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Old Feb 21, 2012, 06:24 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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I am going to give FF rubber try

I am going to give FF a try. I fly RC and it is a totally different word, since I can pretty much force the plane to fly. I was thinking if I could build a FF plane and learn to trim it correctly then I could carry some of that knowledge over to my RC and other FF projects.
The plane I bought to start with is a Dumas Piper J-4E Cub, walnut scale.
I should have came here and asked before I purchased but I have it now.

My only experience with FF has been many years ago when I was in Germany. I bought a Graupner FF kit for a Cox .049. A German modeler helped me build it and set it up. It would ROG and make a big left turning circle and as the engine died it would straighten out and make a gradual turn to the right, was very nice. This is all I can remember about it but hope to build planes that will do the same whether rubber power, glow, or electric.

http://carstensbookstore.com/rupomoaibydo.html

I ordered this book and hope you guys can give me more resources for a successful build.
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Old Feb 21, 2012, 07:24 PM
RC Connectors dot com
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United States, CO, Colorado Springs
Joined Jan 2008
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That is a good book. Here are a couple other very popular standards...

Lew Gitlow - Indoor Flying models
Ron Williams - Building and Flying Indoor model airplanes

I was going to say "go look up the MMM club in Denver" but see you're too far West, unless you're up that way often. We have indoor FF down here in the Springs too.

I've been thru your town, but only on my Goldwing.

Lots of friendly help here, you've found a good place.

Might want to peruse smallflyingarts.com and hippocketbuilders.com too. Not to take away from here, just giving you other good options.

Glenn
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Old Feb 21, 2012, 08:14 PM
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Gold Coast Australia.
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Build your Piper and have fun, but may I suggest after that, build a Senator for a really simple to build but very good flying rubber model

Senator plans are on the web, just do a search. It's 32in. span flat. 30in when you put the tip dihedral into the wing.

Ask here or SFA or HPB and there will be plenty of guys, and even a girl come in to help.
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Old Feb 21, 2012, 08:35 PM
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The 'Wack, BC, Canada
Joined Oct 2002
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While you're building that Piper kit consider making up and flying a simple all balsa hand or catapult launched glider. Simple, enjoyable and the trimming you'll learn from it will give you a big head start on the other models.
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Old Feb 21, 2012, 09:04 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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Thanks for the info guys, really appreciate it.

Glen2626, I get down to the Springs every couple/Three months, maybe if you wouldn't mind you can give me a heads up when you are having an event. I would like to try to make it down. Also, next time you are through on you GW let me know. I'll pull my bike out and cover some asphalt with you.

Ace
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Old Feb 22, 2012, 10:54 AM
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Atlanta, GA USA
Joined Sep 2001
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Be careful! Free flight rubber can be VERY addictive!

My advice is to start with something guaranteed to fly well and not difficult to build. Once you have something in the air and have it fly well you can begin tweeking to get better performance. Below are a few 'guaranteed to fly well" favorites of mine. And don't let the Phantom Fury fool you. It can compete any day with the best P-30 competition planes.

Planeman
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Old Feb 22, 2012, 10:55 PM
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Don Ross (no relation) has some books out about rubber powered model planes. The best one for rubber scale, though, is hard to find, though. It's called Making Scale Model Airplanes Fly, by William McCombs. You need a magnifying glass to read it, but it has huge amounts of useful info. The Ron Williams book is also a masterpiece, but is mostly focused on indoor duration. If that appeals to you, then a limited penny plane might be a real eye opener. I helped a beginner get 5 minutes with his in a gym!

I suspect that your Dumas kit may fly ok over long grass outside. Most models built from kits will be a bit heavy if you don't substitute some of the wood, as it's a lot of trouble to sort the wood into different weights.

