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Old Aug 18, 2012, 02:49 PM
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West Yorkshire, UK
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Blade XL Carbon Crash - Spektrum AR6255

It has not been a good day.

I'd flown my scale DG303 fine with no problems at all.

I then flew my trusty old Blade XL Carbon and that was fine too. Landed (smoothly) had a rest and up she went again. About 15 minutes into the flight the model suddenly stopped responding and locked into a spiral bank earthbound. I checked my TX aerial position and it was fine. I tried lifting the TX high too but with no success. It built up speed and the model crashed into a wooded area quite a distance away and at quite a speed. Me and a mate went looking for it but with no success and it's still there somewhere. There is very thick vegetation and it's very wooded and I suspect the noise I heard when it crashed was from a tree. I'll have another look tomorrow but I'm certain I'm just searching for wreckage.

The model used a Spektrum AR6255 and once or twice in the past I suspect there has been a momentary loss of signal however control has always been very quickly regained. Nothing has ever been indicated on the receiver light either.

The transmitter seems to work fine on all my other models although I have always had doubts about the other carbon glider in my hanger.
My conclusion is that I can't now trust Spektrum with carbon models and I'm therefore going to have a rethink about which system I use for my gliders.
I always wanted Spektrum for the Model Match facility but I think I can live without that just for the peace of mind.

Dave
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Old Aug 18, 2012, 03:39 PM
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Moira
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skirmish View Post
It has not been a good day.

I'd flown my scale DG303 fine with no problems at all.

I then flew my trusty old Blade XL Carbon and that was fine too. Landed (smoothly) had a rest and up she went again. About 15 minutes into the flight the model suddenly stopped responding and locked into a spiral bank earthbound. I checked my TX aerial position and it was fine. I tried lifting the TX high too but with no success. It built up speed and the model crashed into a wooded area quite a distance away and at quite a speed. Me and a mate went looking for it but with no success and it's still there somewhere. There is very thick vegetation and it's very wooded and I suspect the noise I heard when it crashed was from a tree. I'll have another look tomorrow but I'm certain I'm just searching for wreckage.

The model used a Spektrum AR6255 and once or twice in the past I suspect there has been a momentary loss of signal however control has always been very quickly regained. Nothing has ever been indicated on the receiver light either.

The transmitter seems to work fine on all my other models although I have always had doubts about the other carbon glider in my hanger.
My conclusion is that I can't now trust Spektrum with carbon models and I'm therefore going to have a rethink about which system I use for my gliders.
I always wanted Spektrum for the Model Match facility but I think I can live without that just for the peace of mind.

Dave
Sorry to hear it Dave.

I have always been sceptical about spectrum. During the US DS tip, There was talk about spectrum users having the get the new system, because the older one was just not working there.

I have gone for Jeti. Because that way I am buying into a receiver system for the future not a receiver and transmitter. They make modules for all transmitters, and can also be used via the buddy lead. I also like the fact that battery and signal come as standard telemetry.

The other I would consider is the Hitec A9. Best value for money if you need to go the whole hog. check there receiver deals, if memory serves you can buy a box of 4 for really good value.

Will
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Old Aug 18, 2012, 05:55 PM
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West Yorkshire, UK
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Can someone please advise when the AR6255 was deemed by Spektrum to be only suitable for DLG and Hand Launch gliders?
When I had the AR6250 the instructions of the installation showed images of a large moulded glider. My AR6250 was returned to Spektrum after the problem with them and they then replaced them with AR6255's. Was it therefore not correct to presume that those would be suitable for the same type of models as shown in the AR6250 instructions?
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Old Aug 18, 2012, 06:56 PM
Bro
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Ar6255

Dave,

I use 9300 or 9310 in the carbon models. The 6255 are ok in smaller but the big models, more is better! If there is room, I go big!..
The 9300s are cheap right now too till they sell them out.

Sorry for the loss... I do have a 9300 in my Blade XL that is now 8 years old.


Best,
Bob
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Old Aug 18, 2012, 08:30 PM
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Carlsbad, CA
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skirmish

Sorry for your loss.

What kind of battery did you use, where were the antennas mounted, did you use a flight logger to check you installation (number of antenna fades left and right, frame losses and holds) or any other info. This might help find the root cause of the crash.

