 5.5mm bullet connectors:
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXTJH9&P=7

The female connector on the - lead on the 3S battery is 6mm to fit the Neu F5D Watt Limiter:

http://neumotors.cartloom.com/shop/item/24376

The old-version limiter is shown on the Neu site. The new limiter is pictured below.

Let me know if you have any more questions.

Tim
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Old Dec 19, 2015, 07:01 AM
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WOW! Very exhaustiv, thanks!

Why have you removed the heat sink? Space?
The propeller is the state of the art (as it's price!)
Obviously a single pack 5s doesn't fit inside, true?
I don't know the limiter current, now I'm going to search something about it.
I'm a newbie, I'm flying a Mini Hawk, and I like this plane
Thank you!
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Old Dec 19, 2015, 07:40 AM
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Hi sescot.

Please tell me your name so I may address you properly.

Yes, I remove the heat sink purely for space considerations. I doubt Castle Creations would endorse that, but I do it all the time! In racing, the plane draws only about 70A and we fly full-throttle entirely which is also not as demanding on the ESC as is modulating the throttle. Plus, a race is only about one minute, so no problem for the ESC.

Actually though, there is enough room in the Rook to leave the heat sink in place.

Yes, I don't think a single 5S pack would fit. But a 2S + 3S 2200mAh pack would fit for sport flying and longer (and faster) flights - about 2 minutes full throttle.

For sport flying, and for simplicity and economy, I would recommend Neu 1115/2.5D (2100kV) on 5S with APC 5.25 x 6.25 propeller. 200mph!

http://www.espritmodel.com/neu-1115-...es-motors.aspx

This is also good for F5D racing, but with slightly smaller prop and 1800mAh battery.

Or, you can go 4S 2700mAh (single pack) with 5.25 x 6.25 for first flights - still 170 - 180mph I believe. Then, go to 5S later.

The Watt limiter is for F5D racing only - not needed for sport flying!

Tim
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Old Dec 19, 2015, 09:00 AM
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Hi Tim, I'm Sergio, nice to meet you!

I'm using 5.25x6.25 too on my Mini Hawk with 2200 kV (HK motor).
I don't like smallest propeller, too difficult to launch by myself.
With 5S not always at full throttle it runs for 3 minutes more 2 minutes to land It wants a long space and I'm not a good lander
Until now i have not put the gps logger inside but sure it's less than 300kph.
And yes, for me it's only sport flying, nothing more, I love speed on helicopter too.
I like a lot the Mini Hawk for the canopy, it's not necessary to unscrew the wing every flight to change the lipo, but I've seen that it's an exception.

This Rook is very nice, and I'm reading your review with a lot of interest, thanks.
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