I agree that a sport model may be instructive. In order of difficulty:

-Sig Thermal Dart (larger and flies better than AMA Cub, etc.)
-Dick Baxter's Pussycat. (you can find the Big Pussycat on line and I'm guessing it's almost as easy and flies better)
-Golden Age Reproductions Pacific Ace Jim's kits have good materials, but they are print wood, which means you have to cut the parts out yourself.
-The Guillows Javelin isn't too hard to make fly right, and the price is right too. On mine, I went to a larger propellor. Would do about a minute. But perhaps they now make the kit with lignum vitae instead of the oak they used when I built mine, years ago. (They claim it's balsa!)
---
scale:
-Golden Age Spartan Cabin flies well, though it has a bunch of struts. Perhaps one of the other high wing models would be easier. Suggest nothing smaller than 20 inches, though.
-My first really successful rubber scale model was a Seversky S-2, adapted from the Golden Age Seversky P-35. However, it was pretty hard to trim at first.
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Old Feb 22, 2012, 10:59 PM
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P.S. Another good sport model is the Flying Aces Twin Pusher:
http://www.outerzone.co.uk/plan_details.asp?ID=2376

As you can see, it's a very simple model. If you're ok with a sanding block, then it's an easy project, except for making propellers, which you pretty much have to do, since they rotate in opposite directions. Making propellors isn't that awful, however. Pick light wood for the wings. Mine was easy to trim and got about 90 seconds. Outdoors only, it's not light.
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Old Feb 23, 2012, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PROACE View Post
Glen2626, I get down to the Springs every couple/Three months, maybe if you wouldn't mind you can give me a heads up when you are having an event. I would like to try to make it down.
Ace - here's a list of our dates. It's really not an 'event', just very informal indoor FF. There may be a dozen guys flying, or just two or three.

http://www.rc-connectors.com/index.p...age=page&id=17

If you want an 'event', then here's a link to the MMM guys from Denver, look for when they have their competition down in the Springs, called the "Pikes Peak Ceiling Climb", it was just a few weeks ago unfortunately.

http://www.themmmclub.com/
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Old Feb 23, 2012, 05:21 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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I will try to make it down before summer break. Thks
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Old Feb 24, 2012, 12:29 AM
Gasbags & Gussets
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Riverside, Ca
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Two resources to help with your journey

Quote:
Originally Posted by PROACE View Post
I am going to give FF a try. I fly RC and it is a totally different word, since I can pretty much force the plane to fly. I was thinking if I could build a FF plane and learn to trim it correctly then I could carry some of that knowledge over to my RC and other FF projects.
...............and hope you guys can give me more resources for a successful build.
In addition to all the fine advice above, book you have, and cottage FF suppliers listed, i want
to recomend BMJR FF model supply and a2zcorp. They both have been in the FF business for supplies and kits for a long time. I have had 100% satisfaction with their products.

http://www.bmjrmodels.com/

http://www.a2zcorp.us/store/

have fun, john s.
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Old Mar 01, 2012, 09:34 PM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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Thanks for all the information, I really appreciate it. I got the book "rubber power model airplanes" in the mail today! When I ordered it the confirmation email said it would take six weeks. What a great surprise.
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Old Mar 02, 2012, 12:36 AM
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Here is a link to a plan of Chet Bukowski's "Flailing Arrow":
http://tinyurl.com/6noymvn
I've seen him fly it, and it goes very nicely, and it's simple. You'd have to fudge in the other ribs, I think, unless I missed something. To form the propeller blades by the "Can method", you soak them in water , attach to a 5 inch diameter (coffee??) can by wrapping with cloth strips or similar, and leave overnight to dry, or cook at a moderate temperature in your oven for a while. You might want to make some fake ones with cardboard until you are sure you are making them with the right orientation. The front prop is NOT the same as the rear.
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Old Mar 02, 2012, 08:16 AM
Rocky Mountain High and Higher
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Cool, got it! Might be fun to try.
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Old Mar 12, 2012, 12:32 AM
Let it Be
USA, WI, Oshkosh
Joined Jul 2004
309 Posts
I'm relativley new to fre flight, having flown RC for 15 years or more. I've tried Dumas kits, but I prefer kits from "Easy Built". They are simpler to build, and end up lighter than Dumas kits.

Here's a link to their web site: http://www.easybuiltmodels.com/

Their wood is great. Many of the kits are now laser cut. Prices are much more reasonable than Dumas. Construction and plans are simpler. Great variety too.

See our club web site for a lot of indoor free flight (and RC) flying at:
http://www.wrcf.rchomepage.com/Videos/VideoPage.htm

The 3rd video down has some of my Easy Built kits flying.

Have fun.

Dave
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