I've been flying a new to me Espada R (carbon fuse, wings) with a 6255, 5 cell nimh 1500 mah battery pack with the wiskers exiting the fuse under the canopy about 1 inch aft of the forward most portion on the canopy opening. I have a flight logger installed and have never received a frame loss or hold. One antenna has never has a fade and the other antenna has recorded <10 fades once or twice. I've flown this setup only at Torrey Pines with about 25 flights so far.
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 12:27 AM
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The only thing my Spektrum DX8 gets used for now is the sim. I'm all about Futaba now; works every time, all the time.
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 01:08 AM
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Might be time to consider a FrSky upgrade. Best system out there and very good pricing. No need for "carbon" fuse receivers, that is just a marketing attempt from Spektrum. (Hey, lets put a longer antenna on it and charge them a bunch more for it...)

If a radio does not have RSSI these days, it is not doing all it can for you! Why wait for a crash to tell you of a problem? RSSI will sound an alarm that your signal strength at the plane is becoming an issue!! (You can also monitor your receiver voltage, no more guessing if it is time to land.) These features are built into all FrSky telemetry receivers, and they cost about $25 or less.
http://www.alofthobbies.com/radio-ge...ry-system.html

-Wayne
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 12:48 PM
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Bummer, sorry to hear that Dave .

But, are you 100% correct in identifying the Rx as the cause?
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 01:35 PM
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Yes indeed.

The fact that I've had these momentary lock outs seems to suggest that. I have actually located the model but was unable to retrieve it. I'm going to have another go soon.
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 05:31 PM
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Rescued the Blade tonight and it's quite a mess. Having said that I'll review things in the morning as sometimes these things look worse at the time of the incident.

Everything was still working with the receiver indicating three flashes on the LED. I suspect all servos will still be working and obviously the receiver is! Anyone want to buy .............? Ah, suppose I'd better not!!!

My trust of Spektrum with carbon has gone though so I need to work round that problem somehow.
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Old Aug 19, 2012, 05:58 PM
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Dave, sorry about your misshap.
Graupners Hott system has model match, and telemetry built in the receivers.
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Old Aug 20, 2012, 09:42 AM
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Please post a pic of your antenna installation so we know what to avoid.
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Old Aug 20, 2012, 10:26 AM
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Did you have the antenna sticking out from the fuse? Whiskers?
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Old Aug 20, 2012, 10:37 AM
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Well I've stripped the model of the RC gear now so can't really take a photo.

Basically though the Blade has a sheath nose which makes the receiver installation a little trick. I had it mounted on top of the integral ballast tube and then the antenna whiskers exit the fuselage sides around 40mm in front of the leading edge of the wing and about 20mm below the leading edge. They were angled back at 45 degrees (as in the instructions.)
I did try and have a good length of whisker sticking out as my concern has always been the potential masking by the carbon in the fus and wing. Unfortunately though that also allows them to be blown back, especially when the air speed increases.

It's amazing that I never had a problem with this model and 35MHz and supposedly newer and better technology throws up new problems.

I'm not ruling out using a different system but I do have quite a lot of models so changing a lot of receivers is not something I wouldn't really want to do unless the receiver cost was reasonable. For that reason I do wonder about the Futaba Fasst system that allows the use of the FRSky receivers as well as the Futabas. I would like telemetry though too and obviously this is missing from Futaba's spec at the moment.
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Old Aug 20, 2012, 11:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skirmish View Post
It's amazing that I never had a problem with this model and 35MHz and supposedly newer and better technology throws up new problems.

I'm not ruling out using a different system but I do have quite a lot of models so changing a lot of receivers is not something I wouldn't really want to do unless the receiver cost was reasonable. For that reason I do wonder about the Futaba Fasst system that allows the use of the FRSky receivers as well as the Futabas. I would like telemetry though too and obviously this is missing from Futaba's spec at the moment.
2.4 really hates carbon, metal, trees, and other large masses. The old frequency radios are more robust with these issues, but that is about the only strength the old systems have.

Give the FrSky system a try.. Heck, if you want to, you should be able to convert your current Spektrum radio, so no need to reprogram all your planes. Just instal the RF module and swap the receivers. All programming stays the same. You will loose model match, but you will gain a lot more! Most important for carbon pilots will be the long antenna lengths you can swap onto the receivers, up to 600mm, and the RSSI that warns you of poor RF performance. I much rather get a warning than a crash into the forest.

FrSky is quickly becoming popular at glider competitions for a reason, and they don't sponsor any of them. The system is that good!

You will be happy you made the change!

-Wayne

p.s. Feel free to ask if you have any questions for concerns about FrSky.